T5 to flathead questions

There is the 4spd, emergency break and then a lever under the passenger seat that activates the mystery unit. seems to have two positions one the truck go's into a super low , crawling gear. The second position seems to disconnect it, truck drives at a higher gear, more streetable
 
Any way you could get a picture of the drive line

OK you have your 4 speed do you have a drive shaft between the 4 speed and the other box then a drive shaft to your transfer case ??
 
Another t5 question. What is involved to change the speed o drive back to a mechanical drive when you have an S10 trans that has an electronic set up as it is a later model.Is it only the tail shaft housing or is the main shaft different also. My buddy is in the process of doing one in a 48 truck as we speak. He wants to keep the old speedometer setup that the truck has.
Thanks in advance



Ronnie.
 
Another t5 question. What is involved to change the speed o drive back to a mechanical drive when you have an S10 trans that has an electronic set up as it is a later model.Is it only the tail shaft housing or is the main shaft different also. My buddy is in the process of doing one in a 48 truck as we speak. He wants to keep the old speedometer setup that the truck has.
Thanks in advance



Ronnie.

The mainshaft is usually different. There is a raised area where the speedometer drive gear (or metal sprocket for electronic senders) sits and locks into the mainshaft. There is a guy on eBay that sells a kit to reposition it.
 
Another t5 question. What is involved to change the speed o drive back to a mechanical drive when you have an S10 trans that has an electronic set up as it is a later model.Is it only the tail shaft housing or is the main shaft different also. My buddy is in the process of doing one in a 48 truck as we speak. He wants to keep the old speedometer setup that the truck has.
Thanks in advance Ronnie.

There are several articles on this topic. This one touches on the subject, but there are many others with different approaches.
 

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There are lots of sites that talk of the swap but most are Camaro and ford mustangs we need to find out the difference if any between early and late S10 trans when the speed o needs to be non electronic. He has both tail shaft housings either the gear has to be re positioned or a new main shaft needs to be found. It also may not have a gear but a reluctor wheel. Haven't taken the tail shaft off yet.



R
 
I am sure the gear has to be repositioned, I'm not sure about changing the main shaft, I've never looked into that. I started out wanting to use the mechanical speedometer cable, but overtime have decided it's just not worth it to me. There are other ways to go that are more appealing to me.
 
One idea I had was to take out the transfer case, disconnecting the front drive shaft. Taking out the 'other tans type box' in-between the transfer case and 4spd transmission, I have no idea what this unit is for. Then getting a t5 and running the drive shaft to the rear. Thinking the 5th gear would help with cruising speed. Or
I could change the gears in both axles and just take out the middle unit, keeping the transfer case and 4spd . Does anyone know of someone that sells gears for a heavy duty rear ? Maybe used sets? Which might make them more affordable ?


What's your end goal with the truck? To have a big truck and 4 wheel with a little more top end speed? Or a truck you can cruise 70 all day long? Just curious. If that later mentioned, a chassis swap might be better. Not that a 42 big truck had better highway gears.



Just seems that someone would want a MH setup and might swap you out. Maybe on one of the restoration sites. Seems like there is a better/easier solution if you want a highway cruiser.


If you just want some more top end speed. Then dif changes might help some. It is a well designed system. Change one thing it could really effect the other parts of the system in a negitive way.
 
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Rather than modifying that truck, why not sell it and find something you like.
I would think that the M/H in unmodified condition is a desirable item to some people.
Just a thought
Jim
 
Wow...…....The T5 "answers" given in this thread are all over the board. That being said, JSeery shows some VERY good identification info on the basic T5. What I USUALLY try to remember when discussing T5s is that we're trying to HOOK IT UP TO A FLATHEAD FORD. Seery likes the 'Ford' renditions of T5s in a WC (World Class) flavor. The Ford version is a little harder to hook-up to a flathead....MY opinion!


I guess that what MOST folks still don't realize is that the BASIC T5 design needs to be thought of as a front half, and a rear half. The front half (the main case with gears for 1st gear thru 4th gear) can easily accommodate the REAR half (tail shaft HOUSING and MAIN shaft) from another configuration, like the infamous S-10.....it all bolts right up! What most guys are really looking for is the FORWARD shifter location that the S-10 trans offers. What MOST guys don't realize is that a complete transmission from an S-10 is probably going to have a 4.03 or 3.76 1st gear ratio. A Camaro T5 is going to have a 2.95 1st gear. That ratio is extremely close to the stock 1st gear ratio of 2.82 found in most old Ford transmissions. That 4.03 1st gear in an S-10 is going to be like installing a "DOUBLE GRANNY" gear for 1st. So, swap an S-10 TAIL SHAFT HOUSING and even the S-10 MAIN shaft from an earlier NWC S-10 application onto the REAR of your '83 thru '87 Camaro V8 T5. Best of all worlds, and it all bolts-up.


The whole idea here (especially in the case of the original poster in this thread) is to SLOW-DOWN the RPMs of the flathead engine at any given highway speed. The OVERDRIVE ratio of the above-mentioned Camaro T5 (with S-10 REAR parts bolted-on) is going to be ".63". This means that when you put your M-H into overdrive at some ridiculously-slow top speed in 4th gear, the engine RPM will decrease to 63% of whatever the RPM was when you shifted. As the 1st gear ratio NUMBER increases in value (2.95 vs 4.03), the torque rating of the transmission DECREASES, because of the torque-multiplication imposed on the aluminum gear case.


One more note.....there's not a thing wrong with the NWC T5s. They're just as strong (gear-wise) as a WC (World Class) T5. The main differences between WC and NWC is the bearing types used, and the friction material used on the synchronizers. The only rule one must remember.....DO NOT mix WC parts with NWC parts. The NWC Camaro FRONT half that I promote here can easily accept the NWC S-10 MAIN shaft that will match the MECHANICAL speedometer gear location on the S-10 TAIL SHAFT housing.


And yes, how about that Jeep T5 that bolts-up to the Dana 300 x-fer case? We know about that oddball, too. That is the basic REAR half of a T5 that we bolted-up to a NWC Camaro FRONT half to end-up with the MUCH-shortened T5 that HEARD and I engineered to put in his '35 pick-up....BOLTED TO the original, shortened torque tube. The Jeep trans (rear half) is strange in that it is only 6" front to rear, and the main shaft has a really oddball 23-spline output. Click on the "T5 W/TORQUE TUBE " at the bottom left of this post for the WHOLE story on that trip. DD


Below, our little short T5....Camaro front half, Jeep rear half!


picture.php



Below, a standard T5 front half, with S-10 tail shaft housing and Main shaft (REAR half). A Camaro V8 input shaft would have 26-splines.


368592
 
The mystery unit is likely a "Brownie" type under drive box. The rear axle is the usual Timken design of the time. They only had a few ratios and they are all low speed. The 5.14:1 is the better of the three. A lot of folks change them out for a modern Dana 60 which also gives modern wheel selection for it. There are also Dana 60 front axles that might be an alternative. There are a lot of road worthy ratios for them.

Taking the underdrive out and getting an overdrive that will work with a decent transfer case would get it to go faster.

The T18 & Dana 20 or 300 may work or some of the new process stuff. At least this would still be in the 1 to 1 1/2-ton capacity. The T5 is not really in that category and that is a big truck.

They made brownie type overdrives too. I don't know if they used Brown Lipe stuff in that truck or not since there were other underdrive/overdrive manufacturers out there at the time. I think I would look into that first since it would be the easiest way to speed the old truck up. You likely won't be blowing snow with it any time soon.
 
Good writeup V8coop! Only problem I have found with this is the S10 trannys are getting harder to find. The other issue to me, I was able to purchase new aftermarket Ford T5Zs very cheap and really didn't like tearing them down to change the parts. So figured out ways around all the issues that work for me. But it does take a little extra fabrication effort, such as fabing my own adapters and addressing the shifter location and speedometer drive. This is just stuff I do, not something I would recommend to anyone unless they have access to the required machinery and enjoy the challange.
 
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Good writeup V8coop! Only problem I have found with this is the S10 trannys are getting harder to find.


JSeery ………….I appreciate the kudos for the write-up. I only continue to do so because so many folks who "talk" about T5s seem to not understand the versatility of the basic design, in that so many Borg-Warner factory parts are interchangeable and can be applied to the 'every day' core T5 candidate, to be able to custom-build a transmission that can suit one's needs in more ways than one. An incredibly important factor here is peoples' basic misunderstanding of gear ratios, and how those ratios can make or break the drivability of a car. Then, when combining the wrong range of transmission gear ratios with a particularly awkward rear end ratio, drivability and performance can go "south" very quickly. And, I guess the one that we continue to hear over and over is the guy stating that he needs an S-10 trans, to get the shifter location many inches forward of some T5s, yet having no knowledge of the abysmal gear ratios that come standard inside an S-10 trans. They work good in an S-10 truck, but awful in your new flathead project. Obtain the T5 'rear half' parts necessary and bolt them to your preferred (usually V8 Camaro w/2.95 1st gear) T5 front half.


Specific T5 parts like S-10 tail shaft housings and main shafts can be found individually at shops that specialize in T5s, standard-transmission-specific shops in general, eBay...…..they're all over the internet. Junk (for parts) transmissions are all over most swap meets. I just think that a lot of folks are missing the overall flexibility that the basic T5 design offers when trying to put together a custom transmission. DD
 
Totally agree on the gear ratios, and the 2:95 1st gear is very close to the original Ford 3-speed 1st gear. And you need a low enough rear axle gear to work with the OD ratio. It is fairly simple to calculate the various engine rpms vs speed with the different OD / Axles combinations.
 
I found this info on a similar truck that was set up to lay pipe. It's an interesting article and gives a person an idea of what was used in the MH conversions on the Sno-Go.
http://www.fourwheeler.com/features...n-ford-cm6-4-a-restored-and-rare-4x4-wrecker/


The Fuller company is still making transfer cases and over/under drives but I doubt any one there knows much about those old beasts. The gearing seems to be similar. It was also changed over to an 8BA engine at some point.


I also found it interesting how they made there front axles from the old Timken design.
 
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