Suggestion for those fighting "no spark" gremlins

[markyb]

I've had an intermittent problem with a no-spark issue and the engine cutting out while driving. It seems to happen occasionally when I was adjusting the spark advance, but not always (making it harder to diagnose). IT happened again today, and I suspected the wire leading the points below the top plate of my modern points, so I added shrink tubing to the entire length of the wire, and while checking for continuity on the points arm it was shorting again. I removed the top plate, and while checking for continuity I noticed that it shorted again when I pushed the tester probe down on the bottom plate. Sure enough, it appears to be the bottom plate making contact with the inside of the distributor housing. I could see the arc spots on the bottom section that connects to the ignition wire. It's such a critical issue, I was surprised to see so much metal on that part of the plate, making a short very likely. I'm going to grind down at least an eighth inch to make sure that there's no chance for continuity there again.

My camera wouldn't focus real well on the part, but you'll get the idea...

 

[Mitch//pa]

and these

 

[James Rogers]

If the ignition wire is screwed in too far it will cause the short you are showing.

 

[Skipstaxidermy]

Why can't we just eliminate the contact with the lower plate and just cut off the pigtail and run a wire directly to the points? Skip

 

[markyb]

That's what I was thinking of doing, Maybe due to the movement of the upper plate and the accompanying stress and flexing of the upper wire the design allows for an somewhat easy change of it in the event of failure. It might even have more strands in it to tolerate flexing vs. the main ignition wire...


"If the ignition wire is screwed in too far it will cause the short you are showing. "

On my modern points lower plate the attachment of the ignition wire is well away from the inside wall of the distributor. Does the style of the factory plate have a screw closer to the distributor body?

 

[markyb]

since the upper plate pivots for the manual spark advance /retard it wouldn't supply a guaranteed ground path back to the coil.

Now that you mention that, I was thinking of adding some grease to the top plate where it slides against the distributor housing. On second thought, that's where the plate picks up its' ground, grease may inhibit that connection.

 

[James Rogers]

That's what I was thinking of doing, Maybe due to the movement of the upper plate and the accompanying stress and flexing of the upper wire the design allows for an somewhat easy change of it in the event of failure. It might even have more strands in it to tolerate flexing vs. the main ignition wire...


"If the ignition wire is screwed in too far it will cause the short you are showing. "

On my modern points lower plate the attachment of the ignition wire is well away from the inside wall of the distributor. Does the style of the factory plate have a screw closer to the distributor body?

Do you screw the ignition wire in the side of the distributor?

 

[Tom Wesenberg]

Now that you mention that, I was thinking of adding some grease to the top plate where it slides against the distributor housing. On second thought, that's where the plate picks up its' ground, grease may inhibit that connection.

I keep lots of grease in the center hole and in the outer ring where the tabs fit. I'd rather prevent wear than fix a worn part.

The spring pressure is also the best ground for the top plate and I also grease the spring well. I've never had a ground problem.

 

[Skipstaxidermy]

Mitch, I don't understand. If we are shorting it out by screwing the ignition wire in too far-- and touching the body of the distributor, why then, if we eliminate the potential short by running the wire directly to the points--thus bypassing the potential short--Why would that be a problem? The distributor body is still grounded and the upper plate is still rubbing against it giving it (the electricity) a path . Please excuse my misunderstanding I think I getting old and senile. Skip

 

[markyb]

Do you screw the ignition wire in the side of the distributor?

Mine attaches to the hole in the plate shown in my original post, then the wire from the points attaches to the same plate on the top side and makes a full circle between the upper and lower plates and then pokes through the upper plate hole to the points.

 

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Mitch, I don't understand. If we are shorting it out by screwing the ignition wire in too far-- and touching the body of the distributor, why then, if we eliminate the potential short by running the wire directly to the points--thus bypassing the potential short--Why would that be a problem? The distributor body is still grounded and the upper plate is still rubbing against it giving it (the electricity) a path . Please excuse my misunderstanding I think I getting old and senile. Skip

Skip, Dog here, iffin' we did this, some folks would jump on our "CASE" 'cause it ain't "ORIGINAL"! LOL-LOL
By the way, Skip, what do you stuff? Ol' Bill wants to know. I tole him, "I'm SURE he don't do DOGS"
But he smarted back, "But, somebody??? stuffed TRIGGER, once! Saw a fallin' apart Model A once that needed stuffin' to hold it together!"
I should learn to QUIT askin' questions??? Anonoumous Dog

 

[Mitch//pa]

sorry skip i was thinking backwards it will work.
your not senile i am lol

 

[John S]

I had the exact same problem with a re-pop lower plate. They are a lot thinner than an original and will bend with very little force. Once I found out what it was that was making my car go dead bending the plate back in shape fixed the problem. Next chance I have I'll ditch the re-pop plate and put in a good one.

 

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

sorry skip i was thinking backwards it will work.
your not senile i am lol

NO, Switch, err, I mean, Mitch,
We ain't gettin' SENILE, we just got LOTS in our "filing cabinet" to sort through!
I had the most amazing friend who had NO secondary education, but was the most ingeneous inventor/think tank type guy! He and another man perfected the method of hydrogenating vegetable oil into Margerine, he designed & fabricated crushing & separating equipment for a Tungsten mine, wrote a theory about localizing the area of stroke damage through a color perception test, perfected a method of separating ground tire rubber from the ground tire cords, using static electricity & I could go ON & ON & ON!!!!
The point being, Homer had a great FEAR of becoming SENILE! Once, while lunching with him, I said, "Homer, one consolation, if you ever become senile, you won't know it, and folks won't expect much of you." He LAUGHED & LAUGHED & LAUGHED & LAUGHED 'til our waitress came & inquired, "What are you IDIOTS up to?"
Homer NEVER forgot that day, as if I shared some great "WISDOM" with him. Bill W.

 

[markyb]

NO, Switch, err, I mean, Mitch,
We ain't gettin' SENILE, we just got LOTS in our "filing cabinet" to sort through!
I had the most amazing friend who had NO secondary education, but was the most ingeneous inventor/think tank type guy! He and another man perfected the method of hydrogenating vegetable oil into Margerine, he designed & fabricated crushing & separating equipment for a Tungsten mine, wrote a theory about localizing the area of stroke damage through a color perception test, perfected a method of separating ground tire rubber from the ground tire cords, using static electricity & I could go ON & ON & ON!!!!
The point being, Homer had a great FEAR of becoming SENILE! Once, while lunching with him, I said, "Homer, one consolation, if you ever become senile, you won't know it, and folks won't expect much of you." He LAUGHED & LAUGHED & LAUGHED & LAUGHED 'til our waitress came & inquired, "What are you IDIOTS up to?"


Homer NEVER forgot that day, as if I shared some great "WISDOM" with him. Bill W.

SHEESH! What a guy...and I felt kind of smart for finding my shorted out ignition circuit until you brought up Homer and his great ideas.

Those are some pretty grand accomplishments!

 

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

SHEESH! What a guy...and I felt kind of smart for finding my shorted out ignition circuit until you brought up Homer and his great ideas.

Those are some pretty grand accomplishments!

Mark, Homer built me a little box with 8 low draw bulbs, one common ground wire, 8 long, color coded wires with ALLIGATOR clips. On cars that would only act up momentarily, & at times, I could monitor up to 8 systems at a time!
MAN! I've been BLESSED over the years to learn SO much from some of the most unorthodox, most colorful, Kraziest, funniest, "technicians" you could imagine!!!!
Chief taught me, "There's a time to be quiet & LISTEN! You might learn sumptin'---Believe it or not, there's folks out there that are smarterin' you & me, put together!" Loved that Krazy Dad! Bill W.