Weird Knock in Neutral With Clutch Out

The general consensus is to not drive the car until you fix the problem inside the transmission. You probably knew all along that was the answer, but it's difficult to face up to such a major P.I.A. repair job, plus the lost time driving. If you have ever seen what happens when a Model A transmission lets go, it's not a pretty picture. Someone posted a photo of just exactly that a while back. The gears had blown out through the side of the transmission case. I don't recall the cause, but it was something similar to your problem that went ignored until the transmission made the final decision. I am guessing when this ****** blew apart, it brought the car to a skidding stop in traffic. Not a particularly pleasant experience.
In 1974 during a cross-country drive from Arizona to Iowa in my 1928 Roadster after reassembling the rear end, in my rush to finish the car, I had neglected to put 600w into the now-dry differential. The gears and bearings only had a light coat of lube left on them from pre-disassembly use. 50 miles from my destination, the rear end locked up on I-80 at 55mph. The car skidded from one lane to the other and then off onto the side of the road, the front of the car having swapped ends with the rear. I was now facing on-coming traffic coming at me at 75mph. Pants wetting time! I was lucky, though. Had there been a truck or car in the lane next to me when this happened, we'd both just be memories now. If your transmission lets go and locks up the rear end, you may experience the same Nantucket Sleigh Ride that I did when my rear end locked up!
Park it and fix it.
Marshall
 
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Marshall, At my age I am forgetting things. I can see me forgetting to put oil in something like you did. So I make lists. I sit down at the kitchen table and make a list of the things I need to do for a repair or some other project. As I think of more things I add them to the list. As things are completed they get crossed off.

I am glad you were not hurt when your roadster did an 180.
 
Marshall...You hit my sentiments exactly. My first post was in the heat of being pissed off. I just did other work on the A and experienced some unexpected expenses within the house... but rest assured the A is parked awaiting emergency surgery. Thanks for the words of support.
 
"My first post was in the heat of being pissed off."

Welcome to the "Pissed Off Old F*rt Club", Henry Ford co-founder (along with all those %$^&*# FoMoCo engineers, who made our lives miserable with some mighty stupid parts designs). You are not alone in your frustration with Model A's and are in good company. Every reader here can identify with your recent experience. I can't count all the scars my poor body has been carrying for decades (and counting!) because of the way those Model A designers laid out our favorite car, not exactly designed for ease of repair. But I've learned that when repairing the Model A, for every complicated, difficult to understand, insurmountable problem, there is a simple, easy to understand WRONG answer, usually in the form of taking shortcuts or making a temporary repair that never works. I've posted this before, but when repairing cars, there is nothing more temporary as a permanent repair and nothing as permanent as a temporary repair. The repair we make in anger usually ends up costing us more money and effort in the long run. You're on the right track now. You'll have peace of mind once you have made the transmission repair properly.
And be sure to come back and tell us what you found was the cause of the noise and what you did to effect a repair. We can all learn from your pain. :)
Marshall
P.S. Attached are just a couple of examples of what Model A's have done to me while I was trying to help them. And you think YOU were mad!!!
 

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Different Model A's, different scars. A camera wasn't always handy to record ALL the blood and gore caused by working on Model A's and T's over the years. Just yesterday while lying on my back adjusting main bearings in a 1930 Roadster, one of the heavy center main bolts dropped from the cap and hit me in the forehead. Result? A nice gouge just above the eyes with accompanying blood running into my eyes. Before I could crawl out from beneath the car and run to the sink to dampen the flow, I looked as though a sniper had caught me between the eyes. Yup - another day working on Model A's, another scar. Situation normal.
Marshall
 
The Hyatt rollers that Ford used were very good parts. Reproduction replacements made since, not so much. Mac VanPelt @ VanPelt Sales is in the early Ford transmission business. Not so much for model As as V8 types but some parts interchange. If there are any rollers for the Input to main shaft and cluster counter shaft, he would know the best to get. If a person has any old model A transmissions in their parts pile, the original Hyatts bearings in usable condition are preferred over any reproduction parts.

When the engine is running with the trans in neutral & clutch engaged, the input and counter shaft still rotate so any noise is related to the rotating assemblies.
 
"Thank god that bolt didn't hit you straight in the eye!!!"

Indeed. As the German saying goes: "Glück im Unglück". Roughly translated, that means "Luck within misfortune". It could have been worse. Saddled with double glaucoma, a scleral buckle around one eye to keep the detached retina in place and a replaced lens in the other, that's all I would need - a main bearing bolt hitting me in the eye. I guess a new scar on the forehead is better than an empty eye socket. Glück im Unglück. :)
M.
 
OMG Marshall !!! May I suggest safety I wear , I have wrap around clear bifocal glasses and I wear them ! I also have a buckle from a detached retina was blind in at eye for a while , we caught the same thing happening in my other eye before it got worse
 
Marshall V. Daut said:
"My first post was in the heat of being pissed off."

Welcome to the "Pissed Off Old F*rt Club", Henry Ford co-founder (along with all those %$^&*# FoMoCo engineers, who made our lives miserable with some mighty stupid parts designs). You are not alone in your frustration with Model A's and are in good company. Every reader here can identify with your recent experience. I can't count all the scars my poor body has been carrying for decades (and counting!) because of the way those Model A designers laid out our favorite car, not exactly designed for ease of repair. But I've learned that when repairing the Model A, for every complicated, difficult to understand, insurmountable problem, there is a simple, easy to understand WRONG answer, usually in the form of taking shortcuts or making a temporary repair that never works. I've posted this before, but when repairing cars, there is nothing more temporary as a permanent repair and nothing as permanent as a temporary repair. The repair we make in anger usually ends up costing us more money and effort in the long run. You're on the right track now. You'll have peace of mind once you have made the transmission repair properly.
And be sure to come back and tell us what you found was the cause of the noise and what you did to effect a repair. We can all learn from your pain. :)
Marshall
P.S. Attached are just a couple of examples of what Model A's have done to me while I was trying to help them. And you think YOU were mad!!!
Click to expand...


Marshall,
About post 24 and your thumb. 15 years ago I had an accident with a similar looking injury (even the "C" shape). Your thumb looks exactly like mine did the next day.

I bring this up for a couple of reasons:

1. To make a prediction for your future.

2. To ask for your help.

Some time after the accident the thumb nail started growing with deep groove on upper surface. This groove has continued to grow right out to the end of the nail for the last 15 years. Looks like a miniature Grand Canyon.

Doctor says that the thumb nail starts growing under the skin (right under where the injury is), about 3/4 of an inch from the beginning of the nail and since it is damaged under the skin the "valley" is pushed out to where you can see it as it grows.

Note the skin in the area of injury has long since repaired itself and is not noticeable.

1. You might see the same thing in the future!


2. What was the cause of your injury?

I can not remember what caused my injury. I think it MIGHT have been related with removing that large spring from a transmission tower?

Thanks,
Benson
 
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Benson -
Among other half-assed "restoration" work on a 1930 Model A I was trying to straighten out for a friend years ago, some idiot owner installed the stainless steel runningboard trim on the front edge (the short piece) between the front fender and runningboard without tapping the raw edge on the bottom over or trimming it flush with the runningboard. So, about an 1/8" of razor sharp trim extended past the bottom of the runningboard. Of course, old razor-sharp Marshall slid his thumb across this edge as he was pulling himself out from underneath the car. Blood and swear words followed.
There is only a faint line where the wound healed. Absolutely no trouble with future nail growth. The thumbnail matches all my other ones. 'Sorry to read that your wound resulted in thumbnail problems. Maybe your wound was deeper than mine?
Marshall
 
Anyone remember the old photo of Model As being repaired with their front ends suspended 5-6 feet in the air by cables and the mechanics standing underneath? Yikes.
 
Marshall V. Daut said:
Different Model A's, different scars. A camera wasn't always handy to record ALL the blood and gore caused by working on Model A's and T's over the years. Just yesterday while lying on my back adjusting main bearings in a 1930 Roadster, one of the heavy center main bolts dropped from the cap and hit me in the forehead. Result? A nice gouge just above the eyes with accompanying blood running into my eyes. Before I could crawl out from beneath the car and run to the sink to dampen the flow, I looked as though a sniper had caught me between the eyes. Yup - another day working on Model A's, another scar. Situation normal.
Marshall
Click to expand...

I have told my bride several times that a day at the shop without fresh blood is a day I didn’t do much. She remains Not Amused. I buy boxes of Band-Aid at Costco…
 
Here's an update of sorts... Luckily for me Schwalms Model A Shop is relatively close (about 160 miles). I trailered the car to them on Monday. The are going to replace the transmission, clutch and U Joint...along with anything else they see. I'll let you know what they found.
 
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