Will not start, please help

M

Max41

Member
Today I tried, for the first time, to start my 41 flatty. I do not have the entire electrical system connected, that is to say, nothing is connected. So here is what I have.....
First try I had the battery to ground (positive) with a kill switch inline. The negative lead was connected to the starter. I also had a lead from the negative post to the coil with a ballast resistor inline. After several attempts, and lots of gas into the carb, it actually fired. But when I opened the circuit to stop the starter from spinning the engine stopped. I tried it again, again lots of gas into the carb, and when it fired I switched the key back and forth and it stayed running for a brief second. Each time I switched the key to "on" it would stay running but so did the starter!!
Next I put the kill switch between the negative post and the starter, positive to ground, and a lead from the negative post to the coil, again via a resistor, lots of gas into the carb, and I actually got one cylinder to fire then nothing.
I have air, spark, and fuel, but it will not start. I had a good day working in my garage, and I know this is part of the deal with this hobby, but....
Any and all help will be greatly apperciated.

Max
 
Sounds like your starter and ign are on when starting .that's ok
should have ign in run position just turned on, or wire direct from battery to coil by way of switch or just unhook for testing.
 
Max,

I'm going to assume your "kill" switch, the "key" and "ignition" switch you mentioned are all one in the same and that you are not using the dash circuits in any way.

On your first attempt, you switched off your positive ground and that disconnected all circuits (starter and ignition). On the second go, switching the neg lead to the battery should only start/stop the starter (this is correct) and the ignition is always on as long as the neg lead with the resistor is connected to the coil.

A couple of things to check:

1) You mention a lot of fuel. You might be flooding the carb. If you put a bunch of gas in the carb throat it won't atomize and you won't get an adequate fuel mixture. If you continue to try, the liquid fuel will only make it worse. Try opening the throttle plates a little but not adding more fuel. If the plugs have wet gas on them, they might not have a good spark internally even if you test and get a good spark externally.

2) You didn't say what value of resistance you were using or whether you were using 6V or 12V. You may have too much resistance with your ballast resistor and the voltage at the coil might be too low causing a weak spark. Off-hand, I can't remember the values of resistance for 6V and 12V resistors. Check Ford barn ignition resistor posts and you'll probably find the value you need. The other option is to remove the resistor. While this will put full voltage across the points, you're presumably not going to run the engine very long and likely won't burn them up. I ran my 47 COE without a resistor for 4 years until I discovered it didn't have one (previous owner must have removed it) and the truck did have burned points but that didn't stop it from running.

3) I assume you've checked your coil, condenser and distributor grounds and have gapped the plugs correctly. There's been plenty of discussion lately about crappy components and it took me 3 months of troubleshooting to discover that the new condenser I installed was a factory-issued faulty.

Best of luck...

Dan
 
You said you have the neg. side of the batt direct to the starter. You cain't do that. When you turn on the kill switch the started will stay running until you kill the switch. You have to have the batt going to a selinoid then to the starter. energize the sel and the starter will spin. Walt
 
All, thanks for the help.
In short, I am using 6V everything.
I have the positive lead to ground on the block. The negative lead goes to the starter via an on/off switch. There is another separate negative lead going to the coil via a resistor. My thought is once the engine fires and runs, I open (turn off) the switch stopping the starter. With the negative lead going the the coil and a good ground the engine should run until I pull the coil lead or the battery dies. Does this sound correct?
The dist was rebuilt by Bubbas. They checked the coil and condenser, all checked out satisfactory. I understand they are good at what they do.
Next try I will try backing off a little on the fuel as the pump was doing a good job, that is the accelerator pump was shooting a solid stream of fuel into the carb when stroked.
I'll get there, having a blast trying!
For what it is worth, this car was bought by my great grandfather, who gave it to his sister, who gave it to my dad, who gave it to me.
 
So you are using the kill switch in stead of a starter solenoid? That should work for a quick run-up. If the wire that feeds the coil via the ballast is connected to the battery negative terminal that should also work.

Pos on battery must be grounded by a heavy cable.

Mart.
 
You need two basic circuits. The first is for the starter motor. + to ground on the engine block, - through a push button solenoid (heavy duty) like the 1940 firewall solenoid from the solenoid to the starter motor electrical terminal. With this circuit you can push the button and the starter motor will turn the engine over.
The second circuit is for the coil and the distributor. Since you already have the battery + to ground your good to go. Then - through a small toggle switch, to the resistor, coil, and then the distributor. Since for 40 coil sits on top of the distributor there is no need for additional wires past the resistor to coil wire.
First turn ON the small toggle switch, then push the large button for the starter motor to turn the engine over, when the engine starts release the large solenoid and the engine should remain running until you turn the small toggle switch to off.
 
Terry, OH,
Thanks. I have it wired that way you describe with one exception. The starter is wired via a on/off switch. Once the engine starts I open that switch. The coil circuit I have an alligator clip to the neg post running through the resistor to the coil. I clip that on just prior to turning over the starter. Once it starts I will disconnect the clip from the batt to the coil to stop the engine. Does this sound like it should work to you?

Thanks for the input.

What part of Ohio do you live? I was born in Dayton, grew up in Kettering.
 
Dick,
I do. I actually had it running for a few seconds when I had the kill switch wired into the ground. Of course when I opened the switch to stop the starter from spinning I shut down the circuit.
That being said do you think the way I now have it wired will work. This is of course temporary. I just want to start the thing, circulate some oil, look for big issues, heat it up a bit then shut it down.

Max 41
 
Max: Your wiring sounds as if it should work. Just make sure that when you reach in to attach or remove wires you are doing this safely and will not be hit by moving or hot parts. The ignition resistor does get very hot and was made to operate on a fixed board and mounted in a stable area.
 
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