Removing Distributor

[Synchro909]

Awesome, thanks guys. Ill look into drilling a hole through the heater portion of the exhaust manifold in order to slip a screw driver through it.

I'll also remove the manifolds and check with a straight edge, see if I can get some exhaust glands.

I've read about roadside distributor repairs, but have no idea how common they are. I've only logged maybe 30-40 miles on my A before the repairs started rolling in.
Thanks guys from the info.

Don't drill through the top of the manifold itself!

 

[Benson]

i agree ... Look closely before drilling a hole.



It is possible that the drill bit will go into the Exhaust manifold area and introduce Carbon Monoxide into the heated air.

 

[ModelAMitch]

Ill be sure to quadruple check before drilling into the manifold. I definitely dont want to completely ruin it.

 

[Marshall V. Daut]

I just looked at the photos again in "ModelAMitch's" initial posting. The distributor lock bolt's (actually it's a stud, not a bolt) location vis-a-vis the manifold is way up high on the manifold. I have not broken one of these types of heater manifolds apart to study the innards, but there almost have to be two parts separate parts: the bottom business portion where the exhaust flows through and an upper portion where fresh air flows through to reach the firewall inlet valve. If there were not two separate upper and lower "compartments", then the exhaust fumes would be mixed with the heated fresh air entering the passenger's compartment. Not an ideal situation, is it?
Of course, it wouldn't hurt to perform an internal inspection with a flashlight or a long probe to see just how much area is in the upper area before drilling a hole. Look again at that second photo in the original post, the side view. If there is exhaust that high up in the manifold to be concerned about drilling an access hole for a screwdriver to reach the distributor lock stud, I wouldn't want that manifold on my car. It would be a for sure carbon monoxide churner. Obviously, though, this is not the case.
As I wrote in my worst case suggestion about drilling an access hole, the poster should do that only if he is concerned about the future need to be able to remove the distributor without also removing the manifold. I wish I had a junk exhaust manifold like the one the poster owns to cut up and inspect to be sure. But I just can't imagine it would be dangerous to drill a hole that high up on the manifold. Maybe once the poster takes his manifold off to inspect the ports and replace the gaskets, he could also replace the lock stud and nut with a common 3/8" bolt with a 9/16" hex head. Then he could reach the bolt with a wrench to back it off a bit with the manifold still in place, should the need arise to remove the distributor again. I question whether a locking nut is really needed with a hex head bolt. I have encountered many Model A engines that had a bolt here instead of the authentic stud with nut. And some were a bear to remove, even with a socket and ratchet! If the bolt is tightened sufficiently enough to begin with, it's not going to back out by itself. Greater tightening pressure can be exerted on a hex head bolt than on a slotted stud to ensure it won't loosen up on its own. If the poster is not concerned about maintaining absolute authenticity, then using a common bolt in this application might be the best solution for him.
Marshall

 

[Patrick L.]

Without having read the other posts.

It doesn't look as though you have the primary lead clamp. Maybe I just can't see it though.

It looks as though you can get to the distributor lock nut and screw. A thin [ ground down] 9/16 box should loosen the nut. A thin flat screwdriver blade might be able to be slipped in and grab the side enough to loosen the lock screw. Then maybe needle nose could take over. That lock screw does not have to be removed, in fact, it shouldn't be removed in your case.


I should had also mentioned that the heater manifolds I've seen have an access hole the distributor lock screw. Apparently this manifold doesn't, but, I'd still look.

 

[larrys40]

Don’t worry about the exhaust glands. They probably won’t fit and it will be more trouble than it’s worth . Use copper gasket or 1 piece clad style .
You don’t need to drill a hole. You shouldn’t have to be pulling the distributor again for many miles.
Larry

 

[ModelAMitch]

For those of you asking about the ignition switch and if it’s mounted to the head, it’s not. It has some Mickey Mouse electrical tape holding it into the distributor from the previous owner, the car ran this way and I haven’t wanted to touch it yet..
I’m trying to post a photo, but can’t figure out how without starting a new thread..




Thank you for that Bob c!

 

[Bob C]

In the bottom right corner click on EDIT then GO ADVANCED in the tool bar
click on the paper clip and you should be able to add a picture there.

 

[ModelAMitch]

Hey guys, I had a look at the exhaust manifold and I can definitely drill a hole into the top of it right through and access the screw holding the distributor in without drilling into where the exhaust gases will travel. I have not decided whether or not I will be doing that. I have only owned this car (my first A) for a few months and it’s been one problem after another and I want to drive it before it goes away for the winter.
I don’t necessarily need to remove the distributor at this time, what led me to do so was the timing gear failing, which I replaced and then removed the oil pan to clean the teeth out of it. Which is when I noticed my oil pump was Mickey Mouse welded together and I’m having that rebuilt at the moment. I haven’t touched the distributor since owning the car so I thought I’d remove that since the car isn’t going anywhere at the moment. But now with this manifold in the way, today I decided to just clean up the distributor, cleaned the cam and points, set the point gap and rotor gap. When I get my oil pump back I’ll reassemble everything and (fingers crossed) drive the car. I’ll remove the manifold and deal with that when the cars away for the winter, maybe have the manifolds planed etc..

Here comes my next question for you Fordbarn guys, when I got the car the spark lever never went all the way up, always left a gap. It would start fine and run ok, but now that I was playing with the distributor I’m looking into it more. With my spark lever pushed up as far as I can on the column, the arm on the top plate of the distributor hits the distributor body and leaves a gap on the spark lever. (Now that I know how to post photos) here’s a picture of what’s going on.

 

[alexiskai]

So there's the right way to fix this and then there's the quick way. The problem is that the linkage (between the spark control lever, at the top of the steering column, and the ball at the end of the upper plate on the distributor) is the wrong length. It's too long. There can be lots of reasons for that. The spark advance control rod, part A-9757, is supposed to be just under 17" long (not counting the spring-loaded caps), so perhaps yours is too long. The lever arm at the bottom of the steering column and the control rod it attaches to are supposed to rest at a particular angle, so perhaps yours points too far toward the side of the car.

The right way to fix it is to deconstruct and measure and figure out which component is out of spec, and then replace it with one that's correct. This is often difficult to accomplish due to parts scarcity, or reluctance to mess with the steering column.

The quick way is to get one of these, cut some length off your spark control rod, insert this in the middle, and adjust it so the rod is the right length for your setup. Be aware that replacement control rods are not available from any source at the moment.

 

[Marshall V. Daut]

I see that you have a 1928 Model A with the red steering wheel, right? (You might want to add your car's info to your profile to help answer future questions) The steering box should be the seven-tooth design, which was obsoleted in the spring of 1929 in favor of the superior two-tooth design. Your quadrant beneath the spark lever is correct for a '28-29 steering column - but which one do you have? If someone has swapped out the 1928-29 seven-tooth column and installed a 1929 two-tooth column, it's possible that the mast jacket is improperly adjusted, affecting the travel of both the spark rod and the hand throttle rod. Can you post a photo of the steering box in your car so we can eliminate that as a factor in your spark rod travel problem? Odds are, though, the old seven-tooth steering column is still in place and that has no provision for mast jacket adjustment. If you do have the seven-tooth column, that is not why the spark rod travel is incorrect.
Marshall

 

[Synchro909]

So there's the right way to fix this and then there's the quick way. The problem is that the linkage (between the spark control lever, at the top of the steering column, and the ball at the end of the upper plate on the distributor) is the wrong length. It's too long. There can be lots of reasons for that. The spark advance control rod, part A-9757, is supposed to be just under 17" long (not counting the spring-loaded caps), so perhaps yours is too long. The lever arm at the bottom of the steering column and the control rod it attaches to are supposed to rest at a particular angle, so perhaps yours points too far toward the side of the car.

The right way to fix it is to deconstruct and measure and figure out which component is out of spec, and then replace it with one that's correct. This is often difficult to accomplish due to parts scarcity, or reluctance to mess with the steering column.

The quick way is to get one of these, cut some length off your spark control rod, insert this in the middle, and adjust it so the rod is the right length for your setup. Be aware that replacement control rods are not available from any source at the moment.

I suspect the timing was set with the lever down from the top in the first place.
Resetting it with the lever up should also fix it.

 

[ModelAMitch]

So there's the right way to fix this and then there's the quick way. The problem is that the linkage (between the spark control lever, at the top of the steering column, and the ball at the end of the upper plate on the distributor) is the wrong length. It's too long. There can be lots of reasons for that. The spark advance control rod, part A-9757, is supposed to be just under 17" long (not counting the spring-loaded caps), so perhaps yours is too long. The lever arm at the bottom of the steering column and the control rod it attaches to are supposed to rest at a particular angle, so perhaps yours points too far toward the side of the car.

The right way to fix it is to deconstruct and measure and figure out which component is out of spec, and then replace it with one that's correct. This is often difficult to accomplish due to parts scarcity, or reluctance to mess with the steering column.

The quick way is to get one of these, cut some length off your spark control rod, insert this in the middle, and adjust it so the rod is the right length for your setup. Be aware that replacement control rods are not available from any source at the moment.

Thanks alexiskai, I will measure my spark adjustment rod after work and report back. If it is too long,, then would I not be advancing the timing enough when I pull the spark lever down all the way? My lever goes 3/4 of the way up and touches the distributor body, so so when pull it down and it bottoms out I am not advancing it all the way? Im trying to make sense of this.

I see that you have a 1928 Model A with the red steering wheel, right? (You might want to add your car's info to your profile to help answer future questions) The steering box should be the seven-tooth design, which was obsoleted in the spring of 1929 in favor of the superior two-tooth design. Your quadrant beneath the spark lever is correct for a '28-29 steering column - but which one do you have? If someone has swapped out the 1928-29 seven-tooth column and installed a 1929 two-tooth column, it's possible that the mast jacket is improperly adjusted, affecting the travel of both the spark rod and the hand throttle rod. Can you post a photo of the steering box in your car so we can eliminate that as a factor in your spark rod travel problem? Odds are, though, the old seven-tooth steering column is still in place and that has no provision for mast jacket adjustment. If you do have the seven-tooth column, that is not why the spark rod travel is incorrect.
Marshall

Yes I do have a 28, and I will certainly update my profile to provide as much info as possible and skip over a few questions in the future.
Im at work currently, but I will get a photo of my steering box when I get home and post it, off the top of my head Im not sure which one is on the car.

I suspect the timing was set with the lever down from the top in the first place.
Resetting it with the lever up should also fix it.

I have yet to set the timing on my car, but since I've had it apart replacing various things it needs to be done. So maybe Ill do that first and see if that helps and go from there I guess. Thank you for the advice

 

[alexiskai]

I suspect the timing was set with the lever down from the top in the first place.
Resetting it with the lever up should also fix it.

I think the problem he's reporting is that he can't move the lever to the top of the quadrant because the upper plate adjusting ball runs into the side of the distributor body at about halfway up. That's why I said the linkage is too long overall.

A picture of the lower portion of the steering column, with both levers as far up as you can move them, would help.

 

[ModelAMitch]

I think the problem he's reporting is that he can't move the lever to the top of the quadrant because the upper plate adjusting ball runs into the side of the distributor body at about halfway up. That's why I said the linkage is too long overall.

A picture of the lower portion of the steering column, with both levers as far up as you can move them, would help.

Yes thats exactly what Im reporting, cant move the spark lever up because the ball on the upper plate hits the distributor body. I will get back with photos of the lower part of the steering column and steering box after work.

 

[J Franklin]

On my car (a 1930) it is all adjustable without removing the unit.

 

[daveymc29]

I have used a bit of muffler repair paste when fitting the gasket over the glans rings. For me the paste and using the copper gaskets makes a fairly good seal for many miles. I also like the heater manifolds because they tend to hold their shape instead of developing the droop.

 

[Synchro909]

I think the problem he's reporting is that he can't move the lever to the top of the quadrant because the upper plate adjusting ball runs into the side of the distributor body at about halfway up. That's why I said the linkage is too long overall.

A picture of the lower portion of the steering column, with both levers as far up as you can move them, would help.

The arm on the top plate should be against the edge of the body when the lever is all the way up. (Same for all the way down - or near enough) If the timing were set at TDC with the lever up, the arm would be against the body. Therefore, all would be well. He would also get more advance. I bet the motor doesn't rev out too well as it is.

 

[ModelAMitch]

The arm on the top plate should be against the edge of the body when the lever is all the way up. (Same for all the way down - or near enough) If the timing were set at TDC with the lever up, the arm would be against the body. Therefore, all would be well. He would also get more advance. I bet the motor doesn't rev out too well as it is.

So your saying since the arm is touching the distributor body and my spark lever isnt all the way up, Im not able to advance the timing as much as I should be able to? Makes sense to me

 

[J Franklin]

So your saying since the arm is touching the distributor body and my spark lever isnt all the way up, Im not able to advance the timing as much as I should be able to? Makes sense to me

Adjust the motion so the lever is able to go all the way to each side of the slot in the dist. body. The lever then should be correct inside the cab.