Push button starter - 1948 Ford Tudor Sedan

[AD1948Ford]

I know this has been covers extensively but I haven’t seen exactly what I need to fix my issue. I converted my car to a 12v negative ground car. The push button inside the car does not work. I have the designated wire in the harness connected to the button but seems like I have a bad ground to the dash. I then decided to keep the standard button in the dash (unhooked) and install a hidden starter button under the dash. I have a two post aftermarket push button and need help wiring it up. I know that I will take the original starter button wire and hook it to one of the posts. Do I then need to hook a wire to the other post and go to ground or go to the front of the starter solenoid? Any help would be appreciated.

Dutch

 

[Bob C]

What type of solenoid do you have there are 9 different circuits.


Bob

 

[edhd58]

you went 12v, you'll have to have a different push button and solenoid.
it should have a 12V solenoid with two small studs out the front, the battery and starter cables of course hook to the larger posts on either side.
You need a two pole momentary contact push button.
You'll have to run one wire from the battery to one pole of the push button, the other pole of the push button a wire goes to one of the small studs on the solenoid. I do not remember which small stud but one will work, the other wont.
I did the same thing on mine, I'll get a pic tomorrow.

 

[Bob C]

You can use your original push button, you just need to use the right solenoid.

 

[AD1948Ford]

Thanks for the help guys. I am currently using the original the original 6v single stud solenoid with the button on the bottom so that I can start the car (given I was having issues with the inside push button). I can go get a 12v two stud solenoid on my local auto parts store tomorrow. Does anyone have a preference or suggestion on which was the best to use? Edhd58, would love to get a picture if possible.

 

[JSeery]

If you are using the original soleniod you have to be sure the wires are connected correctly. The side connector that is internaly connected to the starter front stud connects to the battery. The one that doesn't connects to the starter. You can check it by running a rumper wire from the front stud to ground. If you switch solenoids it wires up differently.

 

[edhd58]

BobC and JSeery, how do you wire it using the original solenoid? Wont the button send voltage straight to ground when depressed? or will that then close the relay in the solenoid? Maybe I was looking at it wrong in my mind.

Never mind I just saw JSeery's post

 

[51 MERC-CT]

I know this has been covers extensively but I haven’t seen exactly what I need to fix my issue. I converted my car to a 12v negative ground car. The push button inside the car does not work. I have the designated wire in the harness connected to the button but seems like I have a bad ground to the dash. I then decided to keep the standard button in the dash (unhooked) and install a hidden starter button under the dash. I have a two post aftermarket push button and need help wiring it up. I know that I will take the original starter button wire and hook it to one of the posts. Do I then need to hook a wire to the other post and go to ground or go to the front of the starter solenoid? Any help would be appreciated.

Dutch

If you ground the wire that hooks to the starter button/switch and the starter motor works then consider the possibility that the starter button may be defective.
If your original solenoid is good there is no reason to install any 12 volt replacement.
One side of your replacement push button should go to any chassis ground.
It is most likely just a grounding device.

 

[big job]

Ok so now you have 12vts neg ground. Although the origional will work, but really is
not correct. You will need the run of the mill 1957 up 12vt solonoid from Napa or whoever.
You may use the origional wire from the dash but you need a two terminal push button that one terminal goes to any plus + or ignition +. Now the reason for the 4 terminal
solonoid is the small terminal on left goes to push button (dash) the one on right goes
to coil resistor to shoot 12vts to the coil on starting. You didn't mention resistor but you
need it now with 12vts.or you burn up the points. I have seen a two terminal push button that looks origional from the venders. Going back; All those 6v pos gr Ford
products use ground to actuate by only one wire from dash. Most failures are result of
the button on dash is not properly grounded by its two spring clips. So as I said this
will work with the 6vt grounded solonoid BUT you loose the second terminal for the
resistor to kick 12vt to coil upon starting then coil runs on or about 6vts. Napa resistor
just say any Ford with points (porcelain two terminal) one terminal to coil the other to
ignition. Now add a wire from coil side on resistor to the right terminal on solonoid. Thats how its done on all 1956 & up Ford products till then came out with DuraSpark.
Yes there are resisted coils but starting maybe lazy thats why a 12vt coil with external resistor is used. hope this is understandable > you can not resist a resisted coil.

 

[john in illinois]

this will bolt in and work with your original button on 12v. I got mine at oreillies. Button wire goes to small terminal, large terminals are marked bat and starter

John

 

[AD1948Ford]

51 Merc, I have taken a jumper wire and tried grounding the starter button wire with no luck. I’ll try it again to confirm today.

BigJob, I installed a petronix igniter on the car so no points to burn up. Would a resistor still be needed?

John, if I bought that solenoid, would I wire it up as standard, and the button will work as normal or would I have to put a new two post starter button in and add a ground wire from the second post on the starter button to the batter ground or frame?

 

[JSeery]

AD are you sure the solenoid is wired up correctly, sounds like it is wired backwards. Battery has to be connected to the side terminal (1) that is internally connected to the center terminal (2). When you ground terminal (2) it energizes the solenoid coil with the current flowing from terminal (1). Terminal (3) is the starter connection. Use an multimeter set on ohms and check for a connection between one of the side terminals and the center terminal then check the other side terminal to the center terminal. The one that shows continuity is the battery side the one that does not show continuity is the starter side.

 

[AD1948Ford]

JSeery, I’ll check everything you just said when I get back to the house in an hour. I wire it up per the diagram I had but I could have it switched.

 

[JSeery]

If it is wired out correctly and a jumper to ground will not energize it then most likely it is defective. John's post in #10 would be a good replacement to keep it working like the original.

 

[edhd58]

Glad I followed this post. I've been looking at this thing all wrong for years. I just always thought you had to use the 4 post solenoid when you changed to 12v. Thanks for teaching me something guys.

 

[AD1948Ford]

JSeery, after checking the solenoid, there is continuity on both sides and when I try the jumper wire from the front post to the battery ground (negative terminal) it won’t start. If I understand you correctly, then most likely the solenoid is bad. I have a NOS 6V solenoid that I can replace the current one with. That should fix the issue correct? I would then just need to make sure I have a good ground to the starter button correct?

I should mentione though that when I depress the button on the bottom of the solenoid, it still works and starts the car. Should that be happening if the solenoid is bad?

 

[51 MERC-CT]

51 Merc, I have taken a jumper wire and tried grounding the starter button wire with no luck. I’ll try it again to confirm today.

BigJob, I installed a petronix igniter on the car so no points to burn up. Would a resistor still be needed?

John, if I bought that solenoid, would I wire it up as standard, and the button will work as normal or would I have to put a new two post starter button in and add a ground wire from the second post on the starter button to the batter ground or frame?

Grounding the single terminal on the stock solenoid will cause the starter to engage.
If it does and the push button end does not, then there is a loss of continuity in the wire somewhere.
The 12volt Pertronix Igniter coil I have installed on mine requires the use of a ballast resistor.
Don't know what you are using but it most likely needs a suitable resistor.

 

[AD1948Ford]

51Merc, I think JSeery led me to the issue which was a bad solenoid. I took Kt off, checked for continuity and there was none. Makes me believe that the solenoid just gave out. I have a NOS 6v solenoid that I am outing on now and will try just ground the wire inside the car. I believe that will work and then I will just have to figure out how to get the dash properly ground or use a two post starter button and ground once side to the frame. I hope this is the issue and my starter button worries will be behind me

 

[JSeery]

Sounds like progress

 

[AD1948Ford]

Ok, the saga continues. The starter button works now but now the coil (aftermarket 12v style) is super hot. Could this be due to me just trying to start the car over and over (it was being stubborn and not wanting to start). I have installed the electronic points by petronix in the distributor and had the coil to match it as we’ll do I need to install a resistor like previously mentioned? The engine builder was suppose to install everything needed but I guess he missed that step.