Complete rebuild needed?

R

RickMcK

Member
Hi I need to do a complete overhaul of my old flathead as it has a water leak and one rusted cylinder. Thus I have a list of questions.
  • how heavy is the long block (w/o heads & intake)? So I can get a strong enough engine hoist.
  • I have a 32 block (poured mains) is it possible to replace these with drop in's? If no can they be re-poured? Where- by whom (Seattle WA)?
  • How do I safely remove the head studs (I know some were set with loctite)?
  • What is the best way to hoist the block. IE do I need a special plate to bolt to? If yes how and what do I need to make (have made).
  • How to safely remove the exhaust manifold nuts without breaking the studs?
  • Where do I get cam, rod and main bearings?
  • Where do I get a ring set?
  • can the oil pump be rebuilt? If yes where do I get new gears?
  • What are your recommendations for a low cost engine stand

I know I will have more questions as I get into this as the last time I had it apart is 30 years ago or so, and I had access to a complete machine shop ( my dads).
 
I would try talking to Hagen's in Puyallup, on River Road, as they do older engines all the time. There used to be a babbitt pouring shop up on First hill East of Seattle University by the name of A & W Auto Parts. I don't know if they still exist. Hagen's should be able to point you in the right direction.
 
Any engine hoist that is used to pull v8 engines would work. A hoist plate for the block is nice (I use one) but not needed. A couple of bolts and short pieces of chain will work. To be safe, I would use four blots with two separate short lengths of chain. Use a washer on the head of the bolts to assure it will not pull through the bolts. A lot depends on how you are pulling it, such as with a lot of accessories attached or not and if just the block or the whole engine and transmission as a unit. I like to strip the engines as much as possible and pull what would amount to a short block.

You need a stud puller to remove the studs and it can be a real job on some engines. It is very common to snap off studs when pulling them. There are a lot of methods to aid in stud removal, soaking them in penetrating oil, heating them, etc. broken studs can be removed by welding a nut to the remaining piece in the block and then removing it. There are a lot of threads on stud removal with tips on getting them out, but again, often a very difficult task.

All the normal venders carry parts, need to check with the machine shop you will be using first for several reasons. For one, some shops will only work on engines if they are allowed to supply the part. Secondly don't get to far into this project without having the block tested for cracks, mag'ed and pressure tested. If your shop will allow you to purchase your own parts then need to be sure they are the correct ones for the finished product are any required machine work. Oil pump parts and/or pumps are available.

Edit: Just reread where you have access to a machine shop, as in engine type of machine shop? Does it have the capability to turn cranks, bore cylinders, that type of machine shop? If so, ordering your own parts should not be an issue!!!

Any engine stand will work, it is best to have one that is wide enough at the base that it will not tip easily. A four wheel one is better than a three wheel one. I would not mount an early flathead from the bell-housing flange (some people do). It is my belief that it is much better and safer to mount the block by the exhaust holes on the side of the block. There are several suppliers of these mounts, or they are easily fab'ed.
 
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I don't understand cheap rebuild. If this is truly a 32 block, it deserves the best that can be had
 
Not a "cheep rebuild" I will do the best I can. When I first restored the truck (36 pickup) I did a partial rebuild (30+years ago). This is a 32 block in a 36 with a 36 pan (welded up bottom vent) and 36 external parts (heads, distributor, intake and carb generator..) so from the outside it looks like a 36.

Yes step one is to have it checked for cracks

Thanks for the lead to Hagan's. I know of them but have not been down there. My dad's shop is long gone ;( so I will use my local place that knows about flatheads, and will check with Hagan's for there advice. A&W is long gone (now a bar, coffee place).

My hope is to have the machine shop do all the machining and balancing, then I put it all back together, as I have done that several times to this and many other motors.
 
RickMcK said:
Hi I need to do a complete overhaul of my old flathead as it has a water leak and one rusted cylinder. Thus I have a list of questions.
  • how heavy is the long block (w/o heads & intake)? So I can get a strong enough engine hoist.
  • I have a 32 block (poured mains) is it possible to replace these with drop in's? If no can they be re-poured? Where- by whom (Seattle WA)?
  • How do I safely remove the head studs (I know some were set with loctite)?
  • What is the best way to hoist the block. IE do I need a special plate to bolt to? If yes how and what do I need to make (have made).
  • How to safely remove the exhaust manifold nuts without breaking the studs?
  • Where do I get cam, rod and main bearings?
  • Where do I get a ring set?
  • can the oil pump be rebuilt? If yes where do I get new gears?
  • What are your recommendations for a low cost engine stand
I know I will have more questions as I get into this as the last time I had it apart is 30 years ago or so, and I had access to a complete machine shop ( my dads).
Click to expand...
the cheapest usable engine stand is

http://www.harborfreight.com/2000-lb-foldable-engine-stand-69521-8970.html

Don't get the cheaper one No Ball Bearings so you cannot rotate engine
 
Kahuna said:
I don't understand cheap rebuild. If this is truly a 32 block, it deserves the best that can be had
Click to expand...

Right! 1932 block is rare. Treat it like gold!
I don;t think you can successfully drop insert bearing into this block.
Any attempt would be a cludge and just take away from the engine.
You need re babitting.

I would find a shop that can re babbitt and removed the head studs too then you can do the rest if you desire.
Otherwise studs may break and you could ruin the block!
 
Probably easiest and cheapest to get a 37 or later block with inserts. You can always use 36 heads on it if that matters and use early? motor mounts. Most lookers couldn't tell the difference. My 36 has a 37 motor with water pump motor mounts. It looks fine to me and no one that could tell the difference has ever seen it anyway. Note the 40 wheels as well.

IMHO re-pouring v8 babbit is a more difficult option vs later engine with inserts unless you are building a high point restoration. Not many around who really know how to pour babbit anymore.
 
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BTW if you get a later block and are looking for inserts, IMHO ebay is the best place to find NOS. I got NORS rod inserts cheap for my 37 motor on ebay.
 
Chuck. Thanks for the lead to "Earls Machine" in Burien. I will ring him up.

My hope is the mains are OK, as I remember I replaced the rod bearings, rings 30 years ago and it probably has less than 1,500 miles on it.

For this go around if the block passses (or can be fixed) I will have the mains, rods and cam bearings checked and R&R as required. Get it balanced. Then have all the valves ground and lapped, I know it needs least one sleeve, then hopefully reuse the same pistons, with new rings.

In removing head studs. I know this can mean death to the block (or EDM them out). Why have the machine shop do it? What can they do that I can't? In the past I have removed some by this process:

Apply penetrating oil
With a torch heat the block, then the stud several times and apply more oil.
Let everything cool
Then heat the block and give it a twist. I have used the jam nut technique to unscrew them in the past.

Any other suggestions?

JSerry. Where did you get the exhaust mounts? Or can you send me a photo?
 
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