1929 Rear end
- Thread starter aichord
- Start date
redmodelt
Well-known member
Welcome to the world of Model A's.
Which bearings are you going to replace, the carrier bearings or the outer axle bearings?
If it the carrier bearings there's more to the job then just pulling the rear end apart and putting bearings in. You need a press or pullers, gaskets, parts etc. What books do you have on hand to guide you through the job?
Which bearings are you going to replace, the carrier bearings or the outer axle bearings?
If it the carrier bearings there's more to the job then just pulling the rear end apart and putting bearings in. You need a press or pullers, gaskets, parts etc. What books do you have on hand to guide you through the job?
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Joe K
Well-known member
You can do this by driving wood blocking under the rear spring eyes at the shackles. Then finding a way to compress the rear spring, either by having a party and inviting all your friends into the back seat, or by other means to force the rear of the car down and the load taken by the wooden block. Oak is best.
In "The Model A Ford" book by Victor Page, he has pix of this method and using a KRW spring compressor made specifically for the Model A Ford. But with blocking and weight in the back of the car, you can achieve the same.
The weighting/compression you want to achieve is where the load is taken by the blocks and the shackles can be "moved" as in the keeper plates taken off and then the shackle driven out with a punch. Likely your shackles are worn out anyway and you needn't fear of damaging them - they can be replaced with new.
With the shackles removed, then it is simply a matter to remove the weight/compression, and then unbolt the various attachments to the axle (universal joint covers, speedometer cable, brake rods) and then roll the axle out from underneath.
The next step if you choose to restore the spring is to remove the two large U-bolts that hold the spring to the frame cross member. Be careful in this (keep your hiney away from the spring path - defensive posture) since the center bolt that holds the spring together MAY be broken - releasing the u-bolts MAY cause the spring to "unspring" with resultant flying leaves/missiles aimed at your person.
Some put large C clamps on the rear spring on either side where they can clear the frame to mimic the clamp action of the U-bolts - and leave it like this until the spring is fully removed to the work bench. Once on the bench, the defensive posture becomes more controlled and one can determine if indeed the center bolt of the spring is broken.
Un-compressing the spring to remove the center bolt is ALWAYS fraught with some tension (witty statement here) but with care and that defensive posture it can be done. Some use a stout bench vise to aid in de-compression.
Just be careful. Those cheap ratchet straps sold and used to bind loads to trailers can be used to good advantage to keep the spring under control should something slip. Defense in depth.
Be safe. Ride smooth. Drive carefully (forward looking statement here.)
Good luck too.
Joe K
Steve Plucker
BANNED
Welcome to The Fordbarn...
I would get access to a good spring spreader, one way or the other, and do the job in a safe manor...if you don't and something unforseable happens...you will wish you had!
Just where are you located? Who knows, there might be one just a few minutes from you and you do not even know it.
Also, get to know your car before you tackel any project.
Pluck
I would get access to a good spring spreader, one way or the other, and do the job in a safe manor...if you don't and something unforseable happens...you will wish you had!
Just where are you located? Who knows, there might be one just a few minutes from you and you do not even know it.
Also, get to know your car before you tackel any project.
Pluck
Marco Tahtaras
Well-known member
Hi guys just acquired a 1929 model A.I need to remove the differential so I can replace the axel bearings, however I do not have access to a spring spreader. Any suggestions?
I'm curious just what prompted the decision or "need" at this time. Is there an unusual amount of end play in one or both axle shafts? If you removed the rear brake drums and found the outer end of the axle to float a bit this is normal. The large roller bearing in the rear hub carries the outer end of the axle when the drum is reinstalled.
Joe K
Well-known member
And, if you trust your welding...and Harbor Freight Masonry Chisels...
http://www.icehouse.net/overland/springspreader.html
(Thanks, Larry - you've done the hobby a REAL service - and likely saved at least one accident.)
Don't forget this tool ONLY removes the spring from your axle (or visa-versa) It will not prevent an accident caused by a broken spring center bolt.
To demount a long standing spring from a chassis STILL requires the care and clamps and defensive posture I mentioned earlier. You just CAN'T know about the condition of that center bolt.
And why I recommend using a work bench with a stout vise and secondary restraint of ratchet straps when checking/removing a spring center bolt.
Joe K
http://www.icehouse.net/overland/springspreader.html
(Thanks, Larry - you've done the hobby a REAL service - and likely saved at least one accident.)
Don't forget this tool ONLY removes the spring from your axle (or visa-versa) It will not prevent an accident caused by a broken spring center bolt.
To demount a long standing spring from a chassis STILL requires the care and clamps and defensive posture I mentioned earlier. You just CAN'T know about the condition of that center bolt.
And why I recommend using a work bench with a stout vise and secondary restraint of ratchet straps when checking/removing a spring center bolt.
Joe K
Tom Endy
Well-known member
Do yourself a favor and buy a proper spring spreader. You will need it again down the road when you go to replace the clutch. A Model A rear spring can be lethal. You can buy an economy model from Snyder for about $80, and one with added features for about $135 from most any supplier.
Don't buy or use the one called a traveling unit that only spreads one side, theses are dangerous.
Photo of all three shown below (I hope).
Tom Endy
Don't buy or use the one called a traveling unit that only spreads one side, theses are dangerous.
Photo of all three shown below (I hope).
Tom Endy
Attachments
Charlie Stephens
Well-known member
As others suggested, put your general location in your profile and with a post like this in the post. Have you tried your local Model A club to see if they have one to loan? Any way, get a spring spreader.
Charlie Stephens
Charlie Stephens
Marco Tahtaras
Well-known member
If you reread my post you should realize there are no bearings in that location. When you removed the drums you also removed the bearings!
Joe K
Well-known member
No bearing at that point. Only a seal (which you DO have to disassemble the pumpkin to service)
The wheel bearings in the hub center the axle in the small ends of the trumpet tubes.
Heh. There is (or can be) a fair amount of "slop" in the wheel hub to trumpet tube/axle housing bearing. In fact the stub bearing end of the trumpet tube is usually found worn "egg shaped" from the weight of the car bearing always on the bottom of the race.
About 15 or 20 thou can be considered a wear limit? Although there is nothing to keep the axle from soldiering on except a tendency to leak out the shaft seal at this location - and messing with the brake centering/action.
These races can be replaced with new races. Some early axle housings actually had a race which was pressed on. Later axles housings were all "integral" with the bearing portion being only the as forged/machined surface of the trumpet housing. Both of these have to have the housing/stub machined in a lathe to take on the replacement race. (i.e. probably require disassembly of the axle.)
Joe K
The wheel bearings in the hub center the axle in the small ends of the trumpet tubes.
Heh. There is (or can be) a fair amount of "slop" in the wheel hub to trumpet tube/axle housing bearing. In fact the stub bearing end of the trumpet tube is usually found worn "egg shaped" from the weight of the car bearing always on the bottom of the race.
About 15 or 20 thou can be considered a wear limit? Although there is nothing to keep the axle from soldiering on except a tendency to leak out the shaft seal at this location - and messing with the brake centering/action.
These races can be replaced with new races. Some early axle housings actually had a race which was pressed on. Later axles housings were all "integral" with the bearing portion being only the as forged/machined surface of the trumpet housing. Both of these have to have the housing/stub machined in a lathe to take on the replacement race. (i.e. probably require disassembly of the axle.)
Joe K
Joe K
Well-known member
You could probably buy just the roller part of the bearing and replace that. That might take up some of the wear.
Meanwhile, keep your eye open for a Model A rear axle which can be bought for $100 frequently. Sometimes even with the spring still attached at that price. Sometimes even found on Craigslist and used under a home-made trailer as everyone was wont to do in the 1940s and 50s. This could be your "donor candidate" for a full rebuild to include high speed gears and bearings.
Which is probably the easiest and best solution - and will keep you driving AND working on the car at the same time.
I do marvel at the Model A. On my Diesel VW, it's not unusual to go into the stealership and drop a grand or more just to get that all precious state inspection sticker. Meanwhile, on the Model A, parts are a fraction of the cost, and as long as you have a reasonably complete set of tools, you can fix it yourself in a couple of hours and make it register-able.
We've forgotten something in our transition to "modernity."
Sad...
Good luck. And welcome to the club!
Joe K
Meanwhile, keep your eye open for a Model A rear axle which can be bought for $100 frequently. Sometimes even with the spring still attached at that price. Sometimes even found on Craigslist and used under a home-made trailer as everyone was wont to do in the 1940s and 50s. This could be your "donor candidate" for a full rebuild to include high speed gears and bearings.
Which is probably the easiest and best solution - and will keep you driving AND working on the car at the same time.
I do marvel at the Model A. On my Diesel VW, it's not unusual to go into the stealership and drop a grand or more just to get that all precious state inspection sticker. Meanwhile, on the Model A, parts are a fraction of the cost, and as long as you have a reasonably complete set of tools, you can fix it yourself in a couple of hours and make it register-able.
We've forgotten something in our transition to "modernity."
Sad...
Good luck. And welcome to the club!
Joe K
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Tom Endy
Well-known member
Mr. Aichord:
Part of the enjoyment of the Model A hobby is learning about the car. There is an excellent book you can buy titled Model A Ford mechanics Handbook by Les Andrews that I recommend. The book does have its detractors, but it is vey comprehensive and it is an excellent guide when working on a Model A.
There is probably a local Model A club in your area. I would recommend you join and soon enough you will find mentors who will be able to assist you. Well organized clubs periodically hold technical seminars on various Model A subjects. Quite often the subject of a seminar is correcting a problem on a members' car.
Tom Endy
Part of the enjoyment of the Model A hobby is learning about the car. There is an excellent book you can buy titled Model A Ford mechanics Handbook by Les Andrews that I recommend. The book does have its detractors, but it is vey comprehensive and it is an excellent guide when working on a Model A.
There is probably a local Model A club in your area. I would recommend you join and soon enough you will find mentors who will be able to assist you. Well organized clubs periodically hold technical seminars on various Model A subjects. Quite often the subject of a seminar is correcting a problem on a members' car.
Tom Endy
Marco Tahtaras
Well-known member
It's unlikely you will get any gear lube out from there unless you jack up one side of the car significantly and leave it that way for awhile. You are more likely to get bearing grease working it's way past the old seal in the hub/drum assembly assuming it hasn't been replaced. You should be able to determine if the hub seal is modern (and decent condition) by looking at it.
Purdy Swoft
Well-known member
Many times leaking grease is caused by over filling. With the vehicle on a level spot, fill the rear end untill you can touch the grease with the first bent finger joint .Not to the top of the filler hole.
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