I need help- starnge charging problem

Chris

Chris

Well-known member
Hey gang, I have a problem that has me scratching my head. It is in regards to the 6V charging system on my 1953 Sunliner. I will tell the whole story, if anyone has any suggestions or sees something I overlooked, please let me know. We are going on one last V8 tour this weekend and I'm trying to get it sorted out.

My 53 had a great working charging system. It is all stock, 6V pos ground. My generator worked fine for the last year, but the bearing made a "squeak" noise so I swapped it with a rebuilt generator I had from who knows where. It also charged fine, however a few weeks back I took it on an out of town trip and the charging system quite working. Would run on discharge and drain battery while running. I got the car home and I replaced the generator with the one originally on the car. Still showed a discharge so I replaced the regulator with a new one. Now the amp gauge sits at zero...neither charge or discharge. Flick the lights on and it drops a sec then right back up to zero. I thought maybe the battery was fully charged, but I have never had a car where the needle sits at zero. So I drove it around with the lights on and sure it enough, it was running the battery down. Still sits at zero, lights on or off, it does not matter.

Thinking I had a bad regulator, I took the one off my 46 Ford which worked perfect, and same result. So, I took the field wire off and held on the Battery post on regulator and it charges. The more it revs, the more it charges. So I know the generator is working.

I figured it is the regulator, but this regulator works fine on the other car. YES- I polarized both regulators by touching Fld to Bat on regulator. I really cannot see how it is the regulator, but what else could it be? Could I have a wiring problem? I will admit I know VERY LITTLE on charging systems.

It has me scratching my head. Took it on a 50 mile drive last night, heater and head lights on, amp gauge sits at zero- neither charge or discharge. Got car home and it would barley crank over.

Has anyone had this problem? To sum up, I have proven the generator works, and have a known working regulator. I can disconnect battery while it's running and it stays running. so it is charging but just barley. Why won't it charge enough?



This is the amp gauge while driving with lights and heater on.






And this is it when I connect Field wire to Battery wire and rev it. If you click on it you can watch the video

 
Seth Swoboda said:
His temperature gauge looks to be where every stock temp gauge on every V8 I've seen sits at normal operating temperature.
Click to expand...
Not my '51; it sits at about 3/8 on the gauge, right in the middle of the "Normal" band. Are we looking at the same picture?
 
tubman said:
Not my '51; it sits at about 3/8 on the gauge, right in the middle of the "Normal" band. Are we looking at the same picture?
Click to expand...

Same photo. I run a mechanical gauge and locate it under the dash on two of my flathead engines. The dash gauge will be pegged at H and the mechanical will indicate 190. I have never thought these Ford gauges to be deadly accurate. Anyway, were getting off topic from Chris's original question and I apologize.
 
The old Ford products used an induction type current flow meter. If the battery is fully charged, it is usually indicating a base line charge in the middle of the meter. After starting or with a marginally low battery, it will indicate on the charge side until the battery is fully charged. If the vehicle has the lights or an accessory working in the on position prior to start, it will indicate discharge until the engine is fired up and the generator comes back on line. It may show a charge for a bit but generally goes back to the mid line if the battery is in good shape. If the system is taxed by a lot of lights and accessories all at the same time, it will swing toward the charge side due to the amount of current flow in the main bus wire.

They would have been better off with a volt meter but that was not to be. System voltage should be around 7.1 volts when conditions are right and the system is charging normally. Generators like a little rpm to get going but they also don't like too much rpm either.
 
Loads hooked up correctly to the post under the dash shouldn´t affect the meter if im not completely wrong...meter should be between loads and battery only showing what goes in or out of the battery and not what is used by loads.
 
I'm pretty dumb when it comes with this kind of stuff, so bear with me. I tested the battery with a multi meter and it read just above 6 volts before I started it




Then I started the car, and at idle it shows about 7.5 volts





So maybe it is working fine and I'm just kind of dumb? The needle still sits at zero, before it always read above zero in the gauge...maybe it had an overcharge problem?
 
flatheadmurre said:
Loads hooked up correctly to the post under the dash shouldn´t affect the meter if im not completely wrong...meter should be between loads and battery only showing what goes in or out of the battery and not what is used by loads.
Click to expand...

Correct!

Is it possible your starter doesn't like the heat? In other words, it will "barely crank" after a good run because of a starter problem?

The thing to check would be what your battery's voltage is after a good run like that, as well as with the engine running at 1500 RPM.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by solidaxle
Run a temporary ground wire directly to the battery from the regulator case, see if that clears it up.

This is a great idea, I will try this when I get home
Chris said:
This is a great idea, I will try this when I get home
Click to expand...


So did you try this when you got home? BTW, the battery voltages look really healthy both running & not running.

Jack E/NJ
 
Every time I trouble shoot an electrical problem, I start with the battery. (load test) Have you tried it with a known good battery like the battery out of the 46?
 
Chris, With the engine running and revved up to 2000 rpm for a couple of minutes your voltage should read around 7.5 to 7.7 volts. You tested at engine idle speed (500 rpm ?) which at that speed the generator would not be charging the battery. Even so your 7.46 volts reading would seem to be fairly correct. Someone suggested a voltage reading of 7.1 volts which is too low at driving speeds of around 2000 rpm or so. I would normally adjust voltage regulators at 7.7 volts with about 6 to 8 amps charging current flowing on my test meters. That is the normal recommended setting for a 6 volt system. Current control setting on regulator should be set at 30 to 33 amps on your type Ford generator. An automotive volt-ammeter with adjustable rheostat analogue test set is the correct instrument for all charging system tests. Regards, Kevin.
 
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