Model A with push button starter

D

Delorean_Man

Junior Member
Hey guys.
I need some help. I have a 31 that has a push button starter. It doesn't have the starter pedal or any linkage or anything. The start barely turns over and the battery is brand new and charged and all connections are good. Does anybody have any information on what starters you can use to replace this one? Any help would be great and I am currently stuck on what to do with this starter. I would to keep the A with the push button starter cause that is just part of the history of this car.
 
Any stock-style starter will work (with the exception of the early Abel style) however I would suggest you repair what you have. Unless the solenoid is faulty, I would suspect the brushes inside the starter are worn. If you are uneasy about rebuilding it yourself, maybe give us your location so we can recommend someone nearby to rebuild it for you.
 
I think that the problem is in the starter--needs to be rebuilt. You can get a new one from any of the supply houses or they can be easily rebuilt by an electrical shop. I have had several rebuilt for a number of antique cars by Certified Auto Electric in Bedford (Cleveland) Ohio tel 888-597-8278.
My current Model "A" has a push button starter and is 12 volt. Skip
 
I agree with Brent. If the starter is dragging, it may just need a new drive end bushing, so the armature doesn't drag on the field shoes. Even if it needs brushes, the 2 ground brushes just screw into place, and the 2 field brushes need a heavy duty soldering iron or soldering gun. I like my WEN 250 for heavy soldering jobs, and there is a few of them on ebay right now.
 
Check all your grounds make sure they are clean and plentiful. Then remove the starter and bench check it. JMHO.
 
I have already taken it apart and polished the brushes and the bushing is good on it and it spins free. The negative cable that goes to the solenoid gets very hot when trying to crank it over but the cable coming from the solenoid to the starter barely gets warm leading me to believe it could be the starter. Also if you can use an original model a starter how would you mount the solenoid on it. The solenoid that is on it is a three post solenoid with one wire that runs to the button.
 
I converted my "A" to push button start last year. Ford actually sold the kit to update the cars with the foot starter. I had the push button start on my "A" back in the 60's, and that is what I am recreating. If all your connections are good, it's got to be the starter at fault.
 
I would want to know what your cranking voltage is..
If the cables are hot and the cranking voltage goes low you could wield the disc in the solenoid.
You might wish to read voltage between the frame and motor (engine) while cranking the motor as well.

Think of it like a table saw trying to cut oak on a very long extension cord; the saw will labor and the cord will get hot as the voltage drops.
 
Make sure connections on the battery are CLEAN. Disconnect the positive cable from the frame and CLEAN?POLISH the frame to bare metal and reinstall. Also, remove the starter, clean the face of it and the flywheel housing to bare metal and reinstall.
FWIW
Paul in CT
 
How big are your cables? It sounds like you have a smaller one between the battery and solonoid than you do from the solonoid to the starter.The 6 volt system needs twice the size cable than the 12 volt system does.
 
Many times people have replaced the battery cables with those meant for a 12-volt car. They are not big enough to carry the starter load with a 6-volt battery. The other important thing is the integrity of each battery connection. The one that is most neglected is where the ground cable attaches to the frame. It is out of sight and difficult to get to. Remove the floor boards and the battery. Unbolt and remove the cable and wire wheel the cable end and the bolt and nut. Put a disk sander on a drill motor and clean 80 plus years of paint (or powder coating), rust, and crud off the little raised boss on the frame where the cable bolts to.

Tom Endy
 
Keith True said:
How big are your cables? It sounds like you have a smaller one between the battery and solonoid than you do from the solonoid to the starter.The 6 volt system needs twice the size cable than the 12 volt system does.
Click to expand...

This was my first thought when I read that one cable gets hot.

You can also use a volt meter from one point to the next to check for voltage drop while cranking. The battery needs to be charged well before making this check.

One more thing to check is if you have a cheap master disconnect, it may be junk.
 
The only connection I have not cleaned is where the ground cable connects to the frame. I forgot that one. The cable are all 6 volt cables. What leads me to believe is either a solenoid or starter issue is that the car was cranking fine then it started cranking half speed. I let it sit for a week and charged the battery and tried again the first few revolutions it turn over fine and then got slower. So once something gets hot it barely cranks over.
 
Delorean_Man said:
The only connection I have not cleaned is where the ground cable connects to the frame. I forgot that one. The cable are all 6 volt cables. What leads me to believe is either a solenoid or starter issue is that the car was cranking fine then it started cranking half speed. I let it sit for a week and charged the battery and tried again the first few revolutions it turn over fine and then got slower. So once something gets hot it barely cranks over.
Click to expand...

thats one of the most common problem spots cable to frame
 
Before you get too deep into it, could it be a possibilty that when it was converted to pushbutton start that it was also converted to 12 volt? You can run a 6 volt starter on 12 v but the reverse does not work. Easy enough to check, pull a light bulb.
 
Try cranking it for about 5 seconds, then immediately feel all connections. Any connection with too much resistence will be warm or hot. I've seen a couple battery cables that looked like new, but had a bad connection where the heavy cable enters the lead battery post terminal.

Also it would be a good idea to check battery voltage while trying to crank. My battery measures about 4.8 to 5.0 while cranking the engine. If you have a poor connection the voltage should read a bit higher at the battery posts, but much lower at the starter switch.
 
DeLorean Man, give us more info. Are you 6V or 12V? Does the starter have an internal solenoid? External solenoid? Have you now cleaned the ground on the frame, and what was the result? Have you bench tested the starter? have you checked the resistance readings on the starter windings? Most auto parts stores are able to bench test starters. As Tom stated when you have a poor connection the voltage drops, because resistance goes up. Resistance will also go up if you have bad windings in the starter. Check each component separately, ie. All grounds, battery (for correct voltage), cables (should read zero ohms), solenoid (zero ohms when activated), then the starter.
 
29restorod said:
I converted my "A" to push button start last year. Ford actually sold the kit to update the cars with the foot starter. I had the push button start on my "A" back in the 60's, and that is what I am recreating. If all your connections are good, it's got to be the starter at fault.
Click to expand...
Where did you locate the push button? Do you have pics?:confused:
 
Delorean_Man said:
I have already taken it apart and polished the brushes and the bushing is good on it and it spins free. The negative cable that goes to the solenoid gets very hot when trying to crank it over but the cable coming from the solenoid to the starter barely gets warm leading me to believe it could be the starter. Also if you can use an original model a starter how would you mount the solenoid on it. The solenoid that is on it is a three post solenoid with one wire that runs to the button.
Click to expand...

Am I missing something? If the wire to the solenoid is hot, but the one from the solenoid to the starter is not, then isn't the problem a lousy contact in the solenoid????
 
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