Alternator vs. Generator

Marshall57 said:
Completely stock cars have traveled successfully for years and so it certainly can be done, but there is no reason to abstain from true improvement.


I would just make sure what you're doing actually does improve your Model A and the end result is what you bargained for, not just a trade-off from one problem for another.
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Very well-said.

:cool:
 
MrTube said:
Or, if you don't wish to overcomplicate it you.

1. richen fuel mixture slightly and turn on key.
2. retard spark fully
3. pull choke out.
4. step on clutch and step on starter while letting go of choke.
5. adjust fuel mixture and timing by taste.
Eh, for me 5 steps is enough. ;)

I do not shut the fuel off every time I get out if the "A" is going to be driven a lot. I also don't put it in neutral to start it. You also don't really need to adjust the generator, and you certainly don't have to if you use Tom's EVR.
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Mr. Tube

You have 10 steps, but five sentences, is it not the fun of it. Adjusting the generator is just part of the Model “A”. Once you have it down it becomes part of the ambiance.


Paul
 
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30ccpickup said:
Mr. Tube

You have five 10 steps, but five sentences, is it not the fun of it. Adjusting the generator is just part of the Model “A”. Once you have it down it becomes part of the ambiance.


Paul
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Oh!

I always wondered why out "A" doesn't have any ambiance.. I need to adjust the generator :p

Will it also improve the Feng shui?
 
There are advantages and disadvantages to both the generator and alternator. HOWEVER, no matter what you decide, you ultimate just want to keep the battery charged up. If you don't like the generator/alternator on your car now, its not that expensive to swap it and it's a 10 minute job.
 
tamagrouchy said:
There are advantages and disadvantages to both the generator and alternator. HOWEVER, no matter what you decide, you ultimate just want to keep the battery charged up. If you don't like the generator/alternator on your car now, its not that expensive to swap it and it's a 10 minute job.
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Since I keep hearing this I would love to hear the disadvantages of an alternator vs a generator because there is not a single one I can think of.

Some people on here seem to preach DC generators more then even Thomas Edison did.
 
MrTube said:
Since I keep hearing this I would love to hear the disadvantages of an alternator vs a generator because there is not a single one I can think of.

Some people on here seem to preach DC generators more then even Thomas Edison did.
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Well, two things I have heard:

1 ) A "one-wire" Delcotron will drain the battery if the vehicle sits for long periods without being run.

2) An alternator will not charge a completely flat-dead battery; there must be a little juice there to excite the field windings ?


Neither circumstance would prevent me from using an alternator...
 
Special Coupe Frank said:
Well, two things I have heard:

1 ) A "one-wire" Delcotron will drain the battery if the vehicle sits for long periods without being run.

2) An alternator will not charge a completely flat-dead battery; there must be a little juice there to excite the field windings ?


Neither circumstance would prevent me from using an alternator...
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#1 is correct however, #2 is not. If you spin the alternator fast enough it will restore its own field without a battery. I believe this is around 3K rpm rotor speed which I think the "A" should be able to achieve. Not sure though. Believe it or not but this can actually be designed out of the alternator. I forget why automotive alternators have issues with creating a field.
 
This thread is as big or bigger than the oil controversy.. When it comes right down to it, a good generator with Tom's EVR is as bullet-proof, maintenance-free and as reliable as you can get.. And, it just looks right.. Oh, and an alternator will not charge when a battery is completely flat.. When a jumper battery has been used though, usually enough juice has been transferred to feed the field..
 
Patrick L. said:
This thread is as big or bigger than the oil controversy.. When it comes right down to it, a good generator with Tom's EVR is as bullet-proof, maintenance-free and as reliable as you can get.. And, it just looks right.. Oh, and an alternator will not charge when a battery is completely flat.. When a jumper battery has been used though, usually enough juice has been transferred to feed the field..
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Sorry Patrick but you are wrong. You can get an alternator to establish its own field without an outside power source. Its a fact not a theory, read my above post.
 
MrTube said:
Sorry Patrick but you are wrong. You can get an alternator to establish its own field without an outside power source. Its a fact not a theory, read my above post.
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Well I dunno. After reading this and on a whim because it was handy, I just tried testing your comment by taking two jumper wires coming off of a Delco alternator and spinning the pulley nut with an air impact while connected to a dead 6 volt battery, and I gave up after spinning it at a high rate for well over a minute. For grins, I connected the alternator to a different battery and immediately the Alternator energized as evidenced by a screwdriver sticking by magnatisim to the welch plug covering the stator bearing opposite of the pulley. Maybe if I had let the alternator spin for an hour or two while connected to the dead battery things would have been different but I wasn't that motivated. And, maybe because this is a self-exciting regulator that it wouldn't energize without current?? All I can say is that this alternator I had would not create enough energy to start producing a charging current when connected to a totally dead battery. Maybe other's experiences are different??

/
 
BRENT in 10-uh-C said:
Well I dunno. After reading this and on a whim because it was handy, I just tried testing your comment by taking two jumper wires coming off of a Delco alternator and spinning the pulley nut with an air impact while connected to a dead 6 volt battery, and I gave up after spinning it at a high rate for well over a minute. For grins, I connected the alternator to a different battery and immediately the Alternator energized as evidenced by a screwdriver sticking by magnatisim to the welch plug covering the stator bearing opposite of the pulley. Maybe if I had let the alternator spin for an hour or two while connected to the dead battery things would have been different but I wasn't that motivated. And, maybe because this is a self-exciting regulator that it wouldn't energize without current?? All I can say is that this alternator I had would not create enough energy to start producing a charging current when connected to a totally dead battery. Maybe other's experiences are different??

/
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Brent, of course there is always a chance I could be wrong I always leave that as an option. However, as I stated I believe on an automotive alternator you need a spindle speed of around 3000 rpm. Do you feel you were able to achieve this? I wouldn't expect an air impact gun to spin that fast.

I could also be wrong in that maybe you need 3000rpm crank speed which would mean a far higher spindle speed on the alternator.

Essentially the deal is the alternator will self excite from residual magnatism which is left over from being used previously. Because this magnetism is obviously low you need to spin the rotor much faster to produce some output.
 
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You know Mr Tube, it appears you might know some about theory,but, not real mechanics.. It seems to me we around and around about points voltage a while back.. I've been making a living at this stuff all my life and an alternator will not work on its own.. I've tried to get them to charge on dead systems for far too long and have had to come up with a couple tricks to get them charging so the vehicle could be driven back to the shop for repairs and they all have had to with suppling field power..I've had a lot more alternators apart than generators.. I'm not about to go out and spin one at that speed to try it, cuz, I don't think it'll work at that speed either and one of the main reasons for alternators is there amount of output at low speeds..I'm not about to spin an alternator on a model A at those speeds or a Model A engine at those speeds for anything.. I was going to suggest you actually try it,but, Brent already did and posted about it.. He's right too.. So, there it is and I'm not saying another thing on this matter, I'm done with it..
 
Patrick L. said:
You know Mr Tube, it appears you might know some about theory,but, not real mechanics.. It seems to me we around and around about points voltage a while back.. I've been making a living at this stuff all my life and an alternator will not work on its own.. I've tried to get them to charge on dead systems for far too long and have had to come up with a couple tricks to get them charging so the vehicle could be driven back to the shop for repairs and they all have had to with suppling field power..I've had a lot more alternators apart than generators.. I'm not about to go out and spin one at that speed to try it, cuz, I don't think it'll work at that speed either and one of the main reasons for alternators is there amount of output at low speeds..I'm not about to spin an alternator on a model A at those speeds or a Model A engine at those speeds for anything.. I was going to suggest you actually try it,but, Brent already did and posted about it.. He's right too.. So, there it is and I'm not saying another thing on this matter, I'm done with it..
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I'm sorry you feel that way Patrick. I do not recall discussing point voltage with you, not sure what there is to discuss?

If you read my above post, I said the residual magnatism is low therefore you need to spin the rotor fast to get it to self excite. I did not say alternators have low output at low rpm.

On a side note, 120V-220V AC generators are alternators and self excite no problem.
I am not a mechanic for a living, I am an eletronic technition for a living and have gone to school for refrigeration.

Though I am not a mechanic I feel I do pretty well on the Model A with help from the great people from Fordbarn. I get by with a little help from my friends :)

Suppose theres nothing more I can add either.
 
BRENT in 10-uh-C said:
OK, I'll throw some popcorn from the cheap seats in the balcony....
LOL.gif


Generally I find people who cannot work on, --or don't understand the workings of a Generator use/install an Alternator to take the place of the non-working Generator. Naturally it is a person's car to do with however they please but alternators go on modern vehicles (--or street rods) and generators belong on restored cars or traditional hot rods. ;)

.
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Amen.
 
joltesvig said:
my 31 coupe i got last spring came with an alternator on it. Now i don't know much since i'm as i'm a model a rookie but why would it have an alternator rather than a generator? Don't the original generators work very good? If i don't show for points is it ok to just leave it that way? Is there a disadvantage to having an alternator? How much did it cost someone to do that? If i bought it to just have fun driving should i just leave it that way?
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yes. ;)
 
BRENT in 10-uh-C said:
Ummmm, not really a true statement. They are available for about $400.
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I don't know what kind of quality that is, but the ones I looked at online were close to $1k. Definately not saying I don't believe you Brent, I'm just reporting on what I've seen. I'm sure there are all different kinds in many different price rangers.
 
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