Removing Distributor

[Benson]

In post 29 I see the timing gear failed.

Did you clean the oil pump screen afterwards?

Chunks of the gear will clog up the oil pump screen.

From the Ford engine rebuilding plant it was reported that many engines had been damaged by debris clogging oil pump screen.

In 1932 1933 service bulletins Ford said that Sludge clogging the oil pump screen was a cause of MANY engine failures.

This was a problem on 4 year old cars!

 

[ModelAMitch]

So I’ve got some photos. One of the steering box, the bottom of the column with both levers all the way up as far as they’ll go. Another one of my spark linkage end to end which is 17 3/4” end to end. And lastly a photo of where the arm on the top plate sits with my spark lever all the way down, notice the large gap between the arm and distributor body.

 

[ModelAMitch]

In post 29 I see the timing gear failed.

Did you clean the oil pump screen afterwards?

Chunks of the gear will clog up the oil pump screen.

From the Ford engine rebuilding plant it was reported that many engines had been damaged by debris clogging oil pump screen.

In 1932 1933 service bulletins Ford said that Sludge clogging the oil pump screen was a cause of MANY engine failures.

This was a problem on 4 year old cars!

I have the pan off and the oil pump is getting rebuilt at the moment. That’s what led me to start tinkering with the distributor. Now I’m glad I did because everyone’s providing me with some great information.

 

[alexiskai]

17-3/4” is too long, I think. That could account for the gap.

 

[CT Jack]

If you have a welder I would tack weld the top of the nut to the screw. Then use a thin wrench to loosen the screw and back it out. You should be able to back it out far enough to allow removal of the distributor. Only back it out as far as needed then it can be retightened later without having to struggle with getting it engaged for reassembly.

 

[w.michael]

If you are going to continue to use the manifold heater, I would suggest you use the “modern” upper distributor plate with the condenser located inside the distributor. With that plate, you can change the condenser from the top, without pulling the distributor up. In the alternative, you can relocate the condenser to the firewall beside the coil. Given your location, I assume you will want to keep the heater manifold on the car.

W. Michael

 

[Marshall V. Daut]

ModelAMitch -
Based on your recently-posted photos, you have the seven-tooth steering column, which is correct for your 1928 Model A. We can now rule out a misadjusted mast jacket as causing the spark rod dilemma. Rats! Had it been a two-tooth steering column, you could have simply loosened a couple bolts and adjusted the mast jacket to accommodate the length of the spark rod. Well, very few things come easily when repairing these old beasts. Check out the other guys' suggestions and you'll probably snare the cause.

I had also noticed the condenser's near proximity to a very hot exhaust manifold, which will shorten the life of the condenser from the heat. You could try installing the so-called short-proof condenser offered by vendors, although I am not sure whether that guarantee also covers exposure to high heat. If you decide to convert to an upper plate with the condenser mounted there as "w.michael" suggests, cut the old condenser in half and re-install it in the hole so that no crud or leaking coolant gets inside the distributor. It will also keep the distributor looking authentic. The condenser must be cut in half so that it doesn't contact the lower plate's tang and cause a short because of the active condenser on the upper distributor plate.
Marshall

 

[Benson]

Also see post #7 if you want to use Otwell heater

 

[katy]

You need an offset wrench and an offset screwdriver to loosen that nut and stud.
The pictures are for reference, not all offset tools are the same as pictured

 

[ModelAMitch]

17-3/4” is too long, I think. That could account for the gap.

So I think I should purchase that spark rod connector piece you mentioned earlier in this thread, but first I should re time the car with the lever all the way up and then maybe I will gain more movement with my spark lever. In my latest photo posted there appears to be a lot of room in the distributor body that the timing could be advanced, but it can’t because my lever is all the way down on the column.

 

[alexiskai]

I should re time the car with the lever all the way up and then maybe I will gain more movement with my spark lever.

I can't imagine how that could possibly work, but give it a try. From the pictures it looked like moving the lever to the top of the quadrant was physically impossible because you had reached the edge of the cut-out in the distributor body. Re-timing won't affect that problem at all. If you do re-time it, disconnect the linkage and position the upper plate at full retard by hand. I think you'll find the issue persists.

 

[ModelAMitch]

I can't imagine how that could possibly work, but give it a try. From the pictures it looked like moving the lever to the top of the quadrant was physically impossible because you had reached the edge of the cut-out in the distributor body. Re-timing won't affect that problem at all. If you do re-time it, disconnect the linkage and position the upper plate at full retard by hand. I think you'll find the issue persists.

Understood, shortening the spark rod then would be my best option at this time?

 

[alexiskai]

Understood, shortening the spark rod then would be my best option at this time?

That is my opinion based on the photos you submitted, which showed:

• Upper plate in fully retarded position while the hand advance indicator was halfway up the quadrant
• 7-tooth steering column with the spark lever arm in roughly the correct position
• Total length of the spark advance linkage rod roughly 3/4" too long, which is about the distance of the gap at the distributor

See this page for a detailed description of the correct length of the rod (A-9757, bottom of the page).

 

[ModelAMitch]

That is my opinion based on the photos you submitted, which showed:

• Upper plate in fully retarded position while the hand advance indicator was halfway up the quadrant
• 7-tooth steering column with the spark lever arm in roughly the correct position
• Total length of the spark advance linkage rod roughly 3/4" too long, which is about the distance of the gap at the distributor

See this page for a detailed description of the correct length of the rod (A-9757, bottom of the page).

Thank you very much for all the info. I’m going to track down one of those connector pieces and hopefully that helps me out

 

[ModelAMitch]

Update - So I got a few things sorted out, I managed to get the distributor screw undone and distributor removed. And good thing because it was pretty rusty and crappy in there. I ended up grinding a 9/16” wrench really flat and with a few bends, made it reach the lock nut. I then eyed up the best I could and drilled a hole through the heater portion of my exhaust manifold. I was able to get a screwdriver through the hole to back the screw out and with a little bit of force got the distributor out. To my surprise it was the 2 piece shaft, but doesn’t have an oil hole in the top nut. I cleaned it up, clean the hole out, dumped oil down it and put it back in.
I also adjusted my spark advance rod that connects to the top plate on the distributor, I put it in my vice and bent it to make it shorter, thus allowing my spark control on the column to reach the top with the pin on the top plate of distributor just making contact on the distributor body. So right on, all my initial questions on this thread have been resolved.
Then I needed to time the car, I’ve never done this before. I’ve never timed any car before. I watched videos online and my local Model A parts guy gave me a print out of instructions on how he tells people to do it. I timed it, I got the car running and drove it down the road for the first time in a while, but quickly turned around and came home because it wasn’t running very nicely and I had to leave for work soon, didn’t want to get stranded. So I’m assuming I do not have the car timed properly. I’m at work now but will try and do more research so I can try again tomorrow.
Thanks everyone for your help this far, if anyone wants to chime in with their tips and tricks on timing their A I’m all ears!

 

[alexiskai]

I also adjusted my spark advance rod that connects to the top plate on the distributor, I put it in my vice and bent it to make it shorter, thus allowing my spark control on the column to reach the top with the pin on the top plate of distributor just making contact on the distributor body.

This may work for you, but I generally advise against bending the spark control rod for two reasons. The first is that, as you adjust the rod back and forth, it may rotate, which can bring the rod close to the #3 plug connector or terminal. If that happens, the spark for that cylinder will begin jumping to the rod and the cylinder will start to miss.

The second is that a bent spark control rod is spring-like in a way that a straight rod isn't. If you retard the rod, say, 1/2", the upper plate in the distributor will not rotate exactly 1/2", but only perhaps 1/3", because some of the movement is absorbed by the rod continuing to bend (i.e., compress). Or it may move more than 1/2" because this motion overcomes compression that was already stored up, and the rod springs back to its untensioned shape.

Bottom line, bending the spark control rod introduces, in my experience, "noise" into your spark advance movements. Perhaps your rod is sufficiently stiff, and your bend sufficiently mild, that it works for you. In any case, you should inspect the movement of the rod while you adjust the control at the steering wheel, and see whether it's precise enough for your taste – and also make sure there's no risk of it shorting out the #3 cylinder.