Interior Fabric

[emf]

I have a 31 deluxe roadster with vinyl seat upholstery. I always thought this was incorrect, thinking it should be leather. While reading the mac's catalog, I noticed that two different vinyls are offered, one labeled 'correct vinyl' and the other 'incorrect vinyl'. Am I misinformed that the original covers should be leather?


Frank

 

[rotorwrench]

According to "The Ford Model A as Henry Built It" lists Two-Tone Tan Bedouin Grain Leather for the seat cushions but all the other coverings were artificial leather in the same color arrangement for the Deluxe Roadster in 1930 & 31.

No vinyl was used in that era. Ford used a pyroxylin coated cloth leatherette type material. The pyroxylin is a lacquer based coating that could be colored like any other lacquer. The material is much thinner than modern vinyl fabrics but vinyl is substituted for a lot of things like this. It's getting difficult to source the old style leatherette materials now days.

 

[CWPASADENA]

Only the front seat bottom cushion and backrest "seating surfaces" were leather. The rest of the front seat and interior upholstery was artificial leather. The Rumble seat upholstery was artificial leather.

Chris W.

 

[rotorwrench]

Mac's is now one of the divisions of Eckler's and so is Cartouche Classic Ford Upholstery. They have been know for a long time to offer upholstery kits to compete with the former LeBarron Bonney (which is also now owned by Eckler's). They offer materials that approximate the materials used back in the day but it would be hard to describe their offerings as authentic since many of the authentic materials are not readily available in the modern era. Just using the terms correct and incorrect when referring to vinyl materials is a stretch when none of the original materials were actually vinyl coated. "Correct looking" may be more truthful.

 

[emf]

I guess the point of my question was that no leather offerings are in the Cartouche catalog, leading me to believe that leather was not offered by Ford...


Frank

 

[Incognito-A]

I guess the point of my question was that no leather offerings are in the Cartouche catalog, leading me to believe that leather was not offered by Ford...


Frank

Hi Frank, drawing conclusions about authenticity from parts suppliers is like taking life advice from bubble gum wrappers…you can certainly do it but the outcome may be suspect.

Rotorwrench is spot on: real cowhide on the front seat surfaces only(the parts you sit on), artificial leather everywhere else.

 

[emf]

Thank you

 

[GeneBob]

I was thinking of reupholstering my Tudor with Bounce dryer sheets. Supposedly, it would never have mice and would always smell like fresh laundry.

 

[CWPASADENA]

I guess the point of my question was that no leather offerings are in the Cartouche catalog, leading me to believe that leather was not offered by Ford...


Frank

Just because Cartouch does not offer leather does not mean that leather was never installed at the factory.

As stated before, the "seating surfaces" of the front seat bottom cushion and back rest of the '30 and '31 Deluxe Roadster were leather from the factory.

Chris W.

 

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

I guess the point of my question was that no leather offerings are in the Cartouche catalog, leading me to believe that leather was not offered by Ford...


Frank

Frank, I have been following this thread and I must confess that I am not sure what you are getting at. Your comment above is much akin to saying that "McDonalds does not have Fried Chicken on their menu, therefore you must not be able to buy Fried Chicken at a restaurant." Other have given you great info and allow me to add my 2 cents and say it this way.

Kit manufacturers are solely trying to offer a useable product. If a restorer is seeking authenticity or accuracy with the upholstery, that really is not the place to be looking as there are other sources that cater more towards being correct. Those places do however cost more money as the materials and the craftsmanship is more costly to produce. I trust this makes sense to you, and feel free to PM me if you are needing to know options in that regard.

 

[JayJay]

Frank, I have been following this thread and I must confess that I am not sure what you are getting at. Your comment above is much akin to saying that "McDonalds does not have Fried Chicken on their menu, therefore you must not be able to buy Fried Chicken at a restaurant." Other have given you great info and allow me to add my 2 cents and say it this way.

Kit manufacturers are solely trying to offer a useable product. If a restorer is seeking authenticity or accuracy with the upholstery, that really is not the place to be looking as there are other sources that cater more towards being correct. Those places do however cost more money as the materials and the craftsmanship is more costly to produce. I trust this makes sense to you, and feel free to PM me if you are needing to know options in that regard.

Well stated, Brent. As an example, I got a fabric sample card from Cartouche that shows the "correct" and "incorrect" fabric samples. On that card are two samples of what might be interpreted to be "brown mohair" that came in my 1930 Town Sedan. Neither one really come close to the color of my original upholstery (I took off the window surrounds and underneath that is fabric that has never seen the light of day, so no dirt and no fading). The fabric sample cards cleverly do not attempt to assign a fabric name (which is what Ford advertised and delivered) against a particular fabric sample - there is also a brown woven fabric but unstated whether that is supposed to be "correct" brown Bedford cloth.

(I see that if you go to the Cartouche website they do assign names to fabric codes. They identify both a "brown mohair" and a "camel mohair". I was unaware that "camel mohair" was an original option...)

Amusing story - when I was a kid there was a guy who had "restored" a roadster pickup (I think it was a '29). He did the seat in baby blue leather. It looked great but at the time I thought this was over the top. Turns out the leather was correct, but not the color. I'm pretty sure he did not get that seat covering from Lebaron Bonney.

As Brent says, the suppliers are trying to provide a product at a competitive price. And given that we're now 90+ years removed from the original it's not surprising that widespread aftermarket availability of that perfect match on fabric might be elusive. We can't all be Jay Leno and have that "perfect" (cost is not a huge impediment) restoration, so we have to do the best we can. And for that "perfect" match, it's out there but not at the usual upholstery kit suppliers. Cue MasterCard commercial.

JayJay

 

[emf]

I wasn't going to respond to your snarky answer, but I decided to respond anyway. In my over 70 years on this earth, I have owned over 30 Model T Fords and know that car very well, both brass and black versions. This is my first Model A and my knowledge of the different years is not nearly as broad as yours. I thought the question was simple enough and I probably should have worded it differently. I was really asking if the vendors offerings were complete, or did Ford offer leather from the factory. I guess I'll ask my questions a little more carefully in the future. To the others who replied to my poorly written question, thank you.


Frank

 

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

I wasn't going to respond to your snarky answer, but I decided to respond anyway. In my over 70 years on this earth, I have owned over 30 Model T Fords and know that car very well, both brass and black versions. This is my first Model A and my knowledge of the different years is not nearly as broad as yours. I thought the question was simple enough and I probably should have worded it differently. I was really asking if the vendors offerings were complete, or did Ford offer leather from the factory. I guess I'll ask my questions a little more carefully in the future. To the others who replied to my poorly written question, thank you.


Frank

Frank, my answer was not intended to be snarky. I agree that you should have worded it differently as like I mentioned above, it was confusing. I'm sorry if I didn't tell you, ...or word my answer in the way you wanted it to be worded. I guess mine was poorly worded also!!

If that was your question, might I suggest you ask the vendor themselves because all of them do things a little differently. My other suggestion really is if you want to become educated on the Model-A, I would suggest you first purchase a copy of the Restoration Guidelines & Judging Standards which goes into WAY more detail than what can ever be said here. Then you have proof instead of "he said/she said" to point-blank ask the vendor about their offerings and you can better understand if what they are saying is factual. Purchasing this book will also allow you do differentiate in other areas of the vehicle. It will be money well spent for you.

As a side FWIW, if you are familiar with the MTFCI Restoration Stds. & Judging Standards book (-which I was on the Judging Standards Committee when we made the last revision of that book), the level of detail that is printed in the Model-A Book far exceeds what we provided in the Model-T book.