Judging Standards Question

Tom Endy

Tom Endy

Well-known member
Question for MARC\MAFCA judges:

On page 4-6, Revised 1997 (area four, undercarriage), it states that the lever arm on the end of the clutch release shaft in the bell housing should be painted Ford engine green. Is this still correct, or has it been revised?

The reason I ask the question is because I have never seen one painted green. I have restored countless numbers of bell housings and have seen many at swap meets and the lever has always been painted black. I admit I have never crawled under a blue ribbon car to look at the clutch release lever.

All the bell housings I have ever restored went out the door with the clutch release lever painted black. No one has ever called me on it.

Tom Endy
 
:rolleyes: I am not a MARC/MAFCA judge but i painted mine Black and leaving the shaft unfinished as i did all my cars..I have 2 i just checked and both are black. I'll check on the 29,000 mile car tomorrow .:confused: Did not have any % of a point taken off when judged -which at this point that's all i can go on.
 
Mr. 180:

Thank you for the info. I also leave the shaft unpainted along with the yoke that operates the throw-out bearing as that is how I have found them. I have a hard time accepting that the levers were painted green, especially when the standards say they were painted before they were installed. Why would Henry paint this lever green when every other lever on the car is black? Maybe he did it to confuse and confound the next hundred years of Model A enthusiasts.

Tom Endy
 
I have no specific knowledge regarding printed information on this subject, but this thought occurs to me. I am under the understanding that the motor castings were made on the south side of the ship 'canal'. Then they were painted in the motor shop and put on a conveyor over the 'canal' conveyor speed was timed to have the paint dry before it reached the north side of the canal for assembly. If, by chance the clutch levers were forged in the motor area, it would explain them being green as opposed to the expected black. Again, just a passing thought!
 
:rolleyes: I crawled under the fordor and clutch lever cleaned off the grease and still no green or black paint. Shaft after cleaning it off is very shinny. No rust . I have seen N.O.S. clutch housing at Hershey without shaft but in parts book shaft is installed ,,Dennis Carpenter tent had 1 forsale.[[[[ A7591-B [$4.00 in parts book]. Clutch release arm A-7511-C sold seprate [ 20 cents in parts book] and shaft A-7510-C [30 cents in parts book]..Need that time machine..l.o.l.:D
 
Tom,
Here are two photos of the clutch lever on our unrestored 1929 Standard Fordor. As you can see, there is no evidence of paint having ever been applied. If there had been paint, whether green or black, there would have been some left on the lever. You can see how much of the original paint is remaining on the surrounding surfaces including the green on the bellhousing.
This is a good example of having to make a decision as to whether or not you want to match the Judging Standards, knowing they may be incorrect in indicating green as the only correct color, or incomplete in that they don't indicate alternatives such as plain finish. Your call.

Dave Lopes
 

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Dave:

Thank you for the information. Maybe Henry forgot to paint this one, or he ran out of both colors of paint.

The early cars such as yours had a release lever (as well as the yoke) attached with a small pin with a woodruff key inside each to help retain them. Later in production, the woodruff keys were deleted and a larger pin was used. A service bulletin was issued describing the change. I suspect it was done to reduce costs.

Cracking and breaking of these levers is a common known failure mode, I suspect mostly in the later configuration. I have always believed that the person who wrote the service bulletin got the lever and yoke part numbers mixed up. The bulletin says you can drill the lever out for the larger pin, but not the yoke. If you drill out an early lever the new hole will be very close to the edge and is an invitation to a failure of the lever.

You can see the small pin and the little notch in your photo where the woodruff key is located in the lever. I would think the judges would being looking for this on an early car. The yoke is probably not looked at during judging.

Tom Endy
 
Geat photos Dave. I am at this stage in my current restoration, shaft still out of the housing and have painted the lever green, as per current standards. I also notice from your pictures there is not a lot of paint on the pedals also. On a side note the keyway was retained on RHD setup and shaft was 7/8.
 
Bick,

You're correct. At the lower ends of the pedals there is not a lot of paint left. Close inspection reveales they were dipped, but you can't really tell that from the photos.

Dave Lopes
 

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Actually, to correct my note above, if you look at the second photo, you can see where the pedals were dipped to. The lower portions of the pedals do not appear to have been dipped all the way into the black paint.

Dave Lopes
 
:rolleyes: Very nice picture's Dave [Thank you] ..Out of all the n.o.s. parts i have come across most have black paint on them, But the 2 n.o.s. clutch levers i have do not have any paint what so ever on them. The shaft forks and release shaft arm rod seems to have a very dull black stain looking finish .Like a raven plated finish and not a paint.:confused: I also came across a pair of brake and clutch pedals[Mid 30] with pressed in grease fittings and ALL was painted/dipped black.
 
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This raises more questions, without reading the JS, off the top of my head, I would have
said the lever was dipped black with an unpainted rivet. Hopefully it mite show up
on the revision with a time line. Maybe the colors and the dipping varied from plant
to plant?

Dave, beautiful 4 door, hope your doing WELL !
 
:rolleyes: Brent you know you beat me to that same question:confused:. Marco is moving into a new home so we might not hear from him for awhile.:p maybe checkout his website pictures and see what he did!:D checked out Marco's website and not a clear shot of the arm...:(
 
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Can I 3rd that? Did they dip the small Green parts, water pump, intake, rear trans-
mission bearing retainer? Personally, I don't think so, too many issues with clearances.
 
Okay, I'll take the bait. The color of the clutch lever has been debated a number of times on the two JSC groups and the Publication Committee. There has never been a consensus. The rules of making revisions to the Judging Standards are that we must have dosumentary evidence and a clear consensus on a subject. In this case, the lack of documentary evidence and no consensus, meant there will be no change to the existing text. By the way, we did look at a few original cars to see if there was a pattern. It was not a simple matter even on my own 30,000 mile Town Sedan. I am sure it's black, Marco is sure it's green! Then we asked Dave Lopes about his Sedan and he said plain steel. I would enjoy hearing what finish is found on other low mileage Model A's!
 
Cool answer Doug!! So is it plausible that the pedals on Dave's Fordor were not painted around the shaft area due to difficulty of efficiently plugging the holes which could cause issues during assembly due to paint on the bushing surface? If that is the case, then dipping the clutch arm would create equal problems during assy. wouldn't it?

So playing Devil's advocate, ole' Hank managed to coat other rods & levers with either plating or paint, so why did he intentionally leave this one bare? Is it possible that when Dave's car was going down the assy line, they needed arms but they hadn't been coated yet but management opted to bypass that operation to keep the assy. line moving?

/
 
Brent - You probably hit the nail on the head. The lack of paint on a simple item was never allowed to interupt production. Also, there was probably some variation in processes from plant to plant. I have a couple of sets of NOS pedals that are painted like Dave's. I also have a few NOS sets that are completely painted, so which is correct? I think both methods were original, but during restoration we want to cover as much bare metal as possible.
 
Doug,..without beating this to death, the early pedals that I have seen( not restored ),
looked dipped 100%, lack of bushings with some clearance? Verses the bushed ones?
 
I think I have one set of early small shaft pedals that are not painted completely. I'll have to look when I get home to be sure.
 
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