Light switch connector block

[headonz]

I am about to connect the connector block to the light switch body and want to remove all the spade connectors so I will be able to pass all the wires through the large whole in the light switch body and reconnect all to the connector block.So far I have been able the pull all the spade connectors off the connector block but one.The central horn connector.I cant tell if this is soldered solid to the central pin or should just pull off .


Thought I would ask before I break something ??

 

[Joe K]

You're trying to take the "easy way out." An easy way which is - in reality - the harder way.

Better to remove ALL the wiring as a unit and replace as a unit leaving you the loose wire ends which you put through the hole starting at the nether ends, assemble the switch top and lower cover THEN put it all back in place as a unit starting at the switch bulb and working from the steering column out to the wire destinations.

Believe it or not - this is how Ford assembled the car in its origin.

I can see how you might imagine what you're doing is "easier" - but it is fraught with risk to the plastic disk (i.e. soldering and heating the brass buttons) and keeping everything "separated" (so blowing your horn doesn't put on one headlight) or some other flake short circuit.

Re-soldering/reattaching wires/component sub-assembly is one of those tasks that is best left to "benchtop" where you can keep everything under control.

Joe K

 

[Jim/GA]

I am about to connect the connector block to the light switch body and want to remove all the spade connectors so I will be able to pass all the wires through the large whole in the light switch body and reconnect all to the connector block.So far I have been able the pull all the spade connectors off the connector block but one.The central horn connector.I cant tell if this is soldered solid to the central pin or should just pull off .


Thought I would ask before I break something ??

The horn wire is soldered.

On a good wiring harness, all of the connections there are soldered.

 

[headonz]

This a new wiring harness I have just installed .Seems like I should have fed the front forward part of the harness through the light switch body large hole first.grrrrrr !


Tomorrow is another day.

 

[Jim/GA]

This a new wiring harness I have just installed .Seems like I should have fed the front forward part of the harness through the light switch body large hole first.grrrrrr !


Tomorrow is another day.

That is correct.

A tough lesson. But having just installed the harness, you will be able to remove/replace it fairly quickly.

Before it is in the car, test fit assemble the black disk into the headlight switch. Make sure it all goes together without binding. Some (not all) of the reproduction black disks are too thick and need to have a bit of the back side ground off to go together properly. That is easier to do before it is all in the car.

.

 

[headonz]

ok ,have block connectors assembled in car .Have brake lights on permanent and right side headlight looks quite dim compared to left side on all settings ?


On page 1-367 of 'the red book' is the connector block shown connectors face up ?
The black wire from tail/stop light to block connects to middle right hand side but my block doesnt have pin in that location ?Should it go to top or bottom instead ?

 

[Joe K]

Your two part "bulb enclosure" is normally assembled using the two "teats/L slots" which appear on the sides. The lower bulb part has a "cut out" portion which allows it to pass the impressed "slot" on the exterior of the upper part.

The impressed slot is "in alignment" with the male part "indent" which holds it in place on the bottom of your steering column.

Thus when assembled to the steering column, the impressed slot of the upper switch bulb is "down", the small hole in the lower switch bulb is "down" and the large hole for wires in the lower half points "forward" (The small hole acts as drain.)

Now your round block with the brass buttons has its own slot which you insert to align with the impressed slot. Thus the round block has its slot "down."

If you assemble the unit with the upper three "fingers" covering "non-brass button" positions of the round block - that would be the "neutral" or OFF position. This is where you want to be when you assemble it. The spyder matches the control rod in any of four positions, but you want the spider fingers to be "up and down" when the handle at the center of the steering column is "down." When put together like this, you can be sure the up/down finger of the spyder match the up/down slots of the switch finger carrier - and you're in the OFF position of all components.

That is it in a nutshell. As I say, probably best done on a workbench. As you leave the workbench the switch fingers are in the OFF position and this allows you to plug-in the switch bulb to an OFF position operating handle.

It is NOT Ford's more intuitive designs.

Joe K

 

[katy]

I am about to connect the connector block to the light switch body and want to remove all the spade connectors

Spade connectors? They should be bullet connectors.

 

[Joe K]

Spade connectors? They should be bullet connectors.

The bullet connectors are at the "device" end of the wiring harness. I.e. the headlights, the horn, the tail light, or the next harness in line.

The "plate" (as he calls it) can be soldered OR possibly done with spade type connectors - depending on the aftermarket manufacturer.

Soldered would be my preference but spade connections might work.

I recently bought a Twolite Wiring Harness on Ebay - it has "uninsulated" spade type connections then covered after landing on the plate with short lengths of shrink tubing. I can't tell yet if they're soldered in any way - until I strip off the shrink tubing. This harness is planned for "conversion" from a three finger switch plate/harness (twolite) to a four finger switch plate I have in my hand - no wires -yet.

The manufacturers don't make 4 finger switch plate/harnesses leaving "early Model A" users to figure something out using available or scrounged components - and make it work.

Joe K

 

[rotorwrench]

The very old originals did use bullet connectors but they are not easy to find now days for the restorers that want total originality. Spade connectors were a modern upgrade due to problems with loose connections and the like.

I've carefully ground off connector remnants to allow for quick and easy de-soldering. A person has to have a perfect size iron to fit in there and it has to be hot enough to melt quick and back off. It's definitely easier to just use the new stuff but prep it first. Pulling those connectors when soldered is like pulling teeth. It takes care and precision plus a lot of pain in some cases. Three hands would be nice when soldering stuff.

 

[headonz]

I have followed the Red Book and PDF file from Brattons and am still getting same odd results.
Can anyone see any obvious errors I have made with connections to the switch block ?


Does the spider in the bulb have only 1/4 turn ? Seems to need more ?

I have assembled the spider-bulb and black switch block and lower bulb several time and goes together no problem.I can see only one way it could go together.
I have checked and re-checked the lume to headight fitting and both sides are identical but the right side still does not function correctly ?
I am a little stumped at this point.

 

[Joe K]

Check the upper half of your switch bulb. Switches were made in two patterns over the life of the Model A.

Early pattern has four fingers and was intended for the "Type H" single bulb headlights. Was stopped around March 1929 although some applications like AA trucks it held on a little longer to use up stock.

Later pattern has three fingers and was intended for the "Twolite" two bulb headlamps.

MOST of the problems restorers have today is trying to use a later pattern wiring harness (which you have) with the earlier 4 finger switch.

The manufacturers are making harnesses/plates ONLY for the Twolite version. You mix an early switch with a later wiring harness/plate and you get problems like short circuits/non-function.

Show us a picture of your switch/fingers.

Joe K

 

[Joe K]

If your upper switch bulb is a "3 contact" switch (the design switch element for your harness) then check it out for "movement."

As you look at the switch, you'll see the impressed "slot" on the side. Keep in mind this slot goes "down" when the switch body is mounted to the steering column. Hold the switch in your hand to look in the open end but to see this impression "down."

Now look in and see the three brass nubs which constitute the contact part of the switch. You can rotate the brass and nubs through an "arc" of motion. Align the brass/nubs such that the two "slots" on the inner portion of the brass assembly appear at the 12 and 6 o'clock locations and aligned with the impressed slot in the lower of the opening. This is the OFF position of the switch.

One of the nubs should be seen at relative 1 o'clock. One should be seen at 5 o'clock. And the third should be 9 o'clock.

Note also that your "plate" when put in place and cover the switch contacts will have each nub on top of a "blank" portion of the plate - no brass button. This is how OFF position for the switch is OFF. I.e. no brass buttons.

Now with the plate/harness removed, "rotate" the nubs/brass portion. You should be able to rotate clockwise "two" positions or 60 degrees as you look at the open switch. There is an internal "limit" made into the fiberboard interior of the switch to limit rotation. The 1 o'clock nub will now be at 3 o'clock. This is the HIGH position of the switch.

Likewise you can rotate "counter-clockwise" - but the nubs/brass portion will only go 30 degrees from the OFF position. This leaves the 1 o'clock nub now at Noon relatively. This is the PARK position of the switch.

To jump forward descriptively - the "two detents clockwise" corresponds to a OFF-LOW-HIGH movement of the switch and contacts. The "one detent counter-clockwise" corresponds to a OFF-PARK movement.

Thus you have FOUR possible locations of the brass/switch nubs with a 90 degree span of the handle. Starting fully clockwise at the steering wheel/handle and turning counter-clockwise effectively you have PARK - OFF (down handle) - LOW - HIGH.

What CAN happen and what I have seen is the switch body/brass/nubs get worn where they are not being limited by the fiber innards of the switch. The limit wears and eventually fails to limit. You know you're there when you can rotate the brass/nubs 360 degrees.

You want to check for this as a switch fail.

In real life when switch OFF the nubs should be 1, 5, 9 o'clock and the two slots should be "up-down".

THIS is where you start when assembling the complete switch unit to your spyder at the bottom of the steering column.

I hope this helps. Its a lot of description to describe the "wear fail" of the switch - and the most likely fail mechanism of the later Twolite switch.

Joe K

 

[rotorwrench]

This is a PDF link for the best model A electrical system info out there.
https://www.lionsgatemodelaclub.com/Reference Info/2018 Reno Electrical System Alex Janke (1).pdf

Page 41 has Bauer Electronics' diagram for the reproduction light switch. The color codes are basic but understandable. There are a few inconsistencies in this pdf but over all it's a good batch of info. It shows the early and late diagrams in the first few pages. A person can see the shapes of the bullet pin female plugs.. They were just soldered into slots in the switch block terminals, The plug clips were just formed sheet metal and could get deformed pretty easy.

 

[headonz]

If your upper switch bulb is a "3 contact" switch (the design switch element for your harness) then check it out for "movement."

As you look at the switch, you'll see the impressed "slot" on the side. Keep in mind this slot goes "down" when the switch body is mounted to the steering column. Hold the switch in your hand to look in the open end but to see this impression "down."
Joe K

check

Now look in and see the three brass nubs which constitute the contact part of the switch. You can rotate the brass and nubs through an "arc" of motion. Align the brass/nubs such that the two "slots" on the inner portion of the brass assembly appear at the 12 and 6 o'clock locations and aligned with the impressed slot in the lower of the opening. This is the OFF position of the switch.

One of the nubs should be seen at relative 1 o'clock. One should be seen at 5 o'clock. And the third should be 9 o'clock.
Joe K

check


Note also that your "plate" when put in place and cover the switch contacts will have each nub on top of a "blank" portion of the plate - no brass button. This is how OFF position for the switch is OFF. I.e. no brass buttons.
Joe K[/QUOTE]
check

Now with the plate/harness removed, "rotate" the nubs/brass portion. You should be able to rotate clockwise "two" positions or 60 degrees as you look at the open switch. There is an internal "limit" made into the fiberboard interior of the switch to limit rotation. The 1 o'clock nub will now be at 3 o'clock. This is the HIGH position of the switch.

Likewise you can rotate "counter-clockwise" - but the nubs/brass portion will only go 30 degrees from the OFF position. This leaves the 1 o'clock nub now at Noon relatively. This is the PARK position of the switch.
Joe K

check


Joe K[/QUOTE]


Thanks Joe for you patience and detailed description . I do have a new lume and switch bulbs unit.Cant see what I am doing wrong.
Is the steering column cut out that excepts the upper bulb impressed nub/slot in the correct position in the photo ?


The only other thing I can think of is that I some how have the lume to light fitting screwed up.I have been following the image on page 55 of
https://www.lionsgatemodelaclub.com/Reference Info/2018 Reno Electrical System Alex Janke (1).pdf

 

[Jim/GA]

In your photo #1, there are 2 wire bale ears that stick out at 12 o'clock and 6 o'clock. That is 1/4 turn off. They should be at 3 and 9. And the slot cut into the round part of that metal piece should be toward the ground (6 o'clock). So unbolt that piece and rotate 1/4 turn and bolt back in.

Before inserting the light switch into the bottom of the column, put the light switch knob up on the steering wheel to the 6 o'clock position (off). The 2 ears of the spider down at the bottom of the column should be at 12 and 6 o'clock. They can get installed 1/4 turn off, so if they are, move them to 6 and 12.

Then there is a tab formed in the round part of the light switch that goes into that slot that is at 6 o'clock at the bottom of the column, and the wire bale swings up from under the switch to lock into the cap.

IDK if that is why your lights are not working as expected, but I see this is not quite right.

Lots of little details for something so simple. Good luck with it.

 

[Joe K]

Jim/Ga has pretty much summed it up. The fail of this system is that each "layer" starting with the switch handle, down to the spyder, connecting with the bulb-retainer, connecting with the brass fingers - can be put in another possibly incorrect orientation.

Ford hadn't thought this out to be "idiot-proof." And lots of ways to mess it up in a fundamental.

I liked seeing the descriptive from Lionsgate - they did a nice job anticipating the issues. And they even have a picture of the "bracket switch" - which you almost NEVER see in real life. (Their early wiring diagram actually is the bracket switch reference - but the wiring is the same as the later four finger switch.)

Joe K

 

[quickchange]

If one works & other is dull check earth , just take a wire, one end on pod other to grill shell , you may have weak earth due to paint etc ,

 

[Joe K]

If one works & other is dull check earth , just take a wire, one end on pod other to grill shell , you may have weak earth due to paint etc ,

We may have talked about the weaknesses of Fords "transitions" between wires and bulb harness. The "connector block" another of Fords not so great setups.

I remove the connector block, cut off the bullets, and use solder filled crimp connectors on the bared wires (you heat these babies up through the plastic and the solder flows and completes the electric circuit.)

They even give you enough room to run a "ground wire" back through the conduit between the headlight shell or socket and the radiator mount.

Won't pass judging, however.

Joe K

 

[headonz]

Thank you everyone for your advice ,I would be completely stuck without it.Not the sort of situation where I can just drive to the auto electrician and say "fix it" .


I have corrected the steering column cut out position and spider to the 12-6 .

The left h/light seems to be correct ,tail/brake lights are 'on' at all settings ?
I am giving up for today before my head explodes.
Interesting to note that in the past they had completely by passed the horn-light switch and installed a high/low switch on the floor and lights on/off switch on the dash and completely re-wired the head light to a cut out regulator box on the fire wall.All of which had over heated and melted together.About the same time the car got parked in the shed in 1976 I'm thinking.