28 fast faton
Member
Just wondering if you B guys might know the clearances on the Model B valves. They were set to Model a clearance but I am getting a lot of ticking.
Model B valves
- Thread starter 28 fast faton
- Start date
Mike V. Florida
Well-known member
I read that the original model B cams needed more clearance on the exhaust valves. Ford recommended .022 on the model B exhaust valves with the B cam.
The original B cam and lifters requires .015 intake.
There is some great info here;
http://www.fordgarage.com/
The original B cam and lifters requires .015 intake.
There is some great info here;
http://www.fordgarage.com/
Patrick L.
Well-known member
If I remember correctly I believe intakes are .012-.013" and exhausts were later changed to .022". I don't that had anything to do with the valves, I believe it was the cam design.
Mike, you're a fast typer.
Mike, you're a fast typer.
Jim Parker Toronto
Well-known member
Model B has a wider gap. Don't worry about the ticking, its the one's that don't make a noise you should worry about.......
hardtimes
Well-known member
Well, my B intakes and exhaust have been set at .013 for about 10 yrs. Now, they do click when cold at startup. But, let it come to operating temps and....no more click !
What is your setup set to ? Do they still make 'ticking' after thorough warm up of engine ? Do you have stock cam gear or metal ? Did you set the clearance or who, and were you there to verify what setting was made , just curious. Answers MAY give clues.
H. L. Chauvin
Well-known member
Hi 28,
Set mine, for (A) & (B engines, .011 intake, .013" exhaust ...... suggestion learned from a professional vintage mechanic & Model B engine owner ....... engine took a licking & valves never started ticking.
Set mine, for (A) & (B engines, .011 intake, .013" exhaust ...... suggestion learned from a professional vintage mechanic & Model B engine owner ....... engine took a licking & valves never started ticking.
28 fast faton
Member
They are set to a model a clearance. The engine rebuilder did the valves. Not sure what type of timing gear.
hardtimes
Well-known member
Ok. Is it possible to ask rebuilder what he sets engines valves (yours) at? How long ago rebuilt ?
I ask about the time gear, because if it is alum/bronze (metal)....some guys say that they get a 'noise'. My one B is alum...no noise, other B is bronze gear...no noise ? Ask your builder, as if it is a recent build, maybe he used metal and maybe it is doing the 'ticking' ? For instance, if fiber gear, that will narrow ticking down to lifters ?
H. L. Chauvin
Well-known member
Hi 28,
FWIW: May be other valve lift & duration reasons; however, I always assumed Model A & Model B valve clearances had (2) "main" reasons that appeared logical:
1. Valve thermal expansion occurs as valves heat up with the engine running, i.e., valves get slightly longer & also exhaust valves get somewhat hotter than intakes ........ hence add .002" more clearance for expansion of exhaust valves.
2. Metal tips of valves & tappets will wear slightly, & valves in valve seats will sit lower after time, so valve clearance again is wise to compensate for slight wear.
3. Because A & B valves heat up about the same, & are interchangeable parts, never experienced a ticking problem or performance problem while using .011" & .013" clearances for both, with or without a Police high compression head.
4. If installing valves with "no" valve clearance, valves will lengthen with heat, will not seat & close tightly, & with combustion heat in valve seats, one is guaranteed to have burnt valves & burnt valve seats.
5. But here again, individual choices ........... some may prefer to have pickles & onions on their ice cream.
FWIW: May be other valve lift & duration reasons; however, I always assumed Model A & Model B valve clearances had (2) "main" reasons that appeared logical:
1. Valve thermal expansion occurs as valves heat up with the engine running, i.e., valves get slightly longer & also exhaust valves get somewhat hotter than intakes ........ hence add .002" more clearance for expansion of exhaust valves.
2. Metal tips of valves & tappets will wear slightly, & valves in valve seats will sit lower after time, so valve clearance again is wise to compensate for slight wear.
3. Because A & B valves heat up about the same, & are interchangeable parts, never experienced a ticking problem or performance problem while using .011" & .013" clearances for both, with or without a Police high compression head.
4. If installing valves with "no" valve clearance, valves will lengthen with heat, will not seat & close tightly, & with combustion heat in valve seats, one is guaranteed to have burnt valves & burnt valve seats.
5. But here again, individual choices ........... some may prefer to have pickles & onions on their ice cream.
Pete
BANNED
Camshafts are designed to be run with a certain lifter clearance.
This is built in and non negotiable. If you want the engine to perform as it was designed to do, don't change it.
If you paid to have your engine built, then setting the valve clearance is on the builder. If you choose to change it, the warranty is void.
Changing the clearance on some cams can change the timing as much as 5 degrees.
This will usually show up in the gas mileage and it does NOT get better.
If you install an after market cam, use the settings that come with the cam, NOT what old Uncle Joe thinks he set them at 60 years ago or what you think might work better.
"Been in the cam business 60 years"
This is built in and non negotiable. If you want the engine to perform as it was designed to do, don't change it.
If you paid to have your engine built, then setting the valve clearance is on the builder. If you choose to change it, the warranty is void.
Changing the clearance on some cams can change the timing as much as 5 degrees.
This will usually show up in the gas mileage and it does NOT get better.
If you install an after market cam, use the settings that come with the cam, NOT what old Uncle Joe thinks he set them at 60 years ago or what you think might work better.
"Been in the cam business 60 years"
28 fast faton
Member
The only problem is the engine ticks quite a bit. I think the gaps are too big. The warranty is over anyway. Unfortunately the fellow who built it passed away recently. I just want to remove the ticks
Tom Wesenberg
Well-known member
Do you know what cam is in your engine? As mentioned, that will determin the gap.
Without knowing the cam I'd use the common factory spec for Model A.
Some adjustable lifters had too small a diameter foot and that can leed to ticking as it wears out the cam lobes.
Without knowing the cam I'd use the common factory spec for Model A.
Some adjustable lifters had too small a diameter foot and that can leed to ticking as it wears out the cam lobes.
Patrick L.
Well-known member
Some ticking is normal. I'd suggest checking the lash first to see where you stand and then make a determination. There are two styles of adjustable lifters and even more with different foot diameters. Originally the lifters were not adjustable.
hardtimes
Well-known member
He never says that he has seen and / or knows what kind of lifters
Not much to go on here, but ticking...which is normal, when cold for sure. Hard to help,eh !
Tom Wesenberg
Well-known member
He never says that he has seen and / or knows what kind of lifters
Yes, without knowing what cam and lifters, it might be worth pulling the pan to measure the foot of the lifters, or use some blueing to check the contact area. I'm glad someone mentioned about the small lifter size many years ago, or I might have picked the wrong lifters once.
hardtimes
Well-known member
Yes, without knowing what cam and lifters, it might be worth pulling the pan to measure the foot of the lifters, or use some blueing to check the contact area. I'm glad someone mentioned about the small lifter size many years ago, or I might have picked the wrong lifters once.
Well you did good getting 'bigger feet' , eh
!I like your thinking, so I went a step further... for the BIGFOOT
!Chrysler listers from the 50's, that is ! Had Pete here, put a nice matching face on lifters and on cam that he did at same time. That B should rock/roll in near future !
James Rogers
Well-known member
Without knowing what cam and lifters or what the lash is set at, this is a krap shoot and everyone loses. If this engine was built by an old timer, it could have a Model A cam and original lifters or, it could have modern valves on a B cam with double lock lifters. The only way to give any good advise is to know what cam, what lifters, what valves and, what the lash is. One other thing is, these motors are solid lift motors and will always have some valve clatter, unlike modern hydraulic lift engines, which are absolutely void of lifter clatter.
H. L. Chauvin
Well-known member
Hi 28,
Per message #1 & reply #11, you just want to get rid of the ticks -- from as far away as all of us are, we have no idea of how loud the ticks are ...... nor how many valves are supposedly ticking or where the ticking is located.
By now, with all of the "different" recommendations, you already know none of the concerned guys recommended dog tic spray to get rid of the ticks.
Maybe quit reading & try Plan B:
Just remove the valve cover & measure the valve clearances that you presently have ...... could be one or more valves ticking for "whatever" reason, or even a noisy timing gear or something else.
You are taking quite an advisory licking but not resolving your ticking .... maybe try plan B.
Per message #1 & reply #11, you just want to get rid of the ticks -- from as far away as all of us are, we have no idea of how loud the ticks are ...... nor how many valves are supposedly ticking or where the ticking is located.
By now, with all of the "different" recommendations, you already know none of the concerned guys recommended dog tic spray to get rid of the ticks.
Maybe quit reading & try Plan B:
Just remove the valve cover & measure the valve clearances that you presently have ...... could be one or more valves ticking for "whatever" reason, or even a noisy timing gear or something else.
You are taking quite an advisory licking but not resolving your ticking .... maybe try plan B.