Really????

wickcopland

wickcopland

Senior Member
So I have disassembled my 39 Deluxe, and repaired and replaced all the mechanical items such as the engine, transmission, rear end brakes and wheel ends. Repaired the frame where it was needed. I have done the floor pans and the door sills. All other items that were needed. I had a guy that was going to repair the fenders and the hood where there was rust thru. Then he was going to paint the car. But, he got sick and unfortunately his condition prevents him from working. So, I set out to find someone else that could do the work. But, I put it back together and I just drove it around. Still trying to find someone to finish the car. No luck until I was given a new contact that can do the work. I happily called and set up an appointment for him to come out and look it over. Well he came out yesterday and we spent about an hour going over the car. He said he could start on it in a month. Great I thought until he gave me a price.
$40,000!!!!! $70,000 if I wanted to show the car!!! After I got up off the floor I began to come to the conclusion that I would have to learn how to do the welding and fabrication. I have done some of the type of work needed but I am not very good at it. Unsteady hands and poor eyesight have kept me from tackling the job. The rust thru is just at the fender bottoms and the lower back section of the hood. So not really that much for that part and then the painting. Is this normal for that work or is this way off the mark?
I am 66 yrs old and hope it is not to late for an old dog to learn new tricks?

Thank you so much for all the help over the years and I apologize for the long rant
Wick
 
So how many hours do you think it takes to do one of those repairs? And what do you think is a fair hourly rate?
 
If it's a tudor sedan as shown in your avatar, you can probably buy the best one in the world for a lot less than $40,000. If I were you, I'd dump it for whatever I could get and buy this : https://www.ebay.com/itm/267797963271.

Or keep the '39, buy the '34, and have $12,000 left to invest in "cigareets, whiskey, and wild, wild women."
 
tubman said:
If it's a tudor sedan as shown in your avatar, you can probably buy the best one in the world for a lot less than $40,000. If I were you, I'd dump it for whatever I could get and buy this : https://www.ebay.com/itm/267797963271.

Or keep the '39, buy the '34, and have $12,000 left to invest in "cigareets, whiskey, and wild, wild women."
Click to expand...

Denny, once again your advice is spot on. I sold this '40 tudor a few years ago. A very high point restoration, Struggled to get $22k.
 

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wickcopland said:
So I have disassembled my 39 Deluxe, and repaired and replaced all the mechanical items such as the engine, transmission, rear end brakes and wheel ends. Repaired the frame where it was needed. I have done the floor pans and the door sills. All other items that were needed. I had a guy that was going to repair the fenders and the hood where there was rust thru. Then he was going to paint the car. But, he got sick and unfortunately his condition prevents him from working. So, I set out to find someone else that could do the work. But, I put it back together and I just drove it around. Still trying to find someone to finish the car. No luck until I was given a new contact that can do the work. I happily called and set up an appointment for him to come out and look it over. Well he came out yesterday and we spent about an hour going over the car. He said he could start on it in a month. Great I thought until he gave me a price.
$40,000!!!!! $70,000 if I wanted to show the car!!! After I got up off the floor I began to come to the conclusion that I would have to learn how to do the welding and fabrication. I have done some of the type of work needed but I am not very good at it. Unsteady hands and poor eyesight have kept me from tackling the job. The rust thru is just at the fender bottoms and the lower back section of the hood. So not really that much for that part and then the painting. Is this normal for that work or is this way off the mark?
I am 66 yrs old and hope it is not to late for an old dog to learn new tricks?

Thank you so much for all the help over the years and I apologize for the long rant
Wick
Click to expand...
His estimate seems fair to a bit on the low side. My "typical" full body restoration and paint job (done correctly) can easily hit $50k. That is starting with a pretty nice car. Heck, materials alone can and do hit $9k wholesale.

If he is anything like me, he won't do anything short of what is humanly possible. As the saying goes, "ya get what ya pay for".

I think Denny has offered the best advice this far. Cut your loss and buy a car that was done already.
 
When it comes to heavy labor and the current hourly rates, one will be totally upside down in a car like this (year, body style, etc). It costs a lot more money to completely redo a 39 sedan (body, paint, trim, chrome), than a 32 three-window coupe . . . and the end values are very different.

BUT - very few of us are in this hobby to make money . . . just the opposite! It comes down to time, money and passion . . . bordered by expectations. You could have a great time driving the car "as is" - and put the money into something else, or sell it and buy somebody else's completed car, or use it as a 'learning experience' and do the work yourself. Many options - just keep your expectations in alignment with reality! ;)

For most of us, the work is the therapy that we enjoy - (with few exceptions) we don't expect to make a profit if/when we ever sell the car!

In my past, I know I've made what I called "investment" purchases at the time . . . only to have to be truthful with myself later on -> they were not investments, they were something I wanted and will not give me any return on my "investment"! LOL
 
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It took me little time in 65 years of car buying to realize being upside down is the natural way of ownership. Once you get accustomed it doesn't hurt at all. The last car I bought this year I think I was 15K under water before it arrived at my driveway. And, as usual, I am madly in love with it. This hobby brings so much joy to me!!!!!!!!
 
I'm 65 and never did body or paint. I'm building a non Ford right now and am doing my own body and paint. It is labor intensive and the materials needed are expensive.

I am constantly looking for deals on what I need and I do find deals that save me money. I enjoy doing my own work and that's a good thing because I can't afford to pay somebody else. Lot's of horror stories about cars that were dropped off at a shop and years later not done or they can't even get the car or parts back.

I never bought anything to sell. I buy what I like, fix it up the way I like it and keep it till I'm gone.

YouTube has MANY good instructional videos on ANYTHING you may want to learn about.

If you have any high schools or community colleges near you with automotive programs, you might get lucky working something out using your car or parts as the teacher's aid. Or you can do like I did and take the class. Yes, plenty of retired folks take them.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do. Scott in AZ.
 
wickcopland said:
So I have disassembled my 39 Deluxe, and repaired and replaced all the mechanical items such as the engine, transmission, rear end brakes and wheel ends. Repaired the frame where it was needed. I have done the floor pans and the door sills. All other items that were needed. I had a guy that was going to repair the fenders and the hood where there was rust thru. Then he was going to paint the car. But, he got sick and unfortunately his condition prevents him from working. So, I set out to find someone else that could do the work. But, I put it back together and I just drove it around. Still trying to find someone to finish the car. No luck until I was given a new contact that can do the work. I happily called and set up an appointment for him to come out and look it over. Well he came out yesterday and we spent about an hour going over the car. He said he could start on it in a month. Great I thought until he gave me a price.
$40,000!!!!! $70,000 if I wanted to show the car!!! After I got up off the floor I began to come to the conclusion that I would have to learn how to do the welding and fabrication. I have done some of the type of work needed but I am not very good at it. Unsteady hands and poor eyesight have kept me from tackling the job. The rust thru is just at the fender bottoms and the lower back section of the hood. So not really that much for that part and then the painting. Is this normal for that work or is this way off the mark?
I am 66 yrs old and hope it is not to late for an old dog to learn new tricks?

Thank you so much for all the help over the years and I apologize for the long rant
Wick
Click to expand...


You didn't say IF or what kind of welder you are using....One tip I got from a couple of hot rod buddies IF you are using a MIG welder......I am using .025 wire...the smaller wire keeps a little less heat in your panels...in your case, you can just do "tack" welds in a cris-cross or alternating side each tack and keep them spaced out and as you move back and forth from side to side slowly fill the space between each tack side to side to keep the heat at a minimum and the potential of warped metal as well. ALSO IF you have an air compressor you can blow each tack weld with air to cool it down fast....Keep a hammer and dolly by your side and can hammer and dolly the welds to also keep them flat. My $ .02 worth
 
As others have stated, Sell what you have and go shopping. Figure out what you want in body style and go from there. Lots of nice cars out there at bargain prices. You can buy a car that is ready to drive. Once you buy a car that needs a lot of attention it may be a long time before you can drive it.
 
Personally, I believe that a car that does not need some work is someone else's car. When you need to repair and improve the car it becomes YOURS! I doubt that I will ever get a car completely done, at least I hope not! LOL
 
Sounds like you've done a lot of work already. if it's like my project you already have more invested than the value. my opinion is to drive it and maybe fix a little at a time, the fun is the driving
 
Here is an option and $12K BIN.Free shipping east of the Mississippi INcl




https://www.ebay.com/itm/278414305589
 

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Thank you to all that responded. I guess I really did not think ahead at all when I bought this car. I have always wanted to get something like I bought, but never really understood what was involved. I had counted guy that had done all my body work for my business for many years and was not prepared for what was to come. Kube, your advise and wealth of knowledge has opened my eyes to the truth of this undertaking and I appreciate it so much. I never thought that I would get back any money spent on this project and I so enjoy working on the car (and my wife's 30 model A) but I have been steered away from what I wanted to do to what the family needs that I have lost focus. So I will work on the 39 myself and learn how to do it. I have all Miller machines. Miller 215 mig Milled 210 tig and an old stick. I will try to attach som picks.

Thank you all again
 
Unfortunately your not the first to find out its better to buy an rust free or very good car to start. The good deal is never a good deal unless you’re an accomplished welder . Also doesn’t hurt to be 35-40 years old with no kids or family . I have turned so many rust jobs away because i know the person can’t afford to see even that part to the end. Let alone body paint interior. Thats why the rat club kids are popular. Good luck but its cheap therapy
 
I'm 65 and my dad painted his own Model As in lacquer when I was a kid. When I graduated high school, I took a college course from a friend of my dad. The instructor was the best metal finisher I've ever known. Because he was my dad's friend he took extra time with me. Gas welding, brazing, metal finishing. I got really good at hammer welding, but I never got really good at metal finishing. I beat the dent out and hammered and picked at the low spots but then I smeared autobody filler over it, it wasn't much thicker than a couple coats of paint. If the metal was stretched, I use heat shrinks with a torch. I feel that it was better to use a light coat of filler than it was "for me" to grind and grind and file trying and bump the metal then grind and file on it some more to make the repair perfect. I end up with a hole where the dent used to be if I ground on that much. Lloyd the instructor was so good, he would take two fenders from the scrap pile and pound dents it each of them, then he would say you guys fix that fender with autobody filler, and I will metal finish my fender, ready set go. I swear that by the time we had ground the paint off, mixed the filler he had his dent metal finished, he was incredible. He had a Proto cross peen hammer named Ike, he had used it since the 40s. He had replaced the wooden handle on it twice. I went and bought the same hammer he used, then he took my hammer and refinished the end of it so it did not have much crown to it, because too much crown would stretch the metal instead of just moving it, then he polished the face of it like a mirror. He kept telling me it takes years and years of doing this "everyday" to become good. I've always tried to metal finish, but I know my limits and when to stop and switch to body filler. Why I don't call it Bondo, Llooyd would get mad at us if we used filler and called it Bondo. He'd say, Bondo is a brand name, not all filler is called Bondo. Class at the college was 4-hours a day 5-days a week. I got a job at the phone company, and I finally had to quit the class. When my dad retired, he took an autobody class at the college, you could do the same.

Back in 1977 I was 18, I was painting the door of my '66 Mini Cooper S, the cup full of paint slipped off the gun, and I tried to grab it as it hit the ground, I saved most of what was in the cup. Lacquer was cheap back then, that would be an expensive mistake with today's paint. I've never made that mistake again, plenty of other mistakes but no more paint baths.
 

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