Need help with a couple issues please

Droobie

Droobie

Senior Member
Hey there fellas. Got a few things going on here. I have not had my tudor running very long. I am getting that loud " shotgun blast" about 10 seconds after the engine has stopped. I have a new distributor with original points, new coil, and have fix all of my intake and exhaust leaks.... I have searched the threads here for an answer and am stumped still. Also I dont know how hot is too hot with this thing. I filled the radiator up and it spewed just a little water out after about a 3 mile ride. i know that they will get rid of some water but it just seems to be running hot.... I know the timing is good too.. Next up is when i go to back up into my driveway the rear brakes lock up and when I am in forward gear it is fine..... finally I put and new wiring harness in the car and a brake light switch and my tail lights never turn off unless i cut the power from the battery and I have no brake lights..... Sorry for the book I have written here but I know that this is the place to get answers and the best advice. Thanks in advance!!!
 
Sounds like you have a grounds issue. Make sure ALL Connections are tight and not shorting out.. Backfiring could be A condenser, just went thru a car that was shorting out at the distributor cutting out and fuel not burning and then the explosion. like flames out the exhaust,from vibrations. so check around for tight connections behind the dash etc. What is hot? water will seek its own in the radiator once you fill it.180-200? more info needed? is it out the overflow or cap?
 
10 secs after the eng is turned off,I would look at too fast idle or too rich,
The rich mixture would get ignited by a piece of glowing carbon or such in the muffler.
Lawrie
 
Brakes, which brake do you think is locking? Just make sure the linkages are correct and the shoes adjusted correctly.. If the leading and trailing edges are not chamfered, you could try that..
radiator, how much coolant is in it? Try setting it so you can just barely see the fluid..
Backfire, does it help to shut off the fuel a while before shutting the engine?
Brake lites, Check the position/adjustment of the switch or the switch itself for an internal ground..
 
If you are absolutely sure that there is not the sligest leak at the clamp where the exhaust pipe connects to the muffler, the only other idea I would offer would be that you are running too rich and unburned fuel is collecting in the muffler. I would run with the gav no more than 1/4 turn open off the seat and closed completely if running a model B carb. When the engine is cut off the temperature in the muffler increases and sets off the unburned fuel. Usually a small exhaust leak is also required for this explosion to happen. It could be a small crack in the manifold. If the engine won't run good unless the gav is opened way up this would indicate a vacume leak.

I've also gotta wonder if the initial timing isn't slightly retarded or you are running with the spark lever too far up the quadrant. People always seem to think that their timing is right on when it is sometimes way off. Most of the instructions for setting timing is unnecessarily complicated and don't allow for backlash rotation in the distributor shaft. I set my timing by the location of the rotor tip when the timing pin drops in place, not by the points. if rotor tip position is correct the points will be correct if the points gap is correctly adjusted. If the points gap is too close it will cause overheating. I set mine at .022.

If you are over filling the radiator this will cause loss of water through the overflow tube or arround the radiator cap. It may not actually be running hot. Running antifreeze in hot weather will cause overheating. antifreeze lowers the boiling point but it doesn't have to be boiling to be running hot. Antifreeze doesn't absorb heat at the same rate as water. For instance even though antifreeze does increase the boiling point to 250 degrees or better this will really be no advantage because the model A is not a pressurized cooling system like modern cars and will be running hot even at 190 degrees.

It sounds like the brakes locking up in reverse is a problem with the emergency brake bands being improperly installed. I would also check and make sure that the short brake rod that attaches the brake pedal to the brake cross shaft is properly adjusted. There is a plunger type end that is suppese to contact or nearly contact the inside of the center crossmember. this plunger contacts the brake light switch plunger and if it is not pushing the switch all the way back your brake light won't go off when the pedal is released. This adjustment will effect the leverage on the mechanical brakes and if not pretty close to correct the brakes will still be poor functioning no matter if you have spent thousands on new cast iron drums and other expensive brake parts. There is two other possibilities on the brake light problem. The wires on the switch could be reversed or it could be a bad repro brake light switch. I usually have to use a nos or good used switch for proper operation. While were on the brakes I would make sure that the brakes are not too tightly adjusted. Improper brake adjustment will also cause overheating and poor performance because off drag. None of my suggestions were meant to throw off on your mechanical ability. This is just things that have been known to cause the problems that you are having and may need close inspection. Part of the fun of owning a model A is being able to solve the problems, yourself. good luck.
 
Purdy,

Can you explain why the muffler would get warmer after engine shut off? I understand that parts of the motor that are normally cooled by circulating coolant will get warmer after coolant circulation stops and heat from the engine core redistributes, but I've never heard of such a thing in the exhaust.

Thanks!
Steve
 
"finally I put and new wiring harness in the car and a brake light switch and my tail lights never turn off unless i cut the power from the battery and I have no brake lights"

This problem may be caused by not having your brake light switch adjusted correctly. By this I mean you may have it set to far to the rear when you bolted it to the ****** so that when you take your foot off the brake, it does not allow the brake light switch to turn off. I hope this is clear. It is rather hard to explain. If you need more explaine, PM me and I will try.
 
What year Tudor?

Since your avatar shows a 1930 Tudor, I'll assume that's it. If so, then your brake light switch is mounted to the middle crossmember rather than the ****** top. Make sure your brake rod return springs are mounted correctly so they give the most brake rod return pressure. The fronts mount on the front side of the bracket, and the rears mount on the rear side. Also make sure the springs and brackets are bent correctly to give good return pressure. Then check the linkage adjustments to make sure the brake peddle rod returns enough to push the switch to the off position.

I haven't seen this problem with the 30-1 switch, but on some 1928-9 brake light switches I have seen the switch assembled incorrectly with the movable contact on the wrong side of stationary contact, thus making the switch operate just opposite of how it should.

BrakeSw-2.jpg


BrakeSw-1.jpg


BrakeSw.jpg


Here's 3 pictures showing the 1928-9 switch. The bottom picture shows the broken spring on my original switch, so the switch didn't return to the off position.
 
Last edited:
I filled the radiator up and it spewed just a little water out after about a 3 mile ride.i know that they will get rid of some water but it just seems to be running hot....
Click to expand...

What makes you say "it just seems to be running hot."?
 
Thank you everyone for your input and advice. I have most of the day today to piddle with it. I forgot to include that it is a 1930 tudor.. I will take everyones thoughts and advice into consideration and let yall know the outcome this evening. Thanks again folks!
 
Alright good folks of the barn.. All day piddling around with the tudor produced no more shot gun blast after turning off the Ignition.. All I did was reset the timing, and found out that i was running a little rich on the fuel. As far as it running too hot.... I am not sure how to tell the temp without sticking a thermometer in the fill neck after a couple minutes of idle.. The air coming from under the hood just felt hotter than it should be. I will continue to investigate this matter and let you know what temp i am running at. I got the the brakes to quit locking up while reversing just by readjusting the brakes the best i could. I plan to completely overhaul the brake system this winter but i can reverse without the e brake locking up on me now!! I looked and looked some more to find out why my tail lights stay on until the battery is disconnected and can not find any thing that would cause this. Also I don't completely understand the brake switch issue either. when the brake peddle is depressed the plunger moves freely and travels well and when I let off of it it comes back fine.. I will investigate this issue more as well.
 
A new problem arose today when I went to test drive her while grocery shopping. I drove her to the store about 1.5 miles from the house. I went great and the wife and I were very excited to not have any issues. On the trip back to the house she was running great then all of the sudden I had not power and it sounded like it was dieseling so i pushed the clutch in and the motor was not running. I pulled over and started it back up. It ran for about 10 seconds then died. i tried this a couple of times before having it towed home.. I let it sit for a while and searched here on the barn to see what it might have been. Went back out and it fired up right away and idled for about 10 minutes. It took her around the block and parked it. All I have been able to come up with is vapor lock but it just didn't seem hot enough this afternoon to cause that.... Any input on this would be great. Again thank you all in advance. I don't know what I would do without all of your combined knowledge about these great machines! Thank you!!!
 
The next time it dies, hustle out real quick and see if you have spark, so you/we know which quadrant of the problems universe to begin in.

I've seen the sudden-death and brief recovery behavior you describe caused by a bad ignition switch (replaced four of them before finally buying a good one) and by after market fuel filters that serve as a locus to trap a vapor bubble. But, there are lots of possibilities.

Steve
 
check the wire in distributor under the plate maybe shorting out from vibration? Just a thought.
 
steve s said:
Purdy,

Can you explain why the muffler would get warmer after engine shut off? I understand that parts of the motor that are normally cooled by circulating coolant will get warmer after coolant circulation stops and heat from the engine core redistributes, but I've never heard of such a thing in the exhaust.

Thanks!
Steve
Click to expand...


Steve,
Sorry to have kept you waiting. I was going to do some research through some of the club magazines or how to restore volumes. I'm Not sure but Ive read it somewhere and it has, for some reason been accepted by me. It could even be a wives tail. It does seem strange that a model A would wait 10 seconds and then the unburned gas in the muffler would explode, unless the temperture was increasing to the point to set it off. You are right about the engine getting hotter when the coolant was no longer circulating. This could factor in maybe. Just off the top of my head I'm gonna guess that the gasses moving through the muffler, though they are hot, as long as they are moving at a rapid rate would have some cooling effect. When the gasses stopped moving, the hot gasses that would be lingering between the baffels, especially if it was one of the old repro tapered mufflers, would increase briefly. You or some of the other guys may have a better explaination. I'm also thinking that the slightest air leak in the manifold to exhaust pipe or exhaust manifold to engine, will set this phenomenon off. I know that any of us that have owned and lived with model A's have experienced it more than once and have had to deal with it. I don't think that a car with a completely gutted muffler, if the connections were good at the engine and manifold would be as likely to do the explosion thing after shut down, as the old style tapered muffler with the baffles. There is a solid partition with just over twenty, 5/16 holes drilled around the inner cicumferance of the shell, a few inches behind the front cone. There is another solid partition with I think about 9 drilled holes, a few inches before the rear end cone of the muffler. It is easy to see how restriction of flow of the hot gases would greatly increase the temperatures inside one of these mufflers. the floor gets hotter as an unwanted bonus. I know that our roadster has ever done it, the explosion after shut down thing, that is. We are running dual B zeniths with a completely gutted muffler. I cut the end cones free and gutted out the shell, completely and smoothly. Then gas welded the end cones back in place. Less restriction of hot gasses from the engine and the muffler runs much much cooler. This also gives a performance boost. It is not really loud, nobody has ever mentioned noticing it. I always liked my stuff kinda loud anyway, just can't help myself. I would only do the muffler cut and weld thing with anything but a new never run muffler. The fumes will make a person feel sick if they attempt welding a used muffler.
 
Purdy,
Thanks for your thoughts on this. I'm inclined to think the muffler warming after shutdown is mostly an old wive's tale (although I never heard wives talk about such things). However, I agree with your original thought that an exhaust manifold crack or connection leak is the most likely culprit. That would explain the delay in backfire--as the system cools down, air will be drawn in thru the crack creating the right mix for an explosion. This might also require (1) that the car be running too hot, which could be from either retarded timing or too lean mixture or dragging brakes or ..., and (2) an excess of unburned fuel in the exhaust, which could come from either running too lean (accompanied by misfiring) or too rich (accompanied by smoke and dirty plugs.

The exhaust system heating up after shutdown just doesn't make sense to me; how could a cooling exhaust system draw in air thru a manifold crack if it's actually heating up??

Steve
 
Droobie--As for your brake lites staying on,Ive had several repop switches that would ground out or were on all the time.I was able to repair them by carefully opening up the tabs to get them apart & fixing the problem.Also check that the cross shaft is adjusted correctly to push plunger back.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top