Hidden water pump bolt/ 8BA

BanjoQ, As I've seen so far you haven't tried heat. At the very least try a propane torch then hammered-on sockets before you chew the heads up with extractors.

Lonnie
 
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Binx- so you are suggesting to heat the metal of the pump around the bolt, or the bolt itself? Heat makes metal expand, right? You think hammering a socket on there will do less damage than the extractor? I'll go out there tomorrow and clean it of any residual solvents and give it a try. Nothing to lose., will see what happens.
 
Heat the head of the bolt for about 5 minutes with a medium flame propane torch. As it cools, touch a birthday cake candle to the casting above the bolt and let it melt behind it. After 5 min, hammer on the tightest fitting 6-point socket (sae or metric) and slightly tighten until you hear a "crack" then turn opposite.

Lonnie
 
I agree with what Binx said in post #21.
If you have a small die grinder or Dremell type tool, go in and try to clean the back wall of the water pump housing around that hex bolt, with a wire brush attachment or maybe some small grinding stones/cutters, without messing up the hex head of the bolt. Apply heat to this cleaned up area on the back wall, around that bolt. If the wall is clean enough to absorb the heat of a torch, then that heat should transfer some into the cast iron on the block that's around the threads of the bolt. It might require more heat than a plumbers propane torch can deliver, so I am thinking an acetylene torch using a small rosebud tip, with gas and air adjusted properly for a good heating flame, but do not apply any extra cutting air. Get that area cherry red, then let it cool down. You might even try some candle wax near the head of the bolt as things cool some and hope it goes into the threads on the bolt. Repeat this heating and cooling cycle a few times before you hammer the correct size metric socket on the bolt head. If you have a hand held impact driver (not talking about an air/electric impact wrench here) that would be your friend here now in getting that bolt to start coming out. Maybe a few cycles of doing a couple impacts to turn the bolt in a tightening direction first, then followed by a couple impacts in the loosening direction, before you try impacting the bolt completely loose enough to back it all the way out. This is what I would suggest doing to get that bolt out in one piece, others here will have their own opinions, I am sure. Good luck, and let us know how it goes :).
 
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Over these many years, I haven't had a problem in getting the bolt in the pump inlet out. A good hardware store should have stainless bolts for replacement. They are as strong, or stronger, than the stock bolts. If the inside of the water pump is as crud encrusted as the picture shows, it is a good bet that the water jacket in the engine is also full of junk.
 
Binx said:
BanjoQ, As I've seen so far you haven't tried heat. At the very least try a propane torch then hammered-on sockets before you chew the heads up with extractors.

Lonnie
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The extractor is the best bet. The bolt is junk anyway if you can fit a 1/2" socket on it. The bolt is 3/8 NC with a 9/16 head.
 
A 3/8 x 16 316 stainless bolt will take a torque load of 247 in. lb. That's 20 foot pounds. The Merc Manual shows that the water pump to block bolts torque is 23 to 28 foot pounds. Would 3 foot pounds be that critical? It would be neat to torque a SS bolt until it begins to deform and then check to see what the torque wrench shows.
 
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I don't see the need for stainless steel. These old bolts have been in there for 50 - 80 years and mostly all come out. And undoubtedly they did not have the quality of coolants we have today.
 
Well, I had some time today to work on my truck. Threw some heat at the pumps and struck the bolt heads with a piece of bar stock and a hammmer. Got a good grip on the bolts but they would not move. Didn't want to put too much pressure on them, (cheater bar) as they felt like they were ready to snap. Will try an impact wrench tomorrow. Going to have to think on this one. Thanks to all that offered advise. Will keep you all posted.
 
Just keep tinkering with it. Don't get frustrated, enjoy the adventure. We've all been there and will no doubt be dealing with a head scratcher again.
 
I also don't like the stainless bolts. They are normally made of cheese, the 3lb does make a difference of your 3lb over the rating of the bolt. We have to remember these are water pumps and motor mounts.
You need to use antisize on the stainless or they gall then lock up then snap. As Jack said, the regular ones have worked for over half a century.
Martin.
 
If you remove the other bolts, moving the water pump as far from side to side as it can go might help a bit. I know it might not move very far, but moving the pump all the way to the right then moving it to the left as you turn the bolt to the left may just help. I would also try turning the bolt clockwise before turning in the undo-ing direction. A 12mm socket hammered on will get a grip and the hammering will also help.

You might as well just go for it and see if you can get them to turn. If they break they break. Then the welding repairs can begin. I would definitely try clockwise then anti clockwise in very small increments though, repeating many times. If it moves you might be able to get it free enough to come out.

Mart.
 
You are at a point that all you can do now is grip the bolt and remove it .One of two things are going to happen. The bolt comes out or it breaks. After this operation you know your next move.There isn't anything more to do get that pump off.Breaking the bolt is just another learning curve when it comes to repairing one of these old flatties.
You have spent more time reading and replying to these posts that it would take to pull on a breaker bar and get to step number 2.

R
 
Ronnie said:
You are at a point that all you can do now is grip the bolt and remove it .One of two things are going to happen. The bolt comes out or it breaks. After this operation you know your next move.There isn't anything more to do get that pump off.Breaking the bolt is just another learning curve when it comes to repairing one of these old flatties.
You have spent more time reading and replying to these posts that it would take to pull on a breaker bar and get to step number 2.

R
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Totally agree, Too much 'hemming and hawing':rolleyes:
 
I agree too --- as long as he didn't forget to heat it, candle-wax it and bang it hard a half dozen or so times. Maybe even a dozen times. Unless of course he's in a hurry with all kinds of more important stuff he's gotta do too. 8^)

Jack E/NJ
 
Unfortunately, the above "Monday Morning Quarterbacking posts" on a Friday is of no help either. Where were you folks at when this thread started, when you could have advised him to just wrench the damn bolt off from the begining?? Criticism is always the easiest solution, at the end of the day, for those who were not helping in any way from the begining!!
 
No worries boys, I don't take these comments in a bad way. I'm the one who is learning here and I understand. I hope you all know that those of us in the learning phase appreciate all you have to share. If we were talking about three finger roll patterns or cross picking a mandolin I would be the one with advice. Ill keep pressing on and let you all know how it turns out. Thanks again, Q
 
JM 35 Sedan said:
Unfortunately, the above "Monday Morning Quarterbacking posts" on a Friday is of no help either. Where were you folks at when this thread started, when you could have advised him to just wrench the damn bolt off from the begining?? Criticism is always the easiest solution, at the end of the day, for those who were not helping in any way from the begining!!
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Perhaps you should have read post#2. Is that close enough to the beginning?
 
BanjoQ, I just sent you a PM on this. Give this at least another try before you follow some of the previous advice here to just break this bolt off. Let us know how it goes....and good luck to ya man :) Over and out on this one :)
 
Building engine. I always use stainless bolts in that bottom hole and coat it good with (never size). Might help in the next 50 years. Walt
 
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