Car title value.

From a guy who has built many repro 32 roadster pkg cars, I have no idea how the buyers get them titled as I only furnish a bill of sale. Same goes for the many 100's of repro frames I've built. There wouldn't be a hot rod industry today if every build depended on an original frame. I contacted the state about issuing a MSO with serial number to go with the cars and frames and they told me I wasn't a big enough manufacturer for this process. As a builder who has built many cars from pieces a clear title in NE. is worth it's weight in gold. To date I've never had a problem with cars I've sold and I have cars in several different foreign countries including California. Always wondered what happens at the exporters?
 
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I had a '46 Ford 5 passenger in 1963 that got totaled. I also had a 1946 Club coupe with no title. I sold the whole lot to my uncle with him knowing all the details and he put the engine in the club coupe and ran it on the good title for a couple of years and sold it to another person who drove it for a while longer and then parked it in a garage and it sat there until he sold it last year to I don't know who. I don't know if he or the new owner knows about the wrong title issue. I know the car sat for over 40 years.
 
Here, in Iowa, there has been a crackdown on people bringing vehicles into the state for title transfer. Several arrests have been made when the DMV couldn't verify that the paperwork was valid.
 
It is best to have a title for purchasing a vehicle out of state for the local dmv personel are not properly trained to find the vin numbers on vehicles....they refer them to our local highway patrol, they are called Vin Verifiers
 
I'm having to get a title cleaned up in another state before I try to get it titled in Virginia. FWIW don't even try to bring anything but a clean clear title to Virginia. They won't accept the Georgia bond title either.

Lonnie
 
I had a 30 coupe that I sold 5 or 6 years ago that went to Canada with a notorized bill of sale and a copy of the registration without any problems. Vermont doesn't title anything that old so it's bill of sale only. the frame was pulled out of the back hill's and probably sat there for 50 years.
 
"Legally, the guy that owns the title, also owns the car. And, it does not matter how many times the car may have been sold.
A title DOES go with the car. Titles are not "owned" by anyone but the state that issued them." ( ... this is kind of confusing. First the guy owns the title, therefore owns the car. Then the state owns the title. Wouldn't the state then own the car?)

"You can't OWN a title. It is issued by the State and remains property of the State. You, as a "consumer" are allowed to "use" the title as a means to identify ownership of the vehicle."

"The fact remains, it is a title, owned by the state."


This got me thinking. So, I started trying to find some documentation that indicates that the "state owns the title." I found nothing.

Maybe there is something going on that I can't verify, but laws are funny in that they have to be written down. Nothing in writing. Maybe in some states, but for sure not in Florida.

I then got on the phone, on hold, waiting to speak to different people about this.

They all assured me that a Certificate of Title is issued to the owner of a vehicle and is the property of that owner. When the vehicle's ownership is changed then the Title becomes a transfer document which is used to legally change ownership.

There are a number of reasons an owner can involuntarily lose ownership of a vehicle ... in those cases, naturally the title must be surrendered to indicate a change in ownership. As long as the individual owns the vehicle, he owns the title. When a vehicle is junked, not only does the ownership change, but also the vehicle is rendered no longer qualified for use. The title is turned in to facilitate this action.

I never heard anyone claim that a title belongs to the state. If there is some proof, it'd be interesting.

The state does not "own" your drivers license even though the law makes provisions for them to suspend, revoke or seize it. Same for your tag. The police can take your tag under certain legal circumstances, but the tag is your property.

I didn't ask about birth certificates. I've always assumed mine belonged to me.

I have a deed to my home. It's mine, but if the state wants to put a freeway through here, they can take the deed and my house.

As far as selling titles, rely on what is written in the law. I would not confuse vehicle ownership and transfer documentation requirements with ownership of the title.
 
Another thing to keep in mind is that all these laws and regulations pertain to cars operating on public roads, that's the reason a state can make us jump through all these hoops.
You can own a car without a title just like you can own a tractor, lawn mower, or washing machine. Race cars and farm trucks that never go on pubic road don't need titles. You could own an antique car and just trailer it to shows without a licence or title.
 
Jim in Wisconsin said:
Another thing to keep in mind is that all these laws and regulations pertain to cars operating on public roads, that's the reason a state can make us jump through all these hoops.
You can own a car without a title just like you can own a tractor, lawn mower, or washing machine. Race cars and farm trucks that never go on pubic road don't need titles. You could own an antique car and just trailer it to shows without a licence or title.
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If this show car burned up in a garage fire, I wonder if the insurance company would pay for it without a tile? I imagine they would probably demand proof of ownership.
 
39topless said:
If this show car burned up in a garage fire, I wonder if the insurance company would pay for it without a tile? I imagine they would probably demand proof of ownership.
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I know I can get insurance on my vintage race car. (It obviously doesn't cover when raced, but most everything else). I would expect something similar would be available for show cars.
 
This is what's known as "underwriting." Hagerty will not automatically reject an application because the car does not have a title, is not registered, or does not have an ID number.

While some sort of number is preferred, they will consider anything toward proper identification. And, would likely welcome the opportunity to evaluate/insure the vehicle.

Underwriting is the determination of insurable risk, rating ... etc.

Questions like this should be answered directly by Hagerty. Don't be bashful. It minimizes arguing on the board.
 
Jim in Wisconsin said:
Hagerty never asked me about titles or licence plates, they want pictures of the car and of the garage it's kept in.
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Wow, that is nuts for them to not require more documentation. So someone could take a picture of your car, or anyone's car for that matter, take a picture of his garage, send those photos to Hagerty and boom, they have a $30,000 policy on a car they don't even own. Then, six months later, they file a claim with Hagerty for a stolen vehicle and, boom X 2, they are 30 grand richer. I have to assume that Hagerty requires more documentation of ownership with a claim than they do for the original application for insurance.
 
...one problem with this scenario(illegal act), is I would think Hagerty, and others, would want a complete police report on the theft, and that would probally uncover the crime.
 
Hoop said:
This is what's known as "underwriting." Hagerty will not automatically reject an application because the car does not have a title, is not registered, or does not have an ID number.

While some sort of number is preferred, they will consider anything toward proper identification. And, would likely welcome the opportunity to evaluate/insure the vehicle.

Underwriting is the determination of insurable risk, rating ... etc.

Questions like this should be answered directly by Hagerty. Don't be bashful. It minimizes arguing on the board.
Click to expand...

Hagerty required me to send copies of my titles a few months ago. Maybe I was a suspect??
 
My '31 coupe chopped and channeled - '48 X member between original rails - 59AB engine Eddie Myers heads & dual '97's carbs which I built in the early 50's somehow got "lost" between the time in 1955 when I left for USMC boot camp and my first liberty. I still have the title and today I'd pay way too much to have it back now.
 
This is all tomato's and tamato's.....All verys from state to state. In most states today it is illegal to sell a car without a title. However depending on how old or where it came from not all cars had titles. here are some facts. In the last 8 years Our states have been combining into one system, (in efforts to cut down on auto theft) this is causing alot of trouble for hot rodders. example if you are building a 1932 ford when you go to register it there is a Flag in the system that tells the DMV to check and make sure everything is on the up and up. There are more 1932 ford cars registered today in The US than henry ford ever made, And that is Not even counting the ones that are being build as I am writing this. Here is a couple of reasons why there are so many 32 fords registered today. years ago everyone with a 32 ford was selling their old original frames and getting new aftermarket frames and keeping their titles and just restamping numbers on the new frame. Well the guy who bought the original frame at the swapmmet he would go into another state and get a title issued for the frame in his name. Now you have 2 32 fords using the same number, Which worked fine since they were in 2 different states. Well since computers have come along and states are going to one system, It is causing trouble. Whats Bad is No one really done anything wrong here, But it is still a problem. There are several cases of this right now and states are taking it upon their self as how to handle it. In my state the title always follows the frame, So if you have the original frame, You have rights to the original title. If your frame is a restamp (and was not done by the state or law enforcement) Then you don't have rights to ****! And could be facing tampering charges. As regardless of what your good buddy Billy Bob or Dip **** Bob told you, Restamping a VIN is a felony and is called tampering and carrys a Jail sentence.
 
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