Radius Mount Weirdness and Bolts

J

Jim_Chesapeake_VA

Junior Member
After a year of ownership of our 1929 Model A Tudor we are still finding plenty to work on. After some driving the last couple of weekends the water pump developed a leak (now replaced), the speedometer cable died (next job) and I knew I needed to address the radius ball assembly as is looked very wrong. I decided to go with the rubber ball version of the replacement. This version of course doesn't have the springs or spacers. Started taking apart the old assembly and the first nut came off no issue but the second nut's bolt just turns with it (guessing the retaining pin is either bent or the bolt is low?). Was thinking about just hacking through the bolt above the nut. Once that is done, how do the bolts mount to the clutch housing? Do I have to install from the top?
 

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The bolts are installed from inside the clutch housing. They have heads that are split and accept a pin that passes through the clutch housing to keep them from turning. You should find a hole in the housing side if the pin is missing..but from your picture it appears the pin is there....maybe it's been bent allowing the bolt to turn......you might be able to insert a rod/pin and hold the bolt enough to remove the nut.

You can insert new bolts after the radius ball is removed, through the existing hole. It's a little tricky, but doable....
 

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You can insert new bolts after the radius ball is removed, through the existing hole. It's a little tricky, but doable....
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You can. I have done this. And its not necessarily easy.

Problem No. 1 is lifting the bolt through the bottom hole of the flywheel housing and then dropping it down so it falls into the bolt hole on the inside. I used the 16" long forceps and the bolts are lifted and dropped into their holes readily - That is until you don't and you miss the hole and the bolt falls down and lays in the bottom of the housing.

Problem No. 2 is one of "quality." The rubber ball cap bolts have slots which are engaged by the cross wise "keeper pin." MANY of the replacement bolts don't have the slot made deep enough - or perhaps the distance from the bolt shoulder to the bottom of the slot is too big. You get the two bolts in place and you'll insert the pin and engage and pass through the first slot, continue through the second slot and continue to the hole on the other side. You find the keeper pin won't engage the hole on the other side of the transmission. One or both of the slots don't allow the keeper pin to set low enough to line up with the holes.

It is possible to "bend" the pin and achieve co-linearity of the four items. BUT, you run the risk of "overbending" the pin such that torque on the bolt "pops" the pin out of the slot.

I chose the "make the groove deeper" to allow the keeper pin to pass. BUT - the bolts have to come out, slots deepened by being ground down, and then laboriously re-inserted. By this time I had gotten good at it.

Practice makes CONSISTENT.

Joe K
 
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Yes, just hack through it, then put in new bolts and rod as stated above. It looks like someone used the original style aps with a rubber ball. the rubber ball style has cast iron caps.

FWIW the original style are far superior. If the ball is worn you can add the circular shim that the dealers sell.
 
Thank you all for the advice, especially the picture. I was having a tough time finding any diagram to show me what this looked like. I didn't know about the hole in the middle to make inserting/removing the bolts possible. Thank you. Stay tuned for more questions as I am sure I will have them.
 
Was able to get the second bolt off by removing the retainer pin and putting a small screwdriver in the hole. The pin was bent badly so that was causing the issue. The ball itself looks ok to me (opinions vary). See pictures of the carnage. I will need to order a new pin. Synder's is getting way too much of my business.
 

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Jim_Chesapeake_VA said:
Yes, you can see it in the last picture. Should I replace it?
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If it is in there I would leave it. It may be difficlut to get the pin in. Probably the reason the pin was bent in the first place. (see Tom's article).

Note that Tom also mention shims under the bolts so the pin hold the bolts properly.
 
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Tom's methods are for a housing on the bench. I would start with replacing the pin using the existing bolts, then check fit of the secured bolts. Replace the reminant
of mystery packing with a new felt. Put some grease in the hole, and go back with the stock setup. The ball looks good to me.
 
I bit of thread high jacking here.
On one of my cars, those bolts have worn their way into the cast iron so far that the pin doesn't catch the top of the bolts. I've thought about tapping the hole and making a special stud, loctiting it in and going from there.
Thoughts?
 
I installed a trailer hitch on a modern and in the kit it had a wire with a spring end. I wound the spring end on the bolts thread and fished the wire with the bolt attached into a blind cavity, this worked slick!
 
Big hammer said:
I installed a trailer hitch on a modern and in the kit it had a wire with a spring end. I wound the spring end on the bolts thread and fished the wire with the bolt attached into a blind cavity, this worked slick!
Click to expand...

I’ve done this using sewing thread wound tightly and knotted in the bolt threads. Fish through the hole with needle nose or hemostats to find the thread, then slowly pull.
 
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