Model A Marketplace questions.

Fred K-OR

Fred K-OR

Well-known member
I know in prior threads the discussions of what a Model A is worth has carried on and on for pages of discussions. But I have a little different question about the "current" market for Model A's.

I notice on EBay most "quality-restored" Model A's offered for sale do not sell for one reason or another-such as reserve not met, no bid at all , etc.. Maybe EBay is not a good market for Model A's. But the question I have is this a situation caused by the current economic situation or is it the trend for the value of Model A's? I know us ex users (in the 50's) of Model A's have a soft place in out hearts for the old rigs but is the market of us kind of guys or people wanting stock Model A's going away? I know it is a hobby but somewhere along the line a person needs to look at the dollars and cents of the hobby.

Just a few questions to ponder.
 
Fred,

I've picked up on the same thing you are talking about. I feel both intergers you mentioned are part of a trend in the Model-A hobby.
People who were a live when Model-A's were new like my dad are dying off in ever increasing numbers. Besides watching the Untouchables on TV back in the 60's. My dad got me interested in antique cars. He loved to tell me about his exploits back "in the day"! He was born in 1915 so the "A" came a live just when he was a young teenager. And we all know how young teenage boys are into cars don't we. That and the sons of our dads like me are also dwindling in number as time goes on too. The cars of the 50's and 60's are the hot ones to own now for old car guys. Maybe because that's when their dads grew up? Of course the economic factors of today are not helpful for the hobby. Or any hobby for that matter. My best friend and I met 45 years ago when we were in high school driving old cars that are dads turned us on to. Today we both are still into them and will be untill we go off to the happy hunting grounds.
No, I don't see that many people into "A" era cars anymore unless they are hot-rodding them, unfortunately. I guess we are just a dying breed.

Bob-A:D
 
Not only Model A's but I think to many price their cars based on what they have into them. Even in the Year One catalog they say on the first page about restoring cars. Figure what you have into them, then when your done they maybe worth half, forget your labor.... and they are the ones selling the parts... :)

They are like houses now, you can buy them cheaper than you can build them.
 
I tend to agree with Bob-A, as we age we see the time zone of interest slipping to later models. The 50's cars were all the rage ten or 20 years ago and except for the 50-51 shoebox Fords and the mid fifties Chevies the others have faded slightly. The 60's cars seem to have the popularity now, especially the muscle cars. Some of the 70's cars like the Firebirds, Camaros and Corvetts seem to be increasing in value as time goes on. For what its worth , none of my grandkids seem the least bit interested in Model A's but I'll hang in there and I would like more but at this point being retired I simply can't afford another one so two A's will have to do and I'm glad I have them.
 
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The past couple of years were not a good trend for most markets, inlcuding the car market. Until the economy gets a bit better the trends will be down everywhere. I don't beleive it is unique to the Model A hobby:o
 
I bought my Sport Coupe off of Ebay, but I went about it a little differently than most would. They had a "buy it now" price that I thought was too high for the car, so I waited to see if it would sell first. It didn't, so I emailed the seller and asked if it was still for sale. It was. I asked if they would take less. He said he would consider it, so I flew down to Houston, rented a car, drove to Beaumont, inspected the car and made the deal.
As for the nicer A's on E Bay right now, I personally think they just want too much for them. You never can get what you have in a car $-wise, but I think a lot of these people think they can. They have $25k in it and they want $25k for it. It just doesn't work that way in my opinion.
 
I have bought a car on eBay but will not do it again unless I or a trusted surrogate (like one of youse guys) look(s) it over in person.

most cars I see on eBay are suspect. either no photos of engine & undercarriage, or they have a shiny over-restored paint job and nothing else to recommend them :rolleyes:
 
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Thanks guys for the thoughts. I am trying to decide if I should get more into this hobby or look for another hobby. I only have one A at this time but have looked at others. I feel like I am not really into the hobby because I only have one. So I was just wanting to get the feel of other A'er's about what they thought was going on.

I tend to agree that the stuff on EBay is not priced per the market. When local A's come available, I think they are priced much better than the ones on EBay plus you can feel and touch them.

Thanks again for the comments.
 
I believe there will always be a market for well restored Model As. Especially the open cars and the rare body styles. I always look at the engine and chassis pictures of the Ebay cars. They're almost always terrible.
 
I took the gamble -- Bought my 31 PU on eBay. And a gamble it was! The restoration work was done 20 years ago, and driven very little. I wanted something with a "near perfect" body, and I got that. Mechanically I wasn't too concerned, since I felt that I could do that fairly well myself. Mechanically it has turned out not near as well as the sheet metal. I still feel like I got my $$ worth, especially when I was offered more than my investment (including the freight to get it here) by several of the local guys that have been in the hobby a lot longer that any of them would admit.

That being said -- I still watch what the market is doing, and have to agree with many of the above posters in that a lot of what's there (on eBay) now is way over priced and as a result does not sell.
 
Fred K-OR said:
Thanks guys for the thoughts. I am trying to decide if I should get more into this hobby or look for another hobby. I only have one A at this time but have looked at others. I feel like I am not really into the hobby because I only have one. So I was just wanting to get the feel of other A'er's about what they thought was going on.

I tend to agree that the stuff on EBay is not priced per the market. When local A's come available, I think they are priced much better than the ones on EBay plus you can feel and touch them.

Thanks again for the comments.
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I don't know if you have a Model A club close by, or if you're already a member, but I would join up if you haven't. You will find the best cars with the best reputations that way and you will also meet some very nice people. Model A people tend to be very helpful and friendly.
 
My take on the e-bay prices, is that they are not serious about selling. They put the reserve price ridiculously high so the car won't sell, but they get a measurement on what the market will bring. This info is used to sell off e-bay if they really want to sell without paying the e-bay charges.
 
IMHO ebay is a big part of the antique car market. Do a query for completed sales and you will find the ones that sold. There are lots of sales after the auction is over as well.

http://motors.completed.shop.ebay.c...indtype=22&_sop=1&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245.l1514

The economy is still in the dumps even though the recession is over, not a great time to sell. No foreclosures in my neighborhood but nothing selling either and no building. No real estate bubble here in SE Texas but people are too scared to buy anything big.

I attended a few meetings of the local Model A club a few years ago and the age of the guys was mostly 75-85 and very few younger. I stayed in contact for a year or so and there were several deaths. IMHO not a good omen for the future of the hobby around here.
 
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Here's my take on things-

Part 1 Sales- The market is down on everything right now, but if you have a legitimately good car (IE one done correctly and not cobbled together) you can still get a reasonable price. There are tons of cobbled up cars out there and very few 'good cars'. Naturally you'll never get your money back on a ground up restoration, but there are exceptions for cars such as MARC of Excellence winners, or low mileage original cars that always command a premium.
While not A related- To show you a sign of the times, a friend of mine is in charge of vendor spaces for a large National Corvette show. He told me last week the flea market pre registration is less than half compared to last year and the car corral spaces are sold out. That speaks volumes to me.

As far as the age demographic and waning interest- this is true to an extent, but if you look over at the HAMB there's lots of 30 & 40 yr olds running banger engines in their cars. Granted some of the cars have chopped tops or other customizing, but the important fact is there is a resurgence in running the original motor.

While not as common as seeing a 40 yr old in a '68 Camaro, I do see a fair amount of people under 50 with Model A's and T's in stock form.
 
I am a young model A guy @ 46, and for years wondered where the hobby was headed, however in the last year or so I have noticed there are younger folks getting into the hobby when they become the next owner of dads or grandpas car. I think this is where the next generation of Model A people will come from.

The humble Model A has become expensive. I think there will always be "car guys" and the young folks will start with what they can afford. The Model A is no longer the cheap starter car is once was. Now it's something to aspire to. This is why I think the Model A demographic is "greying" not because the younger people don't want Model A's, it's just that now at its price point, it's something to work towards.
 
There are a lot of people my age (48) and younger joining the Dallas Model A club, but there are a lot of older folks too. We all get along very well though and to me the older folks are the ones to go to when you want to know something about your car. One of our members is probably in his mid 70's and owned his first A at 15. He knows a lot about them and I find him to be an invaluable resource when I need to ask a question about my cars. If your local club isn't young enough for you, join up and encourage other people your own age to join as well. That's the future of the club!
 
Russ/40 said:
My take on the e-bay prices, is that they are not serious about selling. They put the reserve price ridiculously high so the car won't sell, but they get a measurement on what the market will bring. This info is used to sell off e-bay if they really want to sell without paying the e-bay charges.
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Maybe it's more like the husband has all this time and money into the car and the wife says, "get rid of it, you spend more time with the car than with me" Husband says, "fine, as you know I have $25,000 into it so I'm going to sell it for that", Wife, "that sounds fair". husband posts it on ebay and when it doesn't sell tells wife' 'oh well you don't want me to give it away do you?" as he walks back into the garage. :D
 
Mike V. Florida said:
Maybe it's more like the husband has all this time and money into the car and the wife says, "get rid of it, you spend more time with the car than with me" Husband says, "fine, as you know I have $25,000 into it so I'm going to sell it for that", Wife, "that sounds fair". husband posts it on ebay and when it doesn't sell tells wife' 'oh well you don't want me to give it away do you?" as he walks back into the garage. :D
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Good point Mike. I will have to remember it.
 
Recently my son gave me a metal sign to put in the garage " My wife tell me that if I spend one more nite in the garage working on that car she is going to leave me" At the bottom of the sign is another Quote " God I miss her "

Regarding our hobby, I have restored a number of A's, all stock. In view this is my hobby I have never kept track of the dollors invested or the hours of work. To my way of thinking, to keep track of everything invested, the hobby is no longer a hobby.

This hobby has been made wonderful with all the great People I have met over the years who have the same interest as I, Model A fords !!!!!

Ron
 
The quality cars and rare/unusual body styles will hold their value and likely gain. I had no trouble selling my 400-a several years ago or selling my 150-a this past year.

Another note about the future of the A hobby. I have been helping/advising a local 26 yr. old on the restoration of a 1930 coupe. He is doing an outstanding job and keeping it stone stock. His friends are very excited about Dan's project and are starting to look around this segment of the hobby as something affordable and special. Hopefully some of them will jump in.
 
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