Banger engine update

Leoneidas

Leoneidas

Junior Member
When I first mentioned that I would be putting a Model B cylinder head on my A block, many asked why? And that was a very good question.

Well, one guy brought up a good point about steam holes needing to be blocked off, which I hadn't done and assumed that this is what has been causing my overheating issues since replacement. I had 98% ruled out the radiator being the issue since I had it cleaned by an old school radiator man.

Just the other day I pulled the trigger on a Snyder's 6:1 head and leakless water pump and installed with the proper head gasket studs and an aluminum 2 blade fan that I had. Torqued the head, timed the engine and ran it for 20min to produce a heat cycle. The next morning I torqued the head nuts again and went for a short drive. The water temp gauge never moved. I used my DVOM when I returned home to check the water temp and it was only at 150F, which is good news but now I have to check the function of the possibly bad new temp gauge.

It's been super cold and icy here in SC the past few days but I will spend the next week confirming that the overheating issue has been fixed.

All of this to say, keep it simple stupid, especially when the common swap produces much better results. Was definitely a learning experience but now I should be able to enjoy my car a little more. Anybody looking for a complete head and water pump replacement for their Model B engine?

I don't seem to be able to upload videos for some reason. Any help with that would be greatly appreciated.
 

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I am also a fan of the Snyders 5.5 and 6.1 heads produced by Tod Buttermore. I can confirm the improvement over the B heads when installed on Model A engines.

The old line about reinventing the wheel comes to mind. Fine work, man!
 
P.S. said:
I am also a fan of the Snyders 5.5 and 6.1 heads produced by Tod Buttermore. I can confirm the improvement over the B heads when installed on Model A engines.

The old line about reinventing the wheel comes to mind. Fine work, man!
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It's quite incredible how quickly it gets up to speed now! I've only had it up to 40mph due to the icy conditions but once it clears up, I'll give it a good test. So far, I'm very impressed and wis I went this route earlier.

Always have to learn the hard way for some reason
 
I have installed Snyders 6.1 on all my cars with great results.

Just remember, you do not need as much spark with a HC head. I usually run about half way down.
 
old31 said:
I have installed Snyders 6.1 on all my cars with great results.

Just remember, you do not need as much spark with a HC head. I usually run about half way down.
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I hadn't thought of that off the bat. I imagine that's to keep the fuel mixture from detonating and causing internal damage?
 
I've got a Snyder's 6:1 head and leakless water pump on my B engine, and I wouldn't go back to whatever was on it from the start. I just put FSI's ACDelco R45XLS on now and just need to re-time it to see if I get rid of the detonation knocks.
 
I would encourage you to do a few more heat cycles to get the head torque settled in at 55 lbs.
Remove the radiator cap and put a dial type meat thermometer into the coolant.
Place a piece of cardboard over the front of the radiator, watch the temperature like a hawk and allow the temperature rise to 180 degrees and adjust the cardboard to hold the temperature there for 5-10 minutes. Lower the cardboard to allow the temperature to drop down to 160ish and then torque the head nuts.
Allow the engine to cool down and repeat the process until the torque remains rock solid at 55 lbs.
You will be surprised at how much the nuts move for the first few heat cycles.
Many head gaskets fail because the head is only torqued once during the installation.
 

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@ronn I just assume that there are. There have to be right? Don't have any off the top of my head that i was thinking of
 
1crosscut said:
I would encourage you to do a few more heat cycles to get the head torque settled in at 55 lbs.
Remove the radiator cap and put a dial type meat thermometer into the coolant.
Place a piece of cardboard over the front of the radiator, watch the temperature like a hawk and allow the temperature rise to 180 degrees and adjust the cardboard to hold the temperature there for 5-10 minutes. Lower the cardboard to allow the temperature to drop down to 160ish and then torque the head nuts.
Allow the engine to cool down and repeat the process until the torque remains rock solid at 55 lbs.
You will be surprised at how much the nuts move for the first few heat cycles.
Many head gaskets fail because the head is only torqued once during the installation.
Click to expand...

That's not a bad idea at all. Definitely better to be safe than sorry. Thank you for the recommendation.
 
Caution with using the two blade aluminium fan with the 'leakless" water pump.


I made this mistake and it came back to haunt me last summer. At least SOME of the two blade aluminium fans have a different internal conical grade than the water pump shaft. I tightened my fan in place on my new pump and went on my merry way...until it started making noise and wobbling slightly... I tightened it again...happy...until it was rattling again...until tightened again. New fan..new pump..careful installation...what could the problem be?


I pulled the fan off and found that the repeated tightening had chewed up the shaft to the point that it had completely disintegrated the shaft 'key'. and developed a considerable wobble which damaged the pump. The fan's internal conical grade was larger than the grade of the shaft.


A new leakless pump and a 6 blade fan later and problem solved. The fan is plastic...but black and does not look plastic...so a low risk of vibration especially as it is attached with a high grade cast aluminium plate also reducing risk of vibration due to imbalance. It also cools MUCH better than the 2 blade fan. I definitely notice far more hot air coming through the side vents on the hood with the new fan.
 
German guy said:
Caution with using the two blade aluminium fan with the 'leakless" water pump.


I made this mistake and it came back to haunt me last summer. At least SOME of the two blade aluminium fans have a different internal conical grade than the water pump shaft. I tightened my fan in place on my new pump and went on my merry way...until it started making noise and wobbling slightly... I tightened it again...happy...until it was rattling again...until tightened again. New fan..new pump..careful installation...what could the problem be?


I pulled the fan off and found that the repeated tightening had chewed up the shaft to the point that it had completely disintegrated the shaft 'key'. and developed a considerable wobble which damaged the pump. The fan's internal conical grade was larger than the grade of the shaft.


A new leakless pump and a 6 blade fan later and problem solved. The fan is plastic...but black and does not look plastic...so a low risk of vibration especially as it is attached with a high grade cast aluminium plate also reducing risk of vibration due to imbalance. It also cools MUCH better than the 2 blade fan. I definitely notice far more hot air coming through the side vents on the hood with the new fan.
Click to expand...


That's interesting because a lot of the Model A touring guys that I know rave about this fan and have never seen the plastic fan in real life. I've only ever heard about people using this fan on the internet. We all have our own real life experiences though so i get it. Thanks for sharing your experience!

I had a later model Ford 4 blade fan but the rivets were becoming loose. I was just planning to remove them and/or weld it up so that way I wouldn't have to worry about it. That's why I have the aluminum 2 blade.
 
Interference between the inside diameter of the aluminum fan is a known issue often caused by the larger diameter of the nose of the modern pump castings. If you bolt an aluminum fan on and don't check it for interference this is what happens. Just grind the excess interfering iron away.
 
Richard Knight said:
Interference between the inside diameter of the aluminum fan is a known issue often caused by the larger diameter of the nose of the modern pump castings. If you bolt an aluminum fan on and don't check it for interference this is what happens. Just grind the excess interfering iron away.
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Oh, ok! Yeah, I'm familiar with that. Thank you

The info provided with the leakless water pump and the aluminum 2 blade fan state that they work together without modification. I checked thee clearance anyways when installing and there were no clearance issues.
 
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