swap 1946 spindle left to right?

[stude333]

I want to know if I can swap a left front spindle for the right, if the steering arms have been removed. I am using bolt-through bolt-on dropped steering arms. or is there some geometry in the spindle that would prevent this. The reason i am asking is the right
spindle that I have has a 1/8" undersize seal journal for some reason. but the left spindle has the correct size seal journal. I am hoping someone knowledgeable can answer this.

 

[V8COOPMAN]

I want to know if I can swap a left front spindle for the right, if the steering arms have been removed. I am using bolt-through bolt-on dropped steering arms. or is there some geometry in the spindle that would prevent this. The reason i am asking is the left spindle that I have has a 1/8" undersize seal journal for some reason. but the left spindle has the correct size seal journal. I am hoping someone knowledgeable can answer this.

Man, what a strange request! But that's one of the cool things about this place....SOMEONE will likely have a reasonable answer.

By "seal journal", I'm reasoning that you're talking about the round, raised, flat surface that the seal rides on at the inboard end behind the inner bearing. I'm trying to imagine HOW or WHY that could have ended-up that way.

As for an answer .....IF it were me, I'd get another spindle. BUT....to YOUR question! IF, as you say, you are going to cut the steering arm off of the replacement spindle and use bolt-on, then I really see no reason why you can't do as you say. The RIGHT & LEFT spindles have equal king pin inclination angles for camber considerations. NOTHING comes to my mind geometry-wise that would preclude swapping like you intend.

Just to be sure of what you have, do both spindles have a "21A-" number forged into them? The reason I ask is that what you describe are "SQUARE-back" 1942-'48 spindles, which are numbered as 21A-****. I'm wondering if it is possible that your oddball spindle could possibly be a '40s Lincoln spindle, which also has a "SQUAR-ISH" back or base to it. Plus, the Lincoln takes a bigger king pin than the Ford, and the angle is quite different. Could you possibly post a picture of the two spindles? DD

 

[woodiewagon46]

Another thing you could do is to take the spindle to a machine shop and have them cut and press on a sleeve to bring the seal "journal" back up to stock size.

 

[cas3]

you can buy seals in almost any imaginable size, have you looked for one that fits your odd ball spindle?

 

[deuce lover]

You'll have to relocate the grease zerks

 

[rich b]

Once the arms are cut off; side makes no difference.

Should be able to find a seal that works on the reduced shaft; just get an accurate measurement of the diameter and check the size charts.

Seems odd; but people can be resourceful when "saving" parts.

 

[stude333]

i had bought a pair of spindles with no arms on ebay one had the smaller dia seal journal and one had the standard dia for which i had alreday installed my new seal. I had went ahead and used the left spindle on the right assuming the geometry was centered. It went together fine. however i had a nightmare I had done something wrong, which prompted this question. So far I am hearing it will be OK. thanks for your answers folks

 

[Ol' Ron]

I wouldn't think a set of spinals would be that hard to find. what does a set go forthese days??
gramps

 

[JSeery]

Yes, you can swap the spindles side to side if you remove the steering arms.

 

[PeteVS]

Check to see if the backing plate holes are "clocked" differently. The front axle has a "lean back" a bit. (Is this caster?) The holes should "lean forward" to get the wheel cylinder top dead center. If that's the case, swapping the spindle side to side will put the wheel cylinder leaning way to the back so that you might not be able to bleed it properly.

Or are the backing plate holes clocked a bit???

 

[stude333]

I appreciate it

 

[Als48]

I had a set of spindles modified to accept GM disc brakee hubs and seals back in the 70's. If I remember correctly, I had to reduce the seal and inner bearing diameter and shorten the spindle an inch or so. That's probably what you are seeing in your spindles.

Al Hook

 

[Pete]

You can swap side to side and run the tie rod in front also. Been done many times.

 

[V8COOPMAN]

You can swap side to side and run the tie rod in front also. Been done many times.

Problem with runnin' the tie rod in front, especially on a street-driven car, is that it blows the "Ackerman Geometry" all to hell. DD

 

[Pete]

Problem with runnin' the tie rod in front, especially on a street-driven car, is that it blows the "Ackerman Geometry" all to hell. DD

Most street rod people have never heard of Ackerman.

 

[V8COOPMAN]

Most street rod people have never heard of Ackerman.

Nevertheless, the car will still steer like a pile of dog-doo if you don't at least attempt to approximate the rules, and placing the tie rod IN FRONT of the axle will exacerbate the problem to about the worst degree imaginable, because it is about impossible to spread the steering arms WIDE-enough (when in the FRONT of axle) because of resultant tire/wheel interference.

True Ackerman steering geometry is shown in the image below. This is defined by
angling the steering arms so that a line drawn between
both the king pin and steering arm pivot points intersects
with the center line of the rear axle.

 

[JSeery]

It was somewhat common to do so on T roadsters once upon a time.

 

[V8COOPMAN]

It was somewhat common to do so on T roadsters once upon a time.

Ironic that you should use that example. It was probably about 45 years or so ago that I happened to be at a "hot-rod" get-together one night, and this was the first time that the Ackerman Theory (I knew the term....just didn't understand the effect, YET) finally 'sunk-in' to my 'pea-brain'. This was all happening at a smaller shopping center where they had just recently top-coated the asphalt parking lot. Man, the surface was slick, and seems like I remember it being SOOO smooth and ALMOST shiny. A cute little T-bucket drove-in and pulled to a stop just behind me. I turn to look as he fumbles around trying to get the thing in reverse so as to back into an empty parking spot like everyone else had. One of the very first things I notice about this little car is that it has a Ford I-beam axle rather than the usually-seen chrome tube axles that "T" guys usually ran on 'buckets'. Even more-noticeable was the Front-mounted tie rod which stuck-out like a sore thumb. Well, just as the guy had turned the wheel LEFT and began moving backwards toward the spot, the mis-aligned front tires began squealing like little piglets....all the way back into the spot. He was still crooked in the space, so he selected forward and turned the wheel toward the right to pull forward and attempt to straighten-out. Sure enough, the tires squealed again until he stopped and straightened-out the wheel. As he now backed into the slot, the wheel was pretty-much straight, and the tires were pretty-much quiet, although as he turned the wheel slightly back and forth while backing-up for the final time, you could definitely hear the tires chirping any time the tires were not PERFECTLY straight. It became so evident immediately, just how mis-aligned the front tires actually were, fighting against each other EVERY time the tires were aimed anywhere other than precisely straight ahead. I can only imagine trying to drive something like that on a wet road surface. Not only "not cool", but awfully embarrassing if it were MY car doing that. DD

 

[PeteVS]

I've seen some cars with the tie rod ahead of the axle. It seems that if a line was drawn from the king pin through the center of the banjo, the tie rod end could lie on that line either behind OR ahead of the axle.

 

[rich b]

Here are a couple of pictures showing front tie rods with both bad and good Ackerman; but note that the one with good Ackerman has terrible scrub radius.