Front Motor Mount - Original and Float-A-Motor FAM

J

jsulliva

Junior Member
I have a 1930 Cabriolet. About 1.1/2 years ago I replaced the Front Float-A-Motor (FAM) parts with new original style front motor mount parts (both use original yoke) at the time I replaced the front rope seals in the oil pan and timing cover and did some other engine work. It was an early FAM from 1963 when my Dad and I replaced the engine (I was 12 at the time). The rubber pad under the mounting yoke was hard and splitting, and the rubber parts are no longer available.
I didn't realize it at the time, but the engine was now lower than before and the crank didn't fit properly. I had to raise the radiator with extra pads under it to raise the crank hole in the shell so I could use the crank, and that threw the hood off (worse than before), and then the hood latches did'nt catch, ...
I am in the process of installing a Touring Grind Camshaft which I won at the last Texas Tour in Nacogdoches, Texas (next one is June 12-15, 2025 in Giddings, Texas hosted by the Lone Star Model A Ford Club).
Anyone reading this is welcome to come!
With the radiator out, it became obvious that the new motor mount left the front of the engine significantly lower than before, causing the crank to need to be higher in front.
See picture - the new springs on left are significantly lower and smaller than the old FAM ones. The FAM springs have rubber dampening bushings inside them which are hard to see but aren't rock hard like the thinner (3/8") rubber bushing that goes under the yoke. I think the large rubber bushing goes under the frame above the large washer (and nut + cotter key - not in photo).

I replaced the pads for the rear FAM at the same time. The new pads came with a pad for the transmission which I added between frame and transmission tower - thinking that's where it belonged and maybe I should have or needed it. Was there one there originally and it got lost? That was 60+ years ago and I don't know.

Thinking of going back to original FAM after making a new rubber bushing (thinner one in picture).
I do not understand why the new stuff is so far off. Have verified (e.g. Service Bulletins) that all new parts were installed correctly).
As the size & length of the new "original" springs (left-most in picture) are visibly less than the old parts. I do not understand how they ever could have supported the engine in the proper location. And yet they did from the factory as we all know.
Advice / suggestions welcome.
 

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I'm a little confused.You said the crankshaft sits lower with the new mounts,so the radiator had to be raised???I don't know if you realize it or not,but but the yoke is not supposed to be pulled down tight to the crossmember.The engine is really supported by the side mounts,and just bounces a little on those little springs in the front.There should be space between the crossmember and the flat spot on the yoke.It is NOT supposed to be sitting on a rubber cushion,as so many did over the last 75 years.
 
Yes, the flat spring was installed. All parts as per the article in Service Bulletins. The photo shows my old FAM parts plus the new springs for comparison. I didn't include the other new "original" parts.
 
The crank has to go in with the handle high so the other end is low to match where the crankshaft nut (with hole/hooks) is. Like a teeter-totter across the frame cross member. With the new 'original" parts, I don't think I tightened the yoke down from below to cause it to rest on the flat washer but I may not remember from when I installed it or took it apart even. This system did not have a rubber pad like my FAM Does. Seems to me that there is significant weight on the front engine mount. For example, I have to jack up the front of the engine to get the yoke under the ledges on the front timing cover to install the attaching bolts.
 
If I were you I would install the front factory components and then look at the rear mounts and see which way they need to move to get the crank nut to line up with the crank hole. If you need to lower the back to get the crank nut to line up with the crank when inserted through the frame crank hole bracket you can turn the motor mounts upside down. The holes for the bolts into the flywheel housing are offset. It may require a little grinding of the edge of the floater brackets. If you get the front lined up then the rear floater part will mount on the clamshell and the lip will hang on the frame properly. The yoke type bracket at the rear always needs to be ground on the inside radius to clear the clamshell. I have been using floaters for 50 years. I have them on three cars now all with the stock front motor mounts, all the crank holes line up.
 
This is an old after market front mount not part of a FAM.
The front of the engine will sit to high with that mount.
 

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Jeez, have I replaced a ton of those aftermarket front motor mounts over the years! They ALWAYS cause a misalignment between the crankshaft pulley ratchet nut and the hand crank hole, unless they were really fatigued and allowed the engine to settle down to the proper height in front. If you never had to use the hand crank, you'd probably never know there was misalignment problem. But the first time you needed to hand crank the engine to use the timing pin for reaching TDC in cylinder #1, you'd find out in a hurry you've got a problem. My guess is Western Auto, Sears, Monkey Ward and other aftermarket parts dealers sold these things to unsuspecting Model A owners who wanted to "improve" on the factory design. This and the front radius wishbone mounting design with the rubber ball are among the two most ill-conceived aftermarket "cures" for Model A repairs. Why do people reach for these things when the stock replacement parts are so readily available and no more expensive???
Marshall
 
Richard Knight said:
If I were you I would install the front factory components and then look at the rear mounts and see which way they need to move to get the crank nut to line up with the crank hole.
<<SNIP>> /QUOTE]

Richard, this is a something I had not considered and need to look into. Thank you for your suggestion.
With the stock front motor mount, the crank nut center hole is too low.
So I don't understand - does the rear of the engine at the rear mounts need to go up or down? I.e. raise the back to raise the front (front and back go in same direction) or lower the back to raise the front (the rear mount is a pivot in this regard)?
Again, thank you for your commentary.
Click to expand...
 
Bob C and Marshall,
If the old assembly was not the "official" (Trade Mark) Float-A-Motor, its design was clearly to be FAM like, i.e. use rubber bushings to isolate the front motor mount from the frame and reduce engine vibration as felt by the occupants of the car.
Perhaps I explained poorly, but my engine nut center hole lined up well with the old FAM, and my problems began when I removed it and installed the factory stock springs, which made the crank nut too low. I.e. I have been able to use the crank for 60 years with the front FAM installed. With the stock setup, the engine crank nut is low which causes the front of the hand crank to need to be higher as it is now pointing down from front to back.
 
Solutions I see are 1) Go back to my old FAMS springs and rubber bushing setup which raised the front of the engine or 2) Fix things (how?) so front of engine (crank nut) lines up with crank hole in frame. Richard made one suggestion which I need to understand better. Other ideas are welcome.
Thank you.
 
“ The new pads came with a new transmission pad which I installed “ IMO that pad at the transmission is making the front of your motor low ( think teeter totter ) I would remove the rear transmission pad , install the new front mount whichever one you want, then go back to the rear transmission pad and install it after you trim it down for a snug fit.
 
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I'm trying to picture where you are putting that rubber block in the rear.Do you have the yoke that bolts to the U-joint housing,with an ear for that rubber block to go under?
 
You need to lower the back of the engine. How does the chole rod line up. Is the gas pedal bracket too close to the firewall or even touching? Did you grind the inside of that rear clamshell mount? Pictures would help. I have had to turn the brackets that bolt to the flywheel housing upside down on two recent fam installs but everything will line up.
 
Engine needs to be at approximately 3 degree slope measure at the top of the oil pan surface, and front pulley to be seen properly through the bearing. Try using the original style front mount with rear FAMS if desired. The goal is to use new FAM donuts which will help firm up the mounts and add the benefit of a crossmember type support at the engine rear.
 
Big Hammer & Keith, I don't have anything else (like brackets) that go with the pad at the transmission. The instructions said it was for the transmission, so I used it thinking the old one must have popped out of place along the way. I found a location where it seemed to fit and stuck it in. I need to pull the floorboards and see where I put it. Perhaps it doesn't belong on my car without some other brackets. That may be related to my problem.
Richard and Saxby2, I will look into some of the items you mentioned.
I see I have several items I need to follow up on.
Thank you all.
 
Re Transmission Vibration Pad - I discovered that I DO have the bracket at rear of transmission, which I must have forgotten since I installed the pad there a couple of years ago. I installed the pad in the place on the transmission as shown in the Bratton's instructions for the rear FAM. You can see it bulging out a little in my picture. Now I don't recall if the bracket was resting on the frame or not.
My rear FAM has TOP cast into the top side as installed.
No problem with the choke rod lining up that I noticed and I have been driving it for a couple of years now. Throttle linkage across rear of engine does not touch firewall. I have not ground on anything back there. There is not much clearance between top rear of bell housing and firewall as best I can stick my hand back there perhaps 1/2 inch.
May not be much room to raise engine.
Probably should start by removing the transmission pad. How much of a pad should I have back there? Or revert back to no pad at all?
Thank you all for the thoughts and ideas.
 

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Since you need to lower the rear of the engine I would remove the mount at the back of the trans and see how things line up.
 
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