53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

[Son of a Ford]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

You wrote above complete cooling system descaled and flushed. Question the heads were removed for this descaling?
Ronnieroadster

No, the heads were not removed for the descaling. Did the radiator separately and made a circuit looping the water pumps together and the thermostat housings together see video below.

https://youtube.com/shorts/0aRMs1Y5LGY?is=_G41FixtEyb8O171

I have just made a temporary fan shroud and there is a significant airflow difference in the corners and was not running as hot but I can confirm that once the thermostats open there are a steady flow of bubbles coming to the surface.

 

[tubman]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

Yep, That's a Mallory. Looks like someone painted the outside of the cap black. That should work with your setup. You might want to check to see if the mechanical advance is working.

Also, later Mallory's like that have an adjustable advance curve that is initially set with a plastic "key" that fits into a slot inside the distributor which allows you to select either a "flathead advance" (22-24 degrees), or a larger advance (36 degrees). I had one of the newer Mallory's with that feature; I'll check my files and see if I still have the instruction sheet. While the excessive advance will cause overheating, I think there is something else going on as well.

 

[ford38v8]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

That’s an interesting setup you devised. You had me puzzled till I watched the video! Couple of thoughts on that: did you do that in both directions? Were you able to run the engine at any time during clean-out?

 

[Son of a Ford]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

That’s an interesting setup you devised. You had me puzzled till I watched the video! Couple of thoughts on that: did you do that in both directions? Were you able to run the engine at any time during clean-out?

I had let the CLR solution sit for about 24hrs and would run each pump for about 4-5 minutes every couple hours.

Never ran the motor while the solution was in, if I had to do it again I would just leave it all together and just run the motor for a few minutes every other hour then flush really good.

 

[19Fordy]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

So Of A Ford: Was you engine block pressure tested for cracks?
I know it's a pain but, install the original heads and see if it still overheats.

 

[Christopher Salty]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

No, the heads were not removed for the descaling. Did the radiator separately and made a circuit looping the water pumps together and the thermostat housings together see video below.

https://youtube.com/shorts/0aRMs1Y5LGY?is=_G41FixtEyb8O171

I have just made a temporary fan shroud and there is a significant airflow difference in the corners and was not running as hot but I can confirm that once the thermostats open there are a steady flow of bubbles coming to the surface.

That steady flow of bubbles again,

Lisle 75500 Combustion Leak Detector https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0007ZDRUI?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[38 coupe]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

If the car was a trailer queen, was the engine assembled for driving or just for show? You could try re-torquing the head bolts to see if the that eliminates the apparent exhaust gases that are getting into your cooling system. If that doesn't work it is probably time to pull the heads and see what is going on with the block, heads, and head gaskets.


I know several people who have de-scaled flathead V8s with a phosphoric acid based solution, but all have had cast iron heads. I hope the acid didn't do nasty things inside the aluminum heads on your engine. I definitely would not add a copper radiator into the mix, the combination of cast iron, copper, and aluminum with an acid would probably result in galvanic corrosion to parts you don't want corroded.

 

[Gene1949]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

I definitely would not add a copper radiator into the mix, the combination of cast iron, copper, and aluminum with an acid would probably result in galvanic corrosion to parts you don't want corroded.

absolutely but water and antifreeze will do the same, given enough time. I ruined a set of perfectly good original Edelbrocks from lack of maintenance.
When you think about it ANY cooling system is nothing more than a battery. A battery is nothing more than 2 dissimilar metals and a liquid. When you add aluminum heads to an iron block and a copper/brass radiator I would think it would become a pretty efficient battery.
I’m thinking the heads are junk/nice looking wall ornaments like mine. Since then (because I ruined a set of aluminum heads) years ago, I check my coolant with a voltmeter. Around 400 millivolts, I change it out.

 

[Ziggster]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

I’m curious to see what the actual problem was, so hoping the OP keeps us updated. The car had always seemed to run hot, there is likely another issue other than any potential damage the CLR solution may have done.

 

[Son of a Ford]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

It always ran hot so don’t think the CLR solution damaged anything.

It might make sense that a head gasket is leaking exhaust into the water jacket next step is for me to get the tester to confirm. If positive I could attempt to re-torque and see it that fixes it.

If Fenton Heads have a history of making the flatheads run hot and require additional aftermarket cooling, either a secondary radiator or upgrade to electric fan, that might make sense why nothing I’m trying is really making a difference.

When the car was first purchased it had Offenhauser heads, I might see if those are still around.

 

[19Fordy]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

I know it's already been mentioned but, do a combustion leak test.

 

[Ziggster]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

If you don’t already have an infrared thermometer, I would suggest you buy one. It could help in the diagnostics. I got this one and it’s very handy.

https://www.amazon.ca/ThermoPro-TP30-Thermometer-Temperature-Measure（NOT/dp/B07VTPJXH9

 

[petehoovie]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

It always ran hot so don’t think the CLR solution damaged anything.

It might make sense that a head gasket is leaking exhaust into the water jacket next step is for me to get the tester to confirm. If positive I could attempt to re-torque and see it that fixes it.

If Fenton Heads have a history of making the flatheads run hot and require additional aftermarket cooling, either a secondary radiator or upgrade to electric fan, that might make sense why nothing I’m trying is really making a difference.

When the car was first purchased it had Offenhauser heads, I might see if those are still around.

 

[wga]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

I had similar issues with stock 49, and what helped me was finding a shop that had a exhaust gas analyzer, they used it to detect exhaust gas just inside the radiator. Reading
was over 100PPM. Removed the cast iron heads, machine shop removed .007" from each head. Reassembled with "Best" gasket brand with a coating of copper spray. No more running hot issues. I also did everything you have done - vinegar in the cooling system, back flush, removed water pumps and blasted the internal passages, sealed the cooling system with Irontite sealer. BTW, exhaust gas reading after reassembly was 5 PPM, it barely registered on the digital gauge.

 

[wga]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

I had similar issues with stock 49, and what helped me was finding a shop that had a exhaust gas analyzer, they used it to detect exhaust gas just inside the radiator. Reading
was over 100PPM. Removed the cast iron heads, machine shop removed .007" from each head. Reassembled with "Best" gasket brand with a coating of copper spray. No more running hot issues. I also did everything you have done - vinegar in the cooling system, back flush, removed water pumps and blasted the internal passages, sealed the cooling system with Irontite sealer. BTW, exhaust gas reading after reassembly was 5 PPM, it barely registered on the digital gauge.

 

[Joe B.]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

Hope you get it figured out. Any white smoke in the exhaust, does one spark plug look cleaner than the others,motor oil look ok? That's a sharp looking engine bay, How about a picture or two of the car for another '50 owner.

 

[Son of a Ford]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

I had similar issues with stock 49, and what helped me was finding a shop that had a exhaust gas analyzer, they used it to detect exhaust gas just inside the radiator. Reading
was over 100PPM. Removed the cast iron heads, machine shop removed .007" from each head. Reassembled with "Best" gasket brand with a coating of copper spray. No more running hot issues. I also did everything you have done - vinegar in the cooling system, back flush, removed water pumps and blasted the internal passages, sealed the cooling system with Irontite sealer. BTW, exhaust gas reading after reassembly was 5 PPM, it barely registered on the digital gauge.

Very interesting, sounds similar to what I’ve got going on. I’m going to do the head gasket tester that hooks onto where the radiator cap installs and see what happens.

Feels like I’m getting closer to the solution.

 

[Son of a Ford]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

Hope you get it figured out. Any white smoke in the exhaust, does one spark plug look cleaner than the others,motor oil look ok? That's a sharp looking engine bay, How about a picture or two of the car for another '50 owner.

No smoke at all coming out the pipes. All the plugs look the same, pretty clean.

Just before going after the overheating issue I removed the pan and cleaned everything, flushed with diesel and switched over to VR1.

Everything on the bottom side of the engine is clean.

 

[petehoovie]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

No smoke at all coming out the pipes. All the plugs look the same, pretty clean.

Just before going after the overheating issue I removed the pan and cleaned everything, flushed with diesel and switched over to VR1.

Everything on the bottom side of the engine is clean.

 

[Son of a Ford]

Re: 53 8BA Flathead Running Hot – Looking for Cooling Advice

Found a picture of the engine back in 2010 before it was installed.

I’m already suspecting that the alternator bracket above the left thermostat housing is going to be where the head gasket would be leaking.

I was reading back at my dad’s notes about getting the correct clearance and I think there may have been a lot of on and off with those 3 head bolts.

Will head out to the shop and do the leak test in a few hours.