Electric Fuel Pump Failure

gmcole

gmcole

Junior Member
1950 F1, Flat Head V8 8BA.
Recently had work done on the truck and the mechanic stated that my mechanical fuel pump was not working so they recommended an electric fuel pump. Well, this worked great for about the first 15 cranks and now it will not work. They installed a US Motorworks USEP8011 from speedway and from what I hear this is a very entry level pump that may fail more often than not. Does anyone have experience with these, or is there a better option that you recommend?
 
Send your stock pump to Charlie Schwendler in New York for a complete rebuild.

Charlie Schwendler
(716) 662-9159
cas5845@yahoo.com

He's a real craftsman and uses the best materials and tests all of his work before sending it out. I got sick and tired of the "Electric Fuel Pump Blues" years ago. I removed mine and replaced it with a "Charlie-Built" pump and haven't looked back. It has no problem keeping up with the bigger Rochester 2G I am now running.

Contemporary working mechanics these days have no idea of the quirks and eccentricities of flatheads and often send you down blind alleys applying the things they do know..
 
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i bought a new fuel pump for a very reasonable price and it works well for me so far. i would call the installation on my '41 deluxe straight forward and simple. i pulled the old one with the oil filler pipe still attached as access to the bolts holding it to the block easier to access than the ones holding it to the oil filler pipe. YMMV.

here's a link to a few...

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/shop...cal-fuel-pumps~126-1950-54-21417-12-515-10431

the only advantage to an electric one over mechanical, IMO, is that it will fill up the floatbowl very quickly, which can eliminate a long cranking session on an engine that has sat idle for a couple weeks or so.

the long cranking sessions can be eliminated by other means than the use of an electric fuel pump, BTW.
 
tubman said:
Send your stock pump to Charlie Schwendler in New York for a complete rebuild.

Charlie Schwendler
(716) 662-9159
cas5845@yahoo.com

He's a real craftsman and uses the best materials and tests all of his work before sending it out. I got sick and tired of the "Electric Fuel Pump Blues" years ago. I removed mine and replaced it with a "Charlie-Built" pump and haven't looked back. It has no problem keeping up with the bigger Rochester 2G I am now running.

Contemporary working mechanics these days have no idea of the quirks and eccentricities of flatheads and often send you down blind alleys applying the things they do know..
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i agree...i readily admit flatheads are new to me and necessitate some knowledge that i don't and never had. my engine and the rest of a '41 ford have been a real challenge...and frustration. and i agree that the knowledge can now be difficult to find.

i'm essentially learning that Ford knew what they were doing when they designed the engine and the rest of the car and when in doubt go back to the original design and parts if practicable.
 
These cars ran all these years on mechanical pumps why then would you need to change to electric. If you do let the cars sit and you must have an electric pump just to get them primed and started, then switch to the manual pump you must get an electric pump that is "low pressure" and you can "blow through it" when power is "not" applied to it. That way the mechanical pump can pull fuel through it when it's turned off, very few pumps are made this way most when they are turned off. You can go to Airtex and look at the pumps, and they will list the fuel pressure and if they are closed or open when they are on or off. I'm just as bad, I let my cars sit for months since my stroke, then I have fuel pumps that have dried out, carburetor needle and seats that are stuck, fuel that's old and need to be drained out and replaced. Half the time I don't even remember I have those cars out in the garage, big garage. Lots and lots of old cars with old gas in them. I keep thinking I will get better???
 
I was a fleet mechanic. I got to thinking and I'd be suspicious of a failed fuel pump after 15 starts. Makes me think it's getting clogged from stuff in the tank. They should have mounted the pump close to the tank, and they should have mounted a "large" fuel filter before the pump. I'd start looking at that first. A lot of modern mechanic mechanics are not used to working on antique cars with gas tanks full of rust and junk. I see these shops in my town and there are very few of them I'd trust to work on somebody's car.
 
The new pumps are highly suspect. They help tremendously with eliminating vapor lock and priming dry carbs that boil out the low vapor pressure modern fuel extremely fast. The factory pump would be OK if gas was the same as it was in 1951, but its not as its engineered for modern closed loop systems and that is why an add on electric pump is necessary. I have one on every carburetor car I have in addition to the factory mechanical pump. I have a small stockpile of the good Airtex 6v low pressure pumps that they stopped making quite a few years ago. They can be found occasionally on ebay under the Airtex part number E8902. None available now so keep a search out but here is a sold listing: https://www.ebay.com/itm/2064219454...QW2cFGNnTVt2y8I5OJ5Wnee3I=|tkp:Bk9SR-LAj4r1Zw
 
The 8ba in my '39 p/u has an Airtex mechanical fuel pump I got years ago at the local auto parts store. No issues. I'm also running an electric Airtex installed as Flathead Fever posted just for priming purposes after the truck sits for a while. It's a 12 volt unit but 6 volt units are available. I'm also running a pressure regulator set at 2 1/2 pounds.
 
Please note that were are not talking about new pumps from your FLAPS, but properly rebuilt units refurbished to factory specifications using materials compatible with the fuel available today. Charlie's pumps are a far cry from the carelessly assembled foreign sourced units available a O'Reilly's and the like. The OP has already experienced what you get in a fuel pump (either conventional or electric) when you buy new stuff, and Charlie is more reliable source of quality components than eBay. The only time I would consider an electric pump is when the operating lobe on the camshaft is worn down on an otherwise good running engine.
 
I use an electric pump and bypass the mechanical one completely.. I got tired of cranking a lot before ignition due to, as noted, a dry float tanks from the crappy evaporating gas we have now. Leaded gas from those days didn't evaporate, so no need to prime, etc,

How do people set up a system that uses both? I would like to have a system that starts quickly but has all the fuel lines that give the original look. Do you work the electric pump from a toggle switch at ignition? and I assume the inline electric will act as a flow through device and not hamper operation when not energized

I put a Kevlar sleeve over my carb feed line to limit chances of a vapor lock.
 
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I generally just leave the extra electric pumps on all the time in the summer when vapor lock and dry carb bowls are an issue here in the hot deep south; but I do have them on switches. I simply turn the ignition to run, wait a few seconds for the carb to fill and hit the starter. I got so frustrated with hot starts like when you stop for gas or grab some lunch and come out to have to crank forever to get it to fire. All that is no longer an issue. Most inline electric pumps are "flow through" and can be left in place not running and not interfere with the mechanical pump sucking fuel through them but some are not. Easiest way to tell is to put a new one to your mouth and see if you can breathe through it.


BTW for you types that like to have your cars judged. An add on electric pump is NOT a deduction in EFV8 judging as long is it is out of sight ie. along the inside of the frame rail back near the tank.
 
tubman said:
Please note that were are not talking about new pumps from your FLAPS, but properly rebuilt units refurbished to factory specifications using materials compatible with the fuel available today. Charlie's pumps are a far cry from the carelessly assembled foreign sourced units available a O'Reilly's and the like. The OP has already experienced what you get in a fuel pump (either conventional or electric) when you buy new stuff, and Charlie is more reliable source of quality components than eBay. The only time I would consider an electric pump is when the operating lobe on the camshaft is worn down on an otherwise good running engine.
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Airtex on my 8ba from my local auto parts store is USA made.
 
51504bat said:
Airtex on my 8ba from my local auto parts store is USA made.
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Unfortunately, that's not the guarantee it once was. Or maybe it's just where the box label was printed. But OK, now I'm starting to get it; it's better to replace a part with a new one, no matter the quality, than fix the problem properly.

Every spring, I fill one of those condiment squeeze bottles with fresh gas, and fill the float bowls on my cars before I start them. Holley carbs have these nice vents on them than make it pretty easy to do.
 
I have to second the notion that modern mechanics may know little about working on these old Fords and will apply the easiest bandaid to "fix" the problem. A properly built fuel pump, either by yourself or sent "out" will work just fine. It's not rocket science but there are quirks to getting it right. It is far better to rebuild an original pump than to buy the cheap Chinese copies available now. Many use an electric pump as a priming pump for a car that is not run on a regular basis and it also serves as a back up. I recently drove my car all afternoon in 93 degree temps with just the mechanical pump with no issues. I can actually see the pump action in the glass bowl of the pump. I think the weak point of the whole system is the 6 volt electrics. It just doesn't spin the engine fast enough to fill an empty carb bowl quickly hence the long cranking times. The electric priming pump solves this.
 
So Steve51 do you not have this problem of hard starts in that temperature. Also what temperature does your motor run at the 93 degree temp. Thanks.
 
fj1200a said:
So Steve51 do you not have this problem of hard starts in that temperature. Also what temperature does your motor run at the 93 degree temp. Thanks.
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I did have problems with "hot starting" with an old worn out battery, dodgy regulator, messed up carb and questionable tuning. Dealing with those issues and a new quality battery seems to have solved that issue. I just have the stock dash quages so I can't say what temp it runs at but the quage seems to settle in the same "middle of the quage spot" it always runs at. We have had unusually hot weather here in Minnesota and it did worry me at first, taking a few short drives with mid 90's temps and then gaining confidence took it out all day driving around stopping to visit, going to lunch, lot of starting and stopping....no problems. It starts instantly at the flick of the key. This is my Father's car that I inherited a few years ago and he had the engine completely rebuilt and the original copper radiator recored so I am sure that and new water pumps help. The car sat inactive for a few years till I took it over so I have had to deal with carb, fuel pump, tuning, and charging issues. Now that those are dealt with it is running great.
 
Steve51 said:
I did have problems with "hot starting" with an old worn out battery, dodgy regulator, messed up carb and questionable tuning. Dealing with those issues and a new quality battery seems to have solved that issue. I just have the stock dash quages so I can't say what temp it runs at but the quage seems to settle in the same "middle of the quage spot" it always runs at. We have had unusually hot weather here in Minnesota and it did worry me at first, taking a few short drives with mid 90's temps and then gaining confidence took it out all day driving around stopping to visit, going to lunch, lot of starting and stopping....no problems. It starts instantly at the flick of the key. This is my Father's car that I inherited a few years ago and he had the engine completely rebuilt and the original copper radiator recored so I am sure that and new water pumps help. The car sat inactive for a few years till I took it over so I have had to deal with carb, fuel pump, tuning, and charging issues. Now that those are dealt with it is running great.
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i'm envious.... :)
 
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