Tom Cavallaro
Senior Member
How do I remove the bushings in the sector without harming the sector?
Bushings!
- Thread starter Tom Cavallaro
- Start date
Purdy Swoft
Well-known member
The bushings are in the sector housing. With the housing removed, the sector will be out of harms way and the old bushings can be driven out. I have used a punch or screwdriver and used a hammer to drive them out. Pay close attention how the oil grooves in the old bushings face and install the new bushings in the same direction. A bushing driver will be a big help for installation of the new bushings. I usually order an extra set of bushings in case I mess one up during installation. The bushings will need to be reamed to 1.125 or the sector won't fit. Its usually best to replace the sector when the bushings are replaced.
Tom Cavallaro
Senior Member
Wow that surprises me! Nothing to wear out on the sector. It looks to me like all the replacement sectors are with the needle bearings. All I've read about them... It seems they still leak.
Tom Wesenberg
Well-known member
There's been much discussion about reaming vs. honing for the king pin bushings, but I haven't seen any debate on the steering box bushings.
Kevin in NJ
Well-known member
There is no debate on the reaming vs honing.
Just simple science and basic requirements for the application.
It is basic standard of how the part must be rebuilt in the case of the sector. It should be on the king pins, but many do not understand the reason for honing or simple choose to not do what is required and is best.
Now for the why.
Reaming does not leave a round hole, the surface will be wavy. The shaft will quickly wear down the high spots leaving too much play. While in the king pins some believe this is acceptable, in the sector this is not acceptable as it will leak and it will be too loose.
To compound the sector bushing need for honing....
With the sectors you also have the problem that the dealers are not selling the correct bushing. The bushing they sell has too large and ID to be able line hone to the .001" clearance required for the sector bushing. Instead when you put these bushings in the sector basically just fits the hole snug. I found this out when I put a NOS sector in a housing with bushings. I also called around and found the major dealers only stock the wrong bushing (I believe it is a truck king pin bushing).
This snug fit is because the bushing distorts a little leaving high spots. These will quickly wear leaving a lot of play and plenty of room for the oil to leak out. If you try to hone them round they will be way too big when you are done. Just have to beat them out and throw them away. Or you could have your sector hard chrome plated and ground to a larger diameter and have the housing honed to size. BTW, expect to spend around $200 to have this done according to what someone who did it paid.
Click for my steering sector notes
Now for needle bearings....
Using the needle bearings is hit or miss.
The sector MUST be hard enough for the small contact area of the needle bearings. If the sector is too soft they will put tiny dents in the sector that will lead to looseness and bearing breakage.
Some have had good luck with their sector and others have not. It all depends if the company who made the sectors were making them hard enough. Plus there is how much and how hard you drive your car.
Just simple science and basic requirements for the application.
It is basic standard of how the part must be rebuilt in the case of the sector. It should be on the king pins, but many do not understand the reason for honing or simple choose to not do what is required and is best.
Now for the why.
Reaming does not leave a round hole, the surface will be wavy. The shaft will quickly wear down the high spots leaving too much play. While in the king pins some believe this is acceptable, in the sector this is not acceptable as it will leak and it will be too loose.
To compound the sector bushing need for honing....
With the sectors you also have the problem that the dealers are not selling the correct bushing. The bushing they sell has too large and ID to be able line hone to the .001" clearance required for the sector bushing. Instead when you put these bushings in the sector basically just fits the hole snug. I found this out when I put a NOS sector in a housing with bushings. I also called around and found the major dealers only stock the wrong bushing (I believe it is a truck king pin bushing).
This snug fit is because the bushing distorts a little leaving high spots. These will quickly wear leaving a lot of play and plenty of room for the oil to leak out. If you try to hone them round they will be way too big when you are done. Just have to beat them out and throw them away. Or you could have your sector hard chrome plated and ground to a larger diameter and have the housing honed to size. BTW, expect to spend around $200 to have this done according to what someone who did it paid.
Click for my steering sector notes
Now for needle bearings....
Using the needle bearings is hit or miss.
The sector MUST be hard enough for the small contact area of the needle bearings. If the sector is too soft they will put tiny dents in the sector that will lead to looseness and bearing breakage.
Some have had good luck with their sector and others have not. It all depends if the company who made the sectors were making them hard enough. Plus there is how much and how hard you drive your car.
Tom Cavallaro
Senior Member
Who sells a honing tool to hone out a sector with bearings. Or do I just take it to a machine shop and have them do everything...removal, replacement, and hone?
Kevin in NJ
Well-known member
You need a machine shop.
This is the type of machine Machine on Ebay that does the job. You also need the correct size mandrel and the tooling to check the hones are inline and parallel to center.
Getting the correct size bushing is also an issue. You will have to have the shop make up custom bushings that fit and they must put proper oil grooves. Though they may know of a bushing that will do the job, I could not find one trying the online sources I found via google.
You also need to measure you sector to be sure it is the correct size and not worn. If it is worn it can be ground down and the bushing sized to fit.
Then you MUST follow the directions in the service bulletins in the proper order to get the steering box adjusted properly.
Yes, this is not a simple process and it will not be cheap. But it will be done right.
This is the type of machine Machine on Ebay that does the job. You also need the correct size mandrel and the tooling to check the hones are inline and parallel to center.
Getting the correct size bushing is also an issue. You will have to have the shop make up custom bushings that fit and they must put proper oil grooves. Though they may know of a bushing that will do the job, I could not find one trying the online sources I found via google.
You also need to measure you sector to be sure it is the correct size and not worn. If it is worn it can be ground down and the bushing sized to fit.
Then you MUST follow the directions in the service bulletins in the proper order to get the steering box adjusted properly.
Yes, this is not a simple process and it will not be cheap. But it will be done right.
Tom Cavallaro
Senior Member
Thanks. I have a machine shop at my local NAPA shop, they have planed my manifolds, can it assume they can handle this job?
George Miller
Well-known member
I agree with Kevin.
Honing will give you a better hole, better finish. Reamer leaves a surface like a thread. But you may not see it if you are not use to checking surfaces.
But with a hone you need to use a line hone not a hand held de gazer type hone.
Honing will give you a better hole, better finish. Reamer leaves a surface like a thread. But you may not see it if you are not use to checking surfaces.
But with a hone you need to use a line hone not a hand held de gazer type hone.
Tom Wesenberg
Well-known member
Never assume anything. My local auto machine shop honed the new piston/connecting rod bushings for a Wisconsin engine, and they were as loose as the worn out one. Even if the shop has the right equipment, not everyone in the shop may know how to use it, or may not know the specs.
TerryNJ
Well-known member
What Tom said! As a former Machinist and Tool Maker, I can vouch for what he said. A good shop will ask you for what's being fitted. A not so good shop will ask what size do you want? When you're messing around with fits you just can't assume that 1.250 or whatever is going to be correct. Give him the part that that's being fitted.
Terry
Terry
Tom Cavallaro
Senior Member
Does anyone re build these sectors? I'm just trying to eliminate the 3 inches of play in the steering.
Purdy Swoft
Well-known member
Why would the sector need rebuilt??? In post 3 you stated that there is nothing to wear on the sector.
QGolden
Well-known member
Have you started with a basic steering box adjustment?
Tom Cavallaro
Senior Member
Not the sector it self...the bushings. If someone rebuilds them. I'll send out the sector and the two tooth shaft so the bushings fit the right way. I thought I was going to knock out bushings and replace and put it back together and eliminate half my play.
Tom Cavallaro
Senior Member
Did all the adjustments...no change. Also did the front end when I had to change the wishbone.
Tom Wesenberg
Well-known member
Can you move the sector shaft up and down in the housing and feel the play?
Can you move the pitman arm back and forth and feel play? If so, the play could be slack in the gears, or the clamping bolt may not be tight enough.
Can you move the pitman arm back and forth and feel play? If so, the play could be slack in the gears, or the clamping bolt may not be tight enough.
Roger V
Well-known member
I think what is confusing is Tom's terminology. What he calls the sector, I think he means sector housing. What he calls the two tooth shaft is of course the sector. So, it looks like he's looking for someone to rebuild the sector housing meaning install and size the bushings in it.
Tom Cavallaro
Senior Member
So eloquently put Rodger. Tom, can't see or feel any movement, that's what has bee so confusing to me ...I know what I should be looking for. I was going back to the sector housing and bushings because that's where it leaks like a sieve.