Drake parts
- Thread starter oldredford
- Start date
done4
Senior Member
Just wondering if these guys had problems with their parts.
1. 4-color cover_good.
2. 30 days trial in your car_good
3. satisfaction or money back_good
Just might give these fella's a try.
1. 4-color cover_good.
2. 30 days trial in your car_good
3. satisfaction or money back_good
Just might give these fella's a try.
Attachments
Hey Vic,
Somebody's complaining about Bob on the V8 site. They need your help over there now!
http://www.earlyfordv8.org/forum/viewmessages.cfm?Forum=18&Topic=4968
Somebody's complaining about Bob on the V8 site. They need your help over there now!
http://www.earlyfordv8.org/forum/viewmessages.cfm?Forum=18&Topic=4968
David J
Well-known member
Seems silly to have to bring this up yet again but - Anyone remember the "duplicate of original " stuff from JC Whitney - the "industria Argentina " stuff ? The regular stuff [ not duplicate of original ] from JC Whitney ? It was even worse . We have come far grasshopper 
. No all is not well but you will NEVER please everyone . I have no gripe with BD & am glad these folks make some useable stuff . If you are so upset with a dealer , seller or whatever just stop spending $'s with them . I have a list of dealers - folks that I refuse to do business with . After all your $'s is what they want . On a completely different note does anyone know of a source for the pivot cones on a 33-34 open car windshield frame ? The ones I bought are REAL GARBAGE . Suppose I could silver solder the pitted areas and fix the gennies but that isn't a 5 minute job . The new studs are also junk - not even the right thread . EPAY stuff - bad idea .
. No all is not well but you will NEVER please everyone . I have no gripe with BD & am glad these folks make some useable stuff . If you are so upset with a dealer , seller or whatever just stop spending $'s with them . I have a list of dealers - folks that I refuse to do business with . After all your $'s is what they want . On a completely different note does anyone know of a source for the pivot cones on a 33-34 open car windshield frame ? The ones I bought are REAL GARBAGE . Suppose I could silver solder the pitted areas and fix the gennies but that isn't a 5 minute job . The new studs are also junk - not even the right thread . EPAY stuff - bad idea .
Vic Piano
Well-known member
He also posted here on the FordBarn, but thanks for bringing it to my attention. However, I've already said that I can't speak to the "belt" problem as I've always bought belts from the local auto parts store... I also stated that I'm not concerned if the belt(s) I buy are not emblazoned with a Ford logo... I don't have a problem with anyone objecting to BD or any other parts supplier; I have a problem with the way they object. I don't think that going on the attack and using derogatory language is an appropriate way to voice objections, as it tends to diminish credibility and minimize effectiveness. By the same token, I have no problem supporting BD and others that I have enjoyed doing business with for many years. Perhaps you can provide some insight (to all of us) as to where you obtain all your reproduction parts. I’m sure that information would be appreciated.
FL&WVMIKE
Well-known member
Seems silly to have to bring this up yet again but - Anyone remember the "duplicate of original " stuff from JC Whitney - the "industria Argentina " stuff ? The regular stuff [ not duplicate of original ] from JC Whitney ? It was even worse . We have come far grasshopper
Come on, David J., tell us the names of the dealers you will not do business with. Then someone else will defend them. We can, then, have some brilliant discussions going on. Fordbarn needs this ! - NOT - NOT- NOT - NOT - NOT !! ...... LOL
MIKE
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Lanny
Well-known member
Maybe the coroner is still not sure if the horse is dead yet.
I have bought a few parts from BD over the years, and have never had to return a part, but I had to tweak a few parts, occasionally, to make them fit, and seems like the quality is a little worse today on some parts.
That said, if BD is misrepresenting the parts quality and/or fitment of them, then I can see why a buyer, of any misrepresented parts, should expect to be reimbursed for the shipping charges to return them.
I'm glad that Kube is helping FordBarn members to be aware, and be on the lookout for any misrepresented parts.
If WE don't stand together and fight for quality parts, then who the hell will
.
I have bought a few parts from BD over the years, and have never had to return a part, but I had to tweak a few parts, occasionally, to make them fit, and seems like the quality is a little worse today on some parts.
That said, if BD is misrepresenting the parts quality and/or fitment of them, then I can see why a buyer, of any misrepresented parts, should expect to be reimbursed for the shipping charges to return them.
I'm glad that Kube is helping FordBarn members to be aware, and be on the lookout for any misrepresented parts.
If WE don't stand together and fight for quality parts, then who the hell will
.
37 Coupe
Well-known member
I am for disclosing the truth about poor quality parts individually not nessarily bashing the dealer himself. The information should help the next guy buy the best part from whichever vendor. Example would be poor fitting window rubber seals for 1937 Ford from Carpenter,better quality and fitting ones from Drake (actual expierience) but a few years ago Carpenter provided great fitting seals for my 53 -F-100. So I have not worked on every year of Ford but have on couple 46's ,Model A,1939's and F-100 seems one supplier hits a home run on some years parts and not so much on another. Won't even try Vintique parts anymore,actually have never ordered from them but Drake will use them and I suppose Carpenter and others ,I make sure when ordering if it is made in house or Vintique. Only bashing I will do on Drake is that catalog fiasco and that horse has been beaten,ressurected,beaten again cremated etc,but I still am owed money on that deal.
JM 35 Sedan
Well-known member
I have sent Ryan private messages in the past, posted messages on the Forums, etc., requesting a supplier/vendor listing here on Ford Barn like we once had on Shelly's old Fordbarn. I still have saved copies of Ryan's pm's back to me promising that he was working on this and for me to "be patient man, this will happen...trust me". That reply message is now about two years old and no supplier/vendor listing has been added to Ford Barn that I am aware of.
Added note...The only suppliers/vendors who would be allowed to remain on this list would be those who earned a good reputation by some method of member confirmation or means of approval.
Added note...The only suppliers/vendors who would be allowed to remain on this list would be those who earned a good reputation by some method of member confirmation or means of approval.
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37 Coupe has again hit the nail on the head, he mentions varying quality of window seals for two different applications from two different suppliers. The fact that one supplier makes a better product for the same application tha another opens up the possibility of redundancy from the get go.
If a list of parts and manufactures were compiled it would in fact be the size of a medium size book. Think of it, thousands of parts and numerous manufacturers. To do the topic justice an author would have to research the background of each part, perhaps even going so far as to checking the actual factory that produced each part. Someone like Bob Drake (for example) would have dozens of different suppliers, each would have to be checked and the quality of parts checked, then compared to others.
This would be a daunting task, I'm not surprised Ryan is laying 'Doggo' on this one. Then, in a move that could render huge amounts of data redundant, all it would take is for the suppliers like Drake, Mac's etc. to look at the "Big Book Of Really Really Neat and High Quality Parts" and decide to improve their specifications or change suppliers. Months if not years of work made obsolete by a few suppliers reallocating resources and manufacturers.
As I said on the other post on this topic, it's a noble idea to have such a list, but when such lists are compiled subjectivity has to take a back seat to expert knowledge. The possibility is high that all the research of parts, and the compiling of data and expert opinion into a book could be all for nothing in a few months time. QED.
Having said all that! Whew! I have one foot in both camps on the topic of reproduction parts. Bob Drake et.al are to be admired for making parts available. Without these guys we would be in big trouble, and I'm sure that there is a continual process of refinement and improvement going on behind the scenes. This is helped by informed and constructive observation and improvement from the market-place.
The other side of this is; poor quality parts that in an ideal world would have been processed thus: Part made, tested, found wanting, discarded, then improved, tested , proved and marketed. The way stuff used to be made. However as the market is realitvely small we must wear the poor quality until the parts are improved. Hopefully this does happen.
In the meantime Mr Drake does himself no favours by rushing to market, then (and this to me is shonky and unacceptable) when a customer enquires about a bad part, staff at Bob Drake are directed to say "Really? You're the first one to complain". That in my book is close to deception, and is unworthy, unethical and unacceptable.
Many comments have been made regarding return shipping, and there lies a legitimate grievance. If a substandard part is knowingly sold that is misrepresentation. If the customer is then required to pay return shipping that adds insult to injury. The result is mistrust and suspicion, not to mention the fact that no-one feels good after being deceived. Most times a small gesture goes a long way, and my suggestion would be for Mr Drake to desist from fobbing customers off with "You're the only guy who's complained." This sad refrain could be replaced with "What exactly is the problem" and after further enquiry "How can we help you to make (situation/product) better." In itself this line of enquiry by sales staff is a huge resource; the business gets relevant and specific information from it's customers without having to pay Marketing people to conduct market research, talk about looking a gift-horse in the mouth. The icing on the cake though would be to offer free return shipping.
Free return shipping is the right thing to do. There's no other way to say it. If you knowingly sell a defective or not 'as described' part, then you are reponsible to the buyer to make that transaction agreeable to the buyer. An easy way to do this would be to offer in-store credit or reimbursment. And yes this is financially painful, and by that method alone would the errors be eliminated or reduced to a tolerable level. Add to that the adoption of a proven methodology in customer service, and it is unlikely this topic would ever have reared it's very ugly head on this and other sites.
If a list of parts and manufactures were compiled it would in fact be the size of a medium size book. Think of it, thousands of parts and numerous manufacturers. To do the topic justice an author would have to research the background of each part, perhaps even going so far as to checking the actual factory that produced each part. Someone like Bob Drake (for example) would have dozens of different suppliers, each would have to be checked and the quality of parts checked, then compared to others.
This would be a daunting task, I'm not surprised Ryan is laying 'Doggo' on this one. Then, in a move that could render huge amounts of data redundant, all it would take is for the suppliers like Drake, Mac's etc. to look at the "Big Book Of Really Really Neat and High Quality Parts" and decide to improve their specifications or change suppliers. Months if not years of work made obsolete by a few suppliers reallocating resources and manufacturers.
As I said on the other post on this topic, it's a noble idea to have such a list, but when such lists are compiled subjectivity has to take a back seat to expert knowledge. The possibility is high that all the research of parts, and the compiling of data and expert opinion into a book could be all for nothing in a few months time. QED.
Having said all that! Whew! I have one foot in both camps on the topic of reproduction parts. Bob Drake et.al are to be admired for making parts available. Without these guys we would be in big trouble, and I'm sure that there is a continual process of refinement and improvement going on behind the scenes. This is helped by informed and constructive observation and improvement from the market-place.
The other side of this is; poor quality parts that in an ideal world would have been processed thus: Part made, tested, found wanting, discarded, then improved, tested , proved and marketed. The way stuff used to be made. However as the market is realitvely small we must wear the poor quality until the parts are improved. Hopefully this does happen.
In the meantime Mr Drake does himself no favours by rushing to market, then (and this to me is shonky and unacceptable) when a customer enquires about a bad part, staff at Bob Drake are directed to say "Really? You're the first one to complain". That in my book is close to deception, and is unworthy, unethical and unacceptable.
Many comments have been made regarding return shipping, and there lies a legitimate grievance. If a substandard part is knowingly sold that is misrepresentation. If the customer is then required to pay return shipping that adds insult to injury. The result is mistrust and suspicion, not to mention the fact that no-one feels good after being deceived. Most times a small gesture goes a long way, and my suggestion would be for Mr Drake to desist from fobbing customers off with "You're the only guy who's complained." This sad refrain could be replaced with "What exactly is the problem" and after further enquiry "How can we help you to make (situation/product) better." In itself this line of enquiry by sales staff is a huge resource; the business gets relevant and specific information from it's customers without having to pay Marketing people to conduct market research, talk about looking a gift-horse in the mouth. The icing on the cake though would be to offer free return shipping.
Free return shipping is the right thing to do. There's no other way to say it. If you knowingly sell a defective or not 'as described' part, then you are reponsible to the buyer to make that transaction agreeable to the buyer. An easy way to do this would be to offer in-store credit or reimbursment. And yes this is financially painful, and by that method alone would the errors be eliminated or reduced to a tolerable level. Add to that the adoption of a proven methodology in customer service, and it is unlikely this topic would ever have reared it's very ugly head on this and other sites.
Sid the Maineiac
Well-known member
I believe you have summed up what Kube has said right along.I respect Kube for his knowledge and his sense of decency.He is probably the most honest seller on Ebay if you have ever bought from there..Bob Drake needs to revise his return policy.When he sells something that is not as he claims it to be,he should pay to have it returned.It makes me angry that many guys have had to elect to throw something in the trash simply cause it cost too much to return to Bob Drake.That is poor business ethics personified. I'm with you, FE26 and Kube.Insist that these Companies do the right thing!!
done4
Senior Member
Fe26, great commentary and I think this is what Kube has been saying from the first word in his post. Now, the opportunity to act is at hand so how is it done?
As for Ryan (the boss) I don't see why he would be dragged into this issue. His plate is full and I think this is an end user problem that have the numbers and direct control to change and improve the product and services used by the group that supports the suppliers. The power is in numbers and Ford Barn has that. Time to use it?
As for Ryan (the boss) I don't see why he would be dragged into this issue. His plate is full and I think this is an end user problem that have the numbers and direct control to change and improve the product and services used by the group that supports the suppliers. The power is in numbers and Ford Barn has that. Time to use it?
Kube
Super Moderator
I want to thank all that have had the tenacity to stand up for what is correct and not be shouted down by the guys that are all too willing to accept inferior (not as advertised) parts as well as poor (non-existent at times) customer service.
A few have attempted to paint me as some guy that has it out for BD. Not so. I have it out for anyone that so openly does me wrong.
I did pose a comparison to one fellow in an earlier post that thought these threads were unfair. In it I asked if he had ever read a movie or restaurant review. No answer to that...
We have little other way as fellow hobbyists to find out who the "good suppliers" are.
It has become overwhelmingly clear BD lacks the ethics I demand of both myself and those I deal with. He has had numerous opportunities to answer a number of folk's issues right here on the Barn and yet has chosen only to 1) initially attack me personally and 2) when that didn't work, completely change (edit) that response to some political rhetoric.
A few have attempted to paint me as some guy that has it out for BD. Not so. I have it out for anyone that so openly does me wrong.
I did pose a comparison to one fellow in an earlier post that thought these threads were unfair. In it I asked if he had ever read a movie or restaurant review. No answer to that...
We have little other way as fellow hobbyists to find out who the "good suppliers" are.
It has become overwhelmingly clear BD lacks the ethics I demand of both myself and those I deal with. He has had numerous opportunities to answer a number of folk's issues right here on the Barn and yet has chosen only to 1) initially attack me personally and 2) when that didn't work, completely change (edit) that response to some political rhetoric.
Old Redneck
Well-known member
I guess the truth hurts. This way we know what to expect from some venders. Some repo parts are very good but some are junk. We spend money buying parts and expect the parts to be close as possible. If the parts are not as they should be at least our money refunded or better parts. BUT when we receive junk we will let everone know what to expect from them. That all.
Vic Piano
Well-known member
That is an excellent idea Ed, that way anyone that has a problem with a part(s) (fit, finish, etc.) could let everyone know, maybe even post photos showing the problem with the part. They could even list the part #, manufacturer and vendor they got the part(s) from. That would leave the decision to buy or not up to each individual. Equally as important (I think) would be to post part(s), etc. that you are happy with and provide the information to all of us.
Customer service (or lack of same) could also be addressed.
that way anyone that has a problem with a part(s) (fit, finish, etc.) could let everyone know, maybe even post photos showing the problem with the part. They could even list the part #, manufacturer and vendor they got the part(s) from. That would leave the decision to buy or not up to each individual. Equally as important (I think) would be to post part(s), etc. that you are happy with and provide the information to all of us.Customer service (or lack of same) could also be addressed.
Bob Drake Repro
Member
Ford Barners, if we go back to how all this started, Mike K. posted a complaint about (2) parts that we supply. The first being a battery box that was not assembled to the extent we printed it was in our catalog. We explained our mistake (publicly) why it was not fully assembled and noted to all that we would change our catalog description.
The second was 1939 floor board seals. Our seals (in stock) fit our perfectly original 1939 Ford floor boards (we posted pictures). They also fit Vic’s 1939 convertible sedan with no issues. No one else chimed in except Mike K. (who also posted pictures). Mike also sent me a private message and I replied in part with: “To address the floorboard seal issue, I’ve left the pictures up showing our seal loosely installed on an original floorboard. As you can see there are no fitment issues. I’ve also viewed your picture and noted the discrepancy. I have many samples of original and NOS floorboards (I’m sure you do as well) with only very slight size variations, so, without more research, can only guess as to why the size difference (mid-year change, different Ford production factory, standard versus deluxe, different body styles, etc, etc).
In any case, I have no qualms at all about exchanging or crediting the seals (or any of our parts) in your possession and never have. I will continue to look for a credible explanation.”
Now, (for some reason) this whole subject has been turned into an ethical dispute about the misconception of our company policies and the misconception that we train our customer service people to say something along the lines of “that’s the first time we’ve heard that”. We don’t teach our people to say that at all but as a side note, we’ve been making these seals for 15+ years and this IS the first time we’ve come across this issue. Believe it or not, in the rare instance that you do hear this statement, it is undeniably true.
Attached is our printed policy available online and in our catalogs, which clearly states “when the return is due to our error, we will refund the pre-paid freight charges, and immediately exchange or refund”. To date – we have not received the return of the floor board seals from Mike K., if he does choose to return them, we will fit them up to the original floor boards we have and compare them to our existing inventory and compare them to the Ford prints and if we find a discrepancy, will most certainly refund his return postage along with the part cost (or exchange if he wishes), just like we always have and would do with any customer.
Bob
The second was 1939 floor board seals. Our seals (in stock) fit our perfectly original 1939 Ford floor boards (we posted pictures). They also fit Vic’s 1939 convertible sedan with no issues. No one else chimed in except Mike K. (who also posted pictures). Mike also sent me a private message and I replied in part with: “To address the floorboard seal issue, I’ve left the pictures up showing our seal loosely installed on an original floorboard. As you can see there are no fitment issues. I’ve also viewed your picture and noted the discrepancy. I have many samples of original and NOS floorboards (I’m sure you do as well) with only very slight size variations, so, without more research, can only guess as to why the size difference (mid-year change, different Ford production factory, standard versus deluxe, different body styles, etc, etc).
In any case, I have no qualms at all about exchanging or crediting the seals (or any of our parts) in your possession and never have. I will continue to look for a credible explanation.”
Now, (for some reason) this whole subject has been turned into an ethical dispute about the misconception of our company policies and the misconception that we train our customer service people to say something along the lines of “that’s the first time we’ve heard that”. We don’t teach our people to say that at all but as a side note, we’ve been making these seals for 15+ years and this IS the first time we’ve come across this issue. Believe it or not, in the rare instance that you do hear this statement, it is undeniably true.
Attached is our printed policy available online and in our catalogs, which clearly states “when the return is due to our error, we will refund the pre-paid freight charges, and immediately exchange or refund”. To date – we have not received the return of the floor board seals from Mike K., if he does choose to return them, we will fit them up to the original floor boards we have and compare them to our existing inventory and compare them to the Ford prints and if we find a discrepancy, will most certainly refund his return postage along with the part cost (or exchange if he wishes), just like we always have and would do with any customer.
Bob