Throttle Linkage '57 E-code Passenger Car

[russonator]

Can somebody please post a picture of what the throttle linkage is supposed to look like on a '57 e-code passenger car? Examples I've found are all T'bird which differs substantially. The set-up on my project car looks jerry-rigged at best.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1KuKFInYX4DbUP7cDiDJUzi9PLalDCiQA/view?usp=sharing

Background here is that the engine won't idle below 1000 rpm with the idle screws turned all the way out. Thought I'd start with correcting the linkage, then move on to checking for possible vacuum leak. Suggestions welcome.

Thanks in advance,
Russ

 

[scicala]

Are you sure the chokes are 100% open and you're not still on the fast idle cam on the other side of the carbs ? There is a seperate speed screw there for cold fast idle adjustment.

Sal

 

[KULTULZ]

See if this blows up enough to cipher -

 

[russonator]

Are you sure the chokes are 100% open and you're not still on the fast idle cam on the other side of the carbs ? There is a seperate speed screw there for cold fast idle adjustment.

Sal

Thanks, Sal. I was really hoping that was the issue too, but sadly chokes are fully open and fast idle screws all the way out.

 

[russonator]

See if this blows up enough to cipher -

Very helpful, thanks. The good news (or bad, depending on how you look at it) is that's essentially the setup I have. May I ask what manual you cropped that from?

 

[KULTULZ]

Very helpful, thanks. The good news (or bad, depending on how you look at it) is that's essentially the setup I have. May I ask what manual you cropped that from?

Sure, the 1949-59 FORD MASTER PARTS CATALOG.

FORD had a manual for the F-CODE, I am not sure about the E-CODE. There had to be at the least a SERVICE LETTER on setting one up.

 

[scicala]

Thanks, Sal. I was really hoping that was the issue too, but sadly chokes are fully open and fast idle screws all the way out.

I assume yours is a manual trans, if it resembles the picture KULTULZ posted.
I know the auto trans pass car E code used a bellcrank on the manifold too.

Don't know what to say about your high idle speed if you're sure all 8 throttle plates are closed fully. I've set these up before, and I got an idle speed of about 600 RPM with the speed screws on both carbs in about 3/4 turn from seated throttle plates.
Vacuum leak somewhere like carb bases, intake manifold gasket or power brake vacuum line or diaphragm ?

Sal

 

[russonator]

Sal - I didn't mention it but mine is for Fordomatic. Do you recall where the bellcrank sits on the manifold? Or maybe KULTULZ has a diagram for the automatic variation. I can vouch for the chokes being open. How do I check for throttle plates fully closed?
Thanks,
Russ

 

[paul2748]

Have you tried it with the linkage between the carbs disconnected? Sometimes the linkage can screw things up.


Just thinking - I assume the manifold has the two bolt holes in the back left side. I would assume that from the gas pedal to the manifold linkage would be the same as any Fordo car. It would seem that you would have to get this linkage, which mounts on the intake and has provision for the kick down. A pic what you have now may give more clues for suggestions.


In reality, the linkage for a sedan should not be that much different than a Tbird. That is what I have found, but never seen the E car linkage on a sedan

 

[scicala]

Sal - I didn't mention it but mine is for Fordomatic. Do you recall where the bellcrank sits on the manifold? Or maybe KULTULZ has a diagram for the automatic variation. I can vouch for the chokes being open. How do I check for throttle plates fully closed?
Thanks,
Russ

As paul2748 said, a good place to start is to diaconnect the link between the carbs incase it's holding one throttle open.
You can see in the picture you posted where a bellcrank is bolted to the manifold. Pretty sure the bellcrank is different for the E code. Felix Natoli used to make them. Talking to him might help.
It would be very odd, but if one or some of the throttle plates in your carbs are cocked or not seating, that could cause the high idle speed. You would have to remove the carbs to see.

Sal

 

[cousinjd]

You also might check if vac advance has carb vac and not full manifold vac. Just a thought. Jim

 

[KULTULZ]

I didn't mention it but mine is for Fordomatic. Do you recall where the bellcrank sits on the manifold? Or maybe KULTULZ has a diagram for the automatic variation.

Here 'ya go -

What type of vehicle is this in? What TRANS are you using?

 

[russonator]

What type of vehicle is this in? What TRANS are you using?

This is a '57 Fairlane 500 Club Sedan with Fordomatic.

Thanks for the latest diagrams.
Russ

 

[KULTULZ]

I am not over-riding Sal here, but that linkage(s) have been MICKEY MOUSED. Maybe remove all and see how she idles.

Now I have read from others that the biggest problem is the secondary plates out of adjustment or hanging and when the secondary's are opened failure to close properly.

 

[scicala]

I am not over-riding Sal here, but that linkage(s) have been MICKEY MOUSED. Maybe remove all and see how she idles.

Now I have read from others that the biggest problem is the secondary plates out of adjustment or hanging and when the secondary's are opened failure to close properly.

I agree, the linkage looks a little hokey. Someone hooked a return spring to front carb secondary throttle lever, and by the position of the secondary lever on the rear carb, it appears to be opened slightly.
Push the secondary levers closed by hand and see if the idle slows down.
If someone put in lighter springs on the secondary diaphragms, there is a chance thay are too weak to close the plates, but manifold vacuum should close them too, since the throttle shafts are off center for that reason.

Sal

 

[russonator]

Further investigation reveals I have the correct bellcrank (which is E-code specific). Linkage rods are also correct, but springs are all garbage. Along the way, I discovered that the Fordo setup should have a dashpot on the front carb (rear on T'bird), and have acquired one on ePay. Stay tuned.
Russ

 

[scicala]

Yes, 2x4's with the Fordomatic used a dashpot on one carb. That's the only reason front and rear carbs have different part numbers. Carbs are otherwise identical.
Unless your after 100% correct, the dashpot isn't really necesary in my opinion.

Sal

 

[Daves55Sedan]

Unless your after 100% correct, the dashpot isn't really necessary in my opinion. Sal

The dashpot is an anti-stall device as well as protecting the counterclockwise side of the converter hub dogs from developing grooves from the sudden reduction in engine rpms. If at all possible, I recommend having the dashpot on all Fordomatic equipped cars.

 

[KULTULZ]

The dashpot is an anti-stall device as well as protecting the counterclockwise side of the converter hub dogs from developing grooves from the sudden reduction in engine rpms. If at all possible, I recommend having the dashpot on all Fordomatic equipped cars.

Well Said ...

 

[russonator]

The dashpot is an anti-stall device as well as protecting the counterclockwise side of the converter hub dogs from developing grooves from the sudden reduction in engine rpms. If at all possible, I recommend having the dashpot on all Fordomatic equipped cars.

I couldn't agree more, Dave. In fact my primary motivation is to protect those converter hub dogs. After all, when idling at a thousand rpms, stalling out is just about the last thing you're worried about.