Lead additive substitute

Nasukau

Nasukau

Senior Member
Hi all!
I am new to the Model A's and also to this forum. I have been reading many interesting and helpful posts. I have not seen much on what a good lead additive substitute is best to use. Where I live we have Auto Zone and Pep Boys and O'Reilly's auto parts. Any suggestions would be great.

Thanks,
Denny
 
Why?

There was not lead in gas when the Model A was produced.

Maybe if you run an ultra high compression head (i.e. 7-1 or beyond)

At 4-1, 5-1 or even 6-1 you can burn the worst rotgut available on the road and do just fine.

Joe K
 
Yup, Joe is spot on. The Model A will not care what you put in it. Lead or lack of it will do nothing. She will run on Regular or Ethyl. With a little fenaglin you can run 'er on Kerosene.
 
Agree, no lead stuff needed.
If you can buy the real gas without the corn crap in it, it will be a big help, especially to put in the tank during winter storage. I always use the good gas and add 4 ounces of Marvel Mystery Oil to 10 gallons.
 
Welcome Denny,
This is a fun hobby and your in a good place to get help and information. If you post your location in your avitar you might find that someone on the barn is near you that can be of assistance if needed.
 
The lead substitute is little more than oil and will cause a loss in power and black sooty spark plugs. I tried it years ago when I didn't know any better. Real tetraethyllead would boost octane and power, it would allow you to run higher compression at full advance without timing knocks. The bad thing about tetraethyllead is that it leaves carbon deposits and spark plugs don't last as long.
 
Great Question! I can get 101 octane leaded gas! Would that upset the car? make it run rich? or foul out the plugs? or should I stick to what we have now.Lucas makes a nice additive to cut down on the alcohol in gas that cost about $10.00 for a small bottle.Heard that is fine in small machines. When the Model A was new,no leaded gas was available? thought it was?
Thanks-
 
I'm also of the school of "no lead needed" in these low compression engines. Amoco gas stations never had leaded gas that I'm aware of. Tony, the 101 octane won't upset the car, but I really don't think you need it. My near-original '31 pickup gets regular unleaded with a shot of MMO.
 
I don't have experience with the lucas additive, If its not real tetraethyllead, I wouldn't use it. Lead doesn't actually foul spark plugs with oily or sooty residue. Lead leaves a hard carbon deposit on the spark plugs, piston tops and combustion chambers.. Lead has no effect of running rich or lean. When Ford introduced the police head, leaded fuel was available. Lead allows the use of higher compression without timing knocks. Ever hear of Gulf no knocks fuel?? When leaded fuel was available, I used it in everything, even the lawn mower, Iwould use it now if I could get it. I used leaded (ethyl we called it) gas untill it was taken off the market. The production of performance high compression engines like Chrysler hemi and others ceased after 1970 when the lead was removed. The reason was that a high compression engine wouldn't run on unleaded fuel without timing knocks. The compression ratio was reduced to about 8 to 1 in most us car engines for that reason. Lead isn't necessary in low compression engines, if it was, we would all be SOL, It will allow running with full advance for more power with no danger of harmfull timing knocks.
 
Last edited:
Joe K said:
Why?

There was not lead in gas when the Model A was produced.


Joe K
Click to expand...

In 1923 three of America's largest corporations, General Motors, Dupont, and Standard oil formed a joint enterprise called Ethyl Gasoline Corporation with a view to making as much tetraethyl lead as the world was willing to buy, and that proved to be a very great deal. They called their additive "Ethyl" because it sounded friendlier and less toxic than lead and introduced it for public consumption on Feb 1, 1923.

From Bill Bryson's "A Short History of Nearly Everything"
 
Skeezixx said:
In 1923 three of America's largest corporations, General Motors, Dupont, and Standard oil formed a joint enterprise called Ethyl Gasoline Corporation with a view to making as much tetraethyl lead as the world was willing to buy, and that proved to be a very great deal. They called their additive "Ethyl" because it sounded friendlier and less toxic than lead and introduced it for public consumption on Feb 1, 1923.

From Bill Bryson's "A Short History of Nearly Everything"
Click to expand...

Cool, did not know that. I love such factoids. I always presumed "Ethyl" was short for
Ethanol based fuel. In one form or another, Ethanol Fuel has been around since the beginning of the Automobile.
 
Thanks everyone for your replies. I was worried I would have to do a mix every time I filled up.

Denny
 
I have a 66 GTO and I have owned it since 1969! I used to run 112 octane high test gas in the car all the time and it ran perfect! The new gas with alcohol doesn't run as well and I get the pings.
I added a few gallons of 101 octance leaded gas as the car was made for and it runs super.I also added some to my Model A which I had problems with it and it runs super as it cuts down the alcohol level.If you have your gas tank cleaned and sealed the alcohol with eat that sealer in time.So,I now add leaded gas to the tank with no problems.I did have a gas problem with my car and an electrical problem.
All is well so far!
I remember when the un-leaded gas came out and the big horse powered cars went away for good.
Tony
 
Charlie Kettering of GM fame invented leaded gasoline. According to his biography it came out in about 1932 but was not available to the masses until about 1935. Thanks to him the manufacturers were able to increase compression from then on and not worry about ping which had been a huge problem
 
Kevin in NJ said:
I was also told that the combustion by products from leaded fuel will cause the exhaust system to rot away rapidly.
Click to expand...
Not quite. The lead in gasoline only affects the catalytic converters in cars equipped with them. It forms a coating on the the catalyst effectively killing it.
 
About a year ago I was in an antique shop looking at a 1929 magazine and saw an ad for ethyl gasoline, so lead was in gas during Model A production, but the Model A doesn't need it.

I have a WWII one cylinder 1000 watt generator and the owners manual calls for gas without lead. If leaded gas is used then it says to clean or change the spark plug about 4 times more often.
 
I Use Lead additive it extend the life of my valves
when lead was introduced to fuel it doubled the mileage between valve jobs
When lead was removed car manufactures had to fit harder valves and seats much harder than we can fit to a model a engine just to get the same life as from lead fuel
just check how hard the modern engine valve is now
Colin
 
Kevin in NJ said:
I was also told that the combustion by products from leaded fuel will cause the exhaust system to rot away rapidly.
Click to expand...

Bad Daddy said:
Not quite. The lead in gasoline only affects the catalytic converters in cars equipped with them. It forms a coating on the the catalyst effectively killing it.
Click to expand...

Both statements could be true depending on conditions. In it's liquid form, blended leaded gasoline had the lead compound in solution so it effectively just went along for the ride.......until the effects of the combustion process. Once combusted the lead "separated" chemically and could end up creating lots of lead deposits in the combustion chamber and further down stream. To avert that other additives were blended in the gasoline to scavenge the "excess" lead from the combustion chamber. Basically they lowered the boiling point of the lead so that it flowed out of the combustion chamber more readily. These were bromine and chlorine compounds that, when mixed with water that was also freed up from the air in the combustion process, would form acids. It was these acids that shorted spark plug and exhaust system life. Not all the lead material stayed in vapor form to be exhausted, some of it would "plate out", for example on the exhaust valve head and seat, and, when later used, the components of a catalytic converter.
 
An old fellow here in town,Nelson Beede,(long gone now) used to brag he was the first in town to have ethyl gas.another fellow up the street,Hap Willard,claimed he had the first.They did agree that it was in 1953.Most of us here think it was Hap,because he actually put a second tank and pump in.Most folks here wouldn't buy that poisonous,overpriced,newfangled gas.The drag strip in the town I live in,and in high school I worked at the American station.During the summer guys would pour in for the American high test.I have no idea what the octane was,but it was unleaded.We also had a cheap line of gas,unleaded.called Blue Boy.That was commonly called white gas.They dropped that one because we had to keep a guy on that pump all summer pumping a quart at a time into camp stoves and lanterns.We were on the main trail into camping country,and most of the time when they bought gas the campers wanted the air checked in the trailer tires too.20 minutes work to sell a quart of gas.
 
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