Dry Gas

William Kelchner

William Kelchner

Senior Member
Since this ethonol separates after sitting for extended periods of time has anyone dumped some dry gas in the tank? I saw a can the other day which made me wonder since my A sits for several months. Thanks
 
The object of drygas (either isopropyl or methanol) is to bind with water and make a mix that can be run through the engine and burned.

Mixing drygas with ethanol gas MIGHT be a way to make sure the water that ethanol attracts incompletely will make its way through.

This point is disputed by Wikipedia - see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_gas - which contends that Isopropyl or Methyl Alcohol is simply alcohol and one is merely adding to the alcohol load by introducing dri-gas to the fuel.

This true, but what of water excess (through condensation) beyond the ability of the ethanol fuel to absorb it? It is possible that fuel arriving from the gas station may already be "water saturated" and any more condensation settles to the bottom of your tank?

I can't say I've had an issue (other than lawnmower engines of the Briggs&Stratton/Craftsman/Sears variety) which once the carb was plugged/gummed no amount of additive seemed to fix (Even Stabil which is in large part ATF - short chain petroleums.)

Joe K
 
I don't know if the product is like STP gas treatment but if it is, it only made matters worse for me. Its like adding more alcohol
 
This is a controversial subject. I'm in So Oregon. Hot Summers and winters that can dip down into the 20's or teens.
I but stable or what treatment I have in the tank and then I fill it up. I've never had a problem, four or maybe five months and I'm on the road again. I do this for both the T and the A. I recently fired up the leaf blower and that has the same gas in for about a year.
They seem to start right up. There must be something going on as people are having problems I suppose.
 
William, I too have wondered about this like the Red bottles of HEET vs. the Yellow bottle..... if I recall the red bottle is nothing more than the isyopropl alcohol I always wondered what the benefit of using that in Ethanol gas could be:confused:

I changed over to Startron that the boaters use, that plus staying with a shot of MMO and Seafoam never had any problems at all.
 
BlueSunoco said:
William, I too have wondered about this like the Red bottles of HEET vs. the Yellow bottle..... if I recall the red bottle is nothing more than the isyopropl alcohol I always wondered what the benefit of using that in Ethanol gas could be:confused:

I changed over to Startron that the boaters use, that plus staying with a shot of MMO and Seafoam never had any problems at all.
Click to expand...

Having experimented with production of biodiesel using the Methyl Hydroxide method (If you want something that will F you up - just tangle with Methyl Hydroxide!) I seem to remember that one of the two bottles (yellow or red I forget) is Methyl Alcohol and the other is Isopropyl alcohol. One of these, the methyl I believe, is aimed at diesel fuels and the other is aimed at gasoline.

The biodiesel experiments went, um, ok. A lot of work - and hazard - for small return on fuel - and always the chance that you will mess up your injectors or do other dasterdly deeds to your diesel from entrained water (water washing of the diesel fuel is part of the process to remove the methyl hydroxide after esterification.)

Joe K
 
Hey thanks for all that information. Guess I shall stick to SeaFoam - I do not have any problem with my machine (yet), just see the topic of bad gas pop up every now and then.. Cheers
 
Hey Bill take drive the beast over to Winchester to the Liberty station and get ethanol free gas and that problem will be solved:D

Sewall
 
I notice that a lot of members use SeaFoam, pretty expensive stuff that is made with common and available items. Do a search and you will find out you can make it for less than $1.00 a can. 1/7th of it is isopropyl alcohol, if you use the 4,2,1 mixture.
 
holdover said:
I notice that a lot of members use SeaFoam, pretty expensive stuff that is made with common and available items. Do a search and you will find out you can make it for less than $1.00 a can. 1/7th of it is isopropyl alcohol, if you use the 4,2,1 mixture.
Click to expand...

Interesting. Thanks, and I agree it's pretty expensive, but it sure worked wonders years ago on an Olds I bought with sticky lifters. The engine sounded like it had a bad rod knock, but before I drove the 5 miles back home from the store it was quiet as a new engine.:)
 
If you can't find ethanol-free gas, you can make your own by using water to remove the ethanol! Experiment first with a clear glass bottle. Fill about 3/4 full with the gas/ethanol slop, then fill the rest of the way with plain water, shake well and let settle. Since water and gasoline do not mix, the water will soon settle to the bottom of the bottle and you will see two distinct layers of liquid. Now, since water and ethanol do mix, the ethanol in the gas will combine with the water you added and settle to the bottom with the water. You now have pure gasoline sitting on top of the water! Either siphon the gas off from the top or drain the water out the bottom.
Now scale this up as big as you want. I was looking at those square 5 gallon clear plastic jugs racers and motorcyclists use and put a 1/4 turn brass valve in the bottom to drain off the water, but a local station started selling ethanol-free gas.
By the way, refineries start with about 82 octane gas because 10% ethanol raises it to 87 octane. 82 is far higher than what you could buy back then. If you want to end up with 87, buy the 92 octane premium to start with. This is what you get at an ethanol-free station; they just buy the 87 octane base stock from the refinery.
 
I did a search of gas stations in the Exeter/Portsmouth, NH area that have "ethanol free gasoline" (search terms)

Phillips 66 is a short distance off of Route 101 and (familiar with it) is the usual "drive in" consumer gas station.

They don't list pricing on the Phillips 66 website - but I'll check when I get home this weekend.

Joe K
 
I bought a couple gallons of the good gas the other day for my snowblower. Even though the crap gas has dropped quite a bit lately, the good gas hasn't. It was a buck a gallon more for the good gas.
 
If your A has to sit with the ethanol gas in it, the best thing to do is take the gas line off at the carb and drain some gas into a tin can. Watch it as it drains, you'll see the difference right away when the ethanol is gone and the real gas starts flowing.
 
It's a little confusing in N.H.People that go to the stations listed on the internet get there and find out that all the racing fuels are included on that list.We don't really need to be spending $7.50 per gallon for VIP or Cam 2.Also,the store/gas stations that sell it are located near water and have it for recreational boaters.Airports are listed too,but you can't just drive in and fill up.A week ago AV gas was a little over $5.per gallon near me.I,personally,have just about zero trouble with it.We did have some trouble early on,after the mandate,but it was from the use of METHanol,not ETHanol.I did some repairs on a couple of vehicles a few years ago for a local station.They had used methanol instead of ethanol when it was in short supply.I have mason jars with both ethanol gas and methanol gas in them,and some old brass floats in the bottoms.In the methanol jar there is no brass at all,just a ring that must have been the solder.The ethanol jar just has a float sitting in the bottom,and is probably in pure alcohol now,as there is now a line between the two liquids.I think the gas is junk,but we have been using it here since 1980(gasahol)and the sky hasn't fallen yet.
 
40 Deluxe said:
If you can't find ethanol-free gas, you can make your own by using water to remove the ethanol! Experiment first with a clear glass bottle. Fill about 3/4 full with the gas/ethanol slop, then fill the rest of the way with plain water, shake well and let settle. Since water and gasoline do not mix, the water will soon settle to the bottom of the bottle and you will see two distinct layers of liquid. Now, since water and ethanol do mix, the ethanol in the gas will combine with the water you added and settle to the bottom with the water. You now have pure gasoline sitting on top of the water! Either siphon the gas off from the top or drain the water out the bottom.
Now scale this up as big as you want. I was looking at those square 5 gallon clear plastic jugs racers and motorcyclists use and put a 1/4 turn brass valve in the bottom to drain off the water, but a local station started selling ethanol-free gas.
By the way, refineries start with about 82 octane gas because 10% ethanol raises it to 87 octane. 82 is far higher than what you could buy back then. If you want to end up with 87, buy the 92 octane premium to start with. This is what you get at an ethanol-free station; they just buy the 87 octane base stock from the refinery.
Click to expand...

Thanks, 40 deluxe !!!!!!! Great info !!! I've worried about what I could do when it gets to where I can no longer get ethanol free gas . Its not likely that they will ever go back to ethanol free gas as the norm . They are making too much money with the ethanol adultrated crap gas to ever change back .
 
holdover said:
I notice that a lot of members use SeaFoam, pretty expensive stuff that is made with common and available items. Do a search and you will find out you can make it for less than $1.00 a can. 1/7th of it is isopropyl alcohol, if you use the 4,2,1 mixture.
Click to expand...

I agree also, kinda pricey to use too often AND the Stabil 360 you see advertised on Velocity Channel, that's $20 a bottle and they say 'use at every fill up' Yeah right:eek:
 
What if everyone decided to pay the extra price and buy ethanol free gasoline instead of the mandated stuff?

The oil companies are in it to make a profit for sure. But market forces will take ahold in this alternative fuel market like any other?

Eventually you might see only a minor increase in price for BOTH fuels to cover the parallel record keeping/refiniing/separation/lawsuits resulting from accidental substitution AND the inevitable lawsuits from the government related to environmental violation.

And given a natural tendency of those who know the differences between the fuels and make a buying decision based on something other than initial economic hit (many don't buy at Walmart for similar reasons) there might be a considerable market demand?

The EPA Regulatory Automobile might find itself side-swiped by a passing brush with free enterprise?

Joe K
 
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