When was my A built?

C

Cider

Member
I bought a Murray 30-31 town sedan body and frame only. The body tag on the firewall says M 604 which tells me it is a 30-31 Town Sedan. There is also another body no stamped on that tag which is 14277. I can not find any no.s on the frame near the clutch pedal area or on the cross member. Can anyone point me in the right direction to figure out the production date and location of this car? There is no engine with it.
 
If the frame is in decent condition, i.e. not a lot of rust pitting on it, there should be a frame id stamp below where the left cowl would be (top of frame). If you can use a wire brush or some such device (not a sander) you should be able to find the serial number of the frame. The frame number and engine originally matched, but over the years many engines were replaced, but the frames were usually not. With the serial number, there are charts available that will tell you what the day, month and year the car was made. If you get the frame number, you can post it on Fordbarn and people with the document can tell you the date of mfg. Hope this helps.
Rusty Nelson
 
look on the top frame rail on the drivers side just a little forward of where the hinges of the front door are. This area is under the cowel so if the body is still on the frame you will have to lift the body to see the numbers. A recent thread brought up the thought that some Canadian cars don't have a number stamped on the frame. If you find the serial number you can find the build date on the mafca site I believe. Happy hunting.
 
Thank you for your help. I will look more closely tomorrow. Is there any information that can be learned from the body no. tag 14277?
 
Thank you so much for all the info - My car doesn't have a dash in it, so from a glance I can't tell if it had the oval or round speedo, but I can fit a new dash in to see which will fit.
 
I could not find any no.s on the frame, drivers side, under the cowl area, but the dash is for an oval shaped speedo, so I believe it is a Murray Town Sedan built in between February and July, 1930.

I also own a Briggs Town Sedan that has a round speedo and a tag on the firewall that is completely illegible. I could not find any numbers on this frame either - but the car is all together and I did not lift the body off the frame for a better look. Nothing on the front cross member. The motor no. is: "star A1350 star". I am going to see when the motor was manufactured. I have no idea if it is the original engine though.
 
The engine number you presented was originally built on 12/03/27.

As a rebuilt engine I would not think that the rebuilder would have stamped it in the style of Ford (*A####*). I would think he would have just stamped it with his own number.
 
You should be able to date the car by the parts assuming it has the original chassis. The engine date is nice to know but you really need to date the parts too. The JS uses 60 days but your engine date could be only a few days or in some cases as long as a year (if pulled from the line for repairs) before the assembly date. Depending on where and when in the 4 or 5 year Model A production years your car was assembled will determine how soon your engine was installed. Just make a calender table with months across the top and list major or easily dated parts on the left of the table from the JS. Color in the date ranges for each part you find on you car. If you do enough parts you will end up with a "best fit" date range of when you car was most likely assembled. The more parts you date and the more original the car is the more accurate your date will be. You should be able to date your car accurately between 1 to 3 months of the actual date of assembly.
 
If your engine # is *A1350*, it should have a 5 bearing cam in it. This is a feature of the early blocks, and was discontinued in late 28. The date of 12/03/27 would be probably correct for the motor only. If it does not have the 5 bearing cam, then it is a later re-stamp. Can you take a picture of it (the #) with a ruler under it to show the size of the raised pad? Steve Plucker is doing research on these early blocks, and I am sure he would appriecate it!
 
Cider said:
I bought a Murray 30-31 town sedan body and frame only. The body tag on the firewall says M 604 which tells me it is a 30-31 Town Sedan. There is also another body no stamped on that tag which is 14277. I can not find any no.s on the frame near the clutch pedal area or on the cross member. Can anyone point me in the right direction to figure out the production date and location of this car? There is no engine with it.
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Cider, I bought a Rolling Chassis, to build a Huckster Van. Some one removed the Body, but left on the Cowl, as pictured Below. The Tag on my Cowl is M 604 with #'s 14428 on it which is close to Yours. The #'s on the Engine Block and Frame are Matching *A 2905225* which is 2/21/1930 So maybe yours was made around the same time Feb, 1930. Being a Early 1930 made before June 1930. Check out your gas tank, you cannot install a instrument panel with a Round Speedometer where their should be a Oval One.
 

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The dash is made for an oval speedo, so the car is likely an early 30. I have taken out the first body-to-frame bolt near the cowl on the driver's side and pried the body off the frame about 1/2" to try to see a frame no. I couldn't see any. I am afraid to take the entire body off the frame. Won't it twist and get all mis-shapen since the body frame is all wood?
 
I took the body off the frame and still can not find any no.s on the frame. There is some surface rust, but not much. It looks like the frame has been re-painted. How large are the no.s? Are they stamped parallel with the frame or perpendicular? How many inches from the first body bolt hole & towards the front or back?

Is it better to lightly sand to help find the no.s?
 
Jim Masons site had great pis to show the location. Did anyone print out that page when the site was up. God I miss that site!
 
Cider Mill said:
I took the body off the frame and still can not find any no.s on the frame. There is some surface rust, but not much. It looks like the frame has been re-painted. How large are the no.s? Are they stamped parallel with the frame or perpendicular? How many inches from the first body bolt hole & towards the front or back?

Is it better to lightly sand to help find the no.s?
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I just took a couble pic's of my bare frame showing the location of the frame numbers. I can email them to you if you want. They used the same "number stamp" size on the frame as the engine. Yeah, you can try sanding the area. Maybe with a light pencil trace on paper you can get something to pop up. I'll need your email address if you want the pic's . Rusty
 
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