John Kuhnast
Well-known member
Looking for opinion of the repro rear axles sold by most venders. Anyone have trouble with these ? Fit OK, Last OK ? Would I be better off looking for good used? Thanks
Rear axles
- Thread starter John Kuhnast
- Start date
John LaVoy
Well-known member
In the Summer 2009 issue of the Model A Times we covered this. We have about 15,000 miles on two the axles with no problems. We had a rear end built by Tom Endy and had him evaluate the axles for fit etc and they were good to go.
MikeK
Well-known member
The originals were one-piece with the spider end upset forged. The weak link was the too-small single keyway and undersized thread for the torque required.
The repro axles, like most repro stuff, are not made the same way. They are two-piece, with the spider slipped over and welded on the axle. There were early reports of some having weld failure. I don't know if that has been fixed.
Despite the reported scarcity of excellent used axles, I don't seem to have trouble coming across them. Some people like new & shiny, some like restored and original. Depends on how much of a hurry you are in.
The repro axles, like most repro stuff, are not made the same way. They are two-piece, with the spider slipped over and welded on the axle. There were early reports of some having weld failure. I don't know if that has been fixed.
Despite the reported scarcity of excellent used axles, I don't seem to have trouble coming across them. Some people like new & shiny, some like restored and original. Depends on how much of a hurry you are in.
CWPASADENA
Well-known member
I bought Repo axles about 6 years ago. They really looked good and fit properly. In six years, I have not had a problem BUT just got the car finished and only have about 150 Miles on it.
If you do use original axles, I would suggest you have them magnifluxed. They have a bad habit of cracking, usually in the area of the keyway.
My experience,
Chris
If you do use original axles, I would suggest you have them magnifluxed. They have a bad habit of cracking, usually in the area of the keyway.
My experience,
Chris
BRENT in 10-uh-C
Well-known member
So, how many different axle manufacturers are the dealers selling? I know that Mark is making some, and I know that Don Snyder was making some. Anyone else?
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Tom Endy
Well-known member
The axles I installed in John LaVoys car looked ok and did fit. He has put a lot of miles on them since, and without a problem. I think he may have obtained them from Snyder, but I am not ceretain. Bratton carries the same axle and they go for about $350 each.
I have seen reproduction axles that were not good quality. A few years ago I did a rear end for a customer and found the inside of the carrier extremely worn on one side on the inside. I replaced the carrier and when I had the assembly together it was locked. It was then I found that one of the axles was a reproduction the owner had had installed a few years earlier. It was larger in the gear area than an original and pushed the spider gear up against the carrier. it must have been locked when it was originally installed, but Henry's 40 horses broke it loose and wallowed out the carrier.
Reproductions of anything are always suspect. I much prefer using original parts. There are still plenty of original axles around at swap meets. The ones to immediately reject are those with the threads damaged or the keys slots wallowed out. I usually bead blast the axles before installation and examine carefully the key slot. If there is a crack it usually starts at the inboard end of the slot. A bright light and a magnifying glass will usually tell you if there is a crack beginning. Cracks and wallowing out are a result of the nut not being torqued down to a nominal 100 foot pounds. This causes the drum hub to be loose on the axle and pressure is applied against the key each time there is acceleration and braking.
Tom Endy
I have seen reproduction axles that were not good quality. A few years ago I did a rear end for a customer and found the inside of the carrier extremely worn on one side on the inside. I replaced the carrier and when I had the assembly together it was locked. It was then I found that one of the axles was a reproduction the owner had had installed a few years earlier. It was larger in the gear area than an original and pushed the spider gear up against the carrier. it must have been locked when it was originally installed, but Henry's 40 horses broke it loose and wallowed out the carrier.
Reproductions of anything are always suspect. I much prefer using original parts. There are still plenty of original axles around at swap meets. The ones to immediately reject are those with the threads damaged or the keys slots wallowed out. I usually bead blast the axles before installation and examine carefully the key slot. If there is a crack it usually starts at the inboard end of the slot. A bright light and a magnifying glass will usually tell you if there is a crack beginning. Cracks and wallowing out are a result of the nut not being torqued down to a nominal 100 foot pounds. This causes the drum hub to be loose on the axle and pressure is applied against the key each time there is acceleration and braking.
Tom Endy
CarlG
Well-known member
John, do you have a comprehensive index to your articles for all the years?
BRENT in 10-uh-C
Well-known member
Tom, are you sure that Brattons is carrying the same axle as Snyders? Don Snyder has told me that his axles are being manufactured by the same company that manufactures new truck axles for Ford. The stamping markings on his are different than that of Marks (--which has Mark stamped on it), and I have one axle that failed (twisted) a couple of years ago that I showed James Rogers today, and it does not have any markings on it whatsoever. That axle came from Brattons about 2 years ago. THAT is what makes me think there are/were at least three rear axle manufacturers, --and like you said, there are some not-do-good axles out there.
It was mentioned that you did some evaluation on the axle shafts, ...so can you elaborate what you did and how you tested them (Rockwell Hardness, taper specs, length, etc.) to compare what made one better than the other??
It was mentioned that you did some evaluation on the axle shafts, ...so can you elaborate what you did and how you tested them (Rockwell Hardness, taper specs, length, etc.) to compare what made one better than the other??
Tom Endy
Well-known member
Brent:
I have been told that Snyder and Bratton often pool their orders to a manufacturer in order to make a quantity purchase for a better price break.
Walt Bratton once told me that the ring & pinion they each sell come from the same manufacturer and have the proper machining of the pinion sleeve that many other reproductions do not have. Those that I have encountered that are not machined propery I have to have the forward bearing position machined to facilitate setting the pre-load properly.
I did not do any elaborite testing of the axles I installed for John Lavoy. I visually inspected them and then installed them in a carrier assembly and rotated the axles in opposite directions to make sure everything turned freely with no binding. I do this with all I put together.
Tom Endy
I have been told that Snyder and Bratton often pool their orders to a manufacturer in order to make a quantity purchase for a better price break.
Walt Bratton once told me that the ring & pinion they each sell come from the same manufacturer and have the proper machining of the pinion sleeve that many other reproductions do not have. Those that I have encountered that are not machined propery I have to have the forward bearing position machined to facilitate setting the pre-load properly.
I did not do any elaborite testing of the axles I installed for John Lavoy. I visually inspected them and then installed them in a carrier assembly and rotated the axles in opposite directions to make sure everything turned freely with no binding. I do this with all I put together.
Tom Endy
john in illinois
Well-known member
I installed 2 axles from Brattons 3 or 4 years ago. At that time Walt told me that he had gotten some welded gear axles and that they failed. He then specified one piece ,which mine were. Mine have worked fine.
John LaVoy
Well-known member
I have not printed one but have one for the first five years. It is about 30 pages so not quite sure how I want to get it out. I'm having problems with the website host so don't even have that option right now. But I do carry it with me to meets etc if someone wanted to look something up. But the first issue of each year has the index for the previous year.
John
JoeWay
Well-known member
John,
If you'd like a temporary hosting solution for the index, I'd be happy to put it up on my site at www.originalmodelaparts.com/.
Joe
CarlG
Well-known member
If there was a place I could download even this much from, that would be neat. I'm in the process of picking up the back issues (one vol at a time) and I think this would be very helpful in finding things. Thanks.
atourer
Junior Member
Hi Guys, I have purchase 2 new reproduction axles. They are stamped with MARK. They look to be welded up near the gear end - do you agree ?. I have read there were problems with welded axles. Also the key way is quite sloppy. I am reluctant to use them but before I return them I am asking please has anyone had any experience with these axles. Thank you very much, Brian
