You might want to remove the pan before you turn the engine upside down. There is always some oil left after you drain it, and makes a mess when you roll the engine over.
A few questions on a 8BA
- Thread starter Los_Control
- Start date
You might want to remove the pan before you turn the engine upside down. There is always some oil left after you drain it, and makes a mess when you roll the engine over.
Los_Control
Member
Perfect advice ... expected or not I was not thinking about this ... would be very easy to remove pan while hanging, not make a mess on the floor that needs to be cleaned up.
Me too. Great resources.
Los_Control
Member
So a change of plans, While I still need to disassemble the engine, think I would be wiser to spend some time and see if can get it un-stuck first.
The cyl photo is the worst 2, I think they will clean up.
The last photo is where I think most of problem will be, crusty push rods from mouse pee. But there is only 2 or 3 that look bad. But cleaning up.
New plan is to leave the pan on, acetone/atf, diesel clean and soak everything.
Wash it all down into the pan.
Then actually put a breaker bar on it and see if it will turn. Only attempt to turn it over so far is by hand grabbing the crank pulley.
Starting to think if I get it unstuck, and cleaned up, it would probably run.
Assuming it does not have bad bearings/crank
The cyl photo is the worst 2, I think they will clean up.
The last photo is where I think most of problem will be, crusty push rods from mouse pee. But there is only 2 or 3 that look bad. But cleaning up.
New plan is to leave the pan on, acetone/atf, diesel clean and soak everything.
Wash it all down into the pan.
Then actually put a breaker bar on it and see if it will turn. Only attempt to turn it over so far is by hand grabbing the crank pulley.
Starting to think if I get it unstuck, and cleaned up, it would probably run.
Assuming it does not have bad bearings/crank
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Mart
Well-known member
I wouldn't try and turn it. Not with all the valves and lifters like that.
Pull the cam gear and see if the pistons want to move. Loosen the rod bearings so there is free play and see if you can move the stuck pistons within the free play without having to turn everything else.
If you can pull the crank and pistons/rods, you can then tackle the valves. Just look at one at a time, you should be able to get them apart. Then knock the lifters up from below and pull the cam.
Pull the cam gear and see if the pistons want to move. Loosen the rod bearings so there is free play and see if you can move the stuck pistons within the free play without having to turn everything else.
If you can pull the crank and pistons/rods, you can then tackle the valves. Just look at one at a time, you should be able to get them apart. Then knock the lifters up from below and pull the cam.
I took apart a 53 that had sat for years and years. Oil sludge inside, but nothing else had gotten in there. I never figured out why it was abandoned. I could have made it run, but.....when I got the crank out all the bearing shells had been eaten at by being submerged in the ancient oil.
Los_Control
Member
@mart that is good advice ... was your video I watched earlier when you removed your crusty crank, I think would be better off to get it rotating first if I can. And with a little effort I think it will.
@leon bee I may find same issue. Guy was asking $300 for engine/trans ... it did not sell and moved it out closer to his scrap pile. I offered $100 for it, I expected it to be junk, would need to buy a couple used engines to find something to build.
So I am still trying to prove myself correct, so far is a coin toss which way it goes.
@leon bee I may find same issue. Guy was asking $300 for engine/trans ... it did not sell and moved it out closer to his scrap pile. I offered $100 for it, I expected it to be junk, would need to buy a couple used engines to find something to build.
So I am still trying to prove myself correct, so far is a coin toss which way it goes.
rotorwrench
Well-known member
Stuck valves have been known to break cams and cam followers if enough pressure is applied. I got a truck motor once where a farmer had been dragging the truck with a tractor to break it free. It broke alright but it didn't break free. I had a hell of a time getting that one apart. Busted cam and a follower with a valve stem sticking in it plus all the usual crusty pistons and other bad parts finally came out but not without a fight.
A good penetrant like the double A variety (Acetone and ATF 1:1 mix) will work wonders over time. Pouring on some of the modern rust removal products like Evaporust won't hurt on the real crusty stuff if your set up to soak it.
A good penetrant like the double A variety (Acetone and ATF 1:1 mix) will work wonders over time. Pouring on some of the modern rust removal products like Evaporust won't hurt on the real crusty stuff if your set up to soak it.
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Los_Control
Member
Ol stinky! .... I have a habit of naming things, Wife car is Lady Belle, my old dodge truck is hound dog hauler. I had another truck project awhile back, I sat in it for the first time, it spoke to me and told me it's name was Molly ..... I get carried away naming things.
I have not been able to work on this motor the last week, had to get Lady Belle ready for a trip to New Mexico.
Back at it today, I pulled the bell housing off and all the pressure plate bolts .... I even took apart the pressure plate .... I know they need to be adjusted, they look pretty robust to me ... do we re-use them?
Tapping it with a hammer, it just wont fall off the flywheel ... I see no other bolts to hold it ... thinking I need a bigger hammer and a pry bar. Unless there is a trick I do not know about, the clutch should fall off the fly wheel.
I pulled the water pumps today, they actually feel real good will check into rebuilding them .... more mouse nest behind them.
Going after the cam gear, I drained the oil. turns out it is not real oil ... it is a mixture of something someone put in it in the past to try and free it up ... man does the oil stink ... I just cant help it, the mouse nest smell terrible, then the old bad oil .... I get within 15 feet of this thing and it smells really really bad. I just cant help it, this motors name is Ol'stinky Sad part is, whatever I put it in, the motor is the heart and the vehicle will carry the name of stinky .... sigh!
I have not been able to work on this motor the last week, had to get Lady Belle ready for a trip to New Mexico.
Back at it today, I pulled the bell housing off and all the pressure plate bolts .... I even took apart the pressure plate .... I know they need to be adjusted, they look pretty robust to me ... do we re-use them?
Tapping it with a hammer, it just wont fall off the flywheel ... I see no other bolts to hold it ... thinking I need a bigger hammer and a pry bar. Unless there is a trick I do not know about, the clutch should fall off the fly wheel.
I pulled the water pumps today, they actually feel real good will check into rebuilding them .... more mouse nest behind them.
Going after the cam gear, I drained the oil. turns out it is not real oil ... it is a mixture of something someone put in it in the past to try and free it up ... man does the oil stink ... I just cant help it, the mouse nest smell terrible, then the old bad oil .... I get within 15 feet of this thing and it smells really really bad. I just cant help it, this motors name is Ol'stinky Sad part is, whatever I put it in, the motor is the heart and the vehicle will carry the name of stinky .... sigh!
Los_Control
Member
Maybe add some brut by menon cologne 
Los_Control
Member
I figure I need to get it cleaned up or machine shop wont accept it ...
Same time I wonder, if it stinks, maybe they work on it first to get rid of it?
Same time I wonder, if it stinks, maybe they work on it first to get rid of it?
Los_Control
Member
Well it has been awhile since I have posted. I have ideas what I might use the motor for in the future, but no immediate plans for it now. So have it on a stand soaking with 50/50 atf/acetone. For several months and adding more as needed.
The cam gear is removed. Issue is either rings or bearings.
The cylinders are clean, no ridge, No size stamped on pistons appears to be stock bore. I cleaned them up with some fine sandpaper ... Honestly would not be afraid to run them as is, if it was in a car and getting some other work done.
The oil is running past the rings and draining in the pan eventually.
The valves all look as if the engine was running normal, the last time it was running. While they are not all original with the Ford script logo, we know the engine did get a valve job done in the past.
Here is what I think has happened with this engine in the past.
Pull the pan and the crank is stamped .020.
I think the Farmer over revved it, spun a bearing and had the engine gone through & repaired.
Then he spun a bearing again! .... and parked it. Bet he had a few choice words to say about it too. I think this will be a fine engine with a bit of love.
Not much progress but a update. I hope to get it tore down and to a machine shop for a checkup. Will disassemble it without rotating, hope the offending bearing is easy to get to.
Now I have 2 questions hoping someone can help me with.
1, The pressure plate. I messed up and took it apart. Going to be tricky to compress the springs and put it back together.
The surface needs cleaned but no wear marks, the body & springs have dust on them, it appears to be a new pressure plate when the motor was last worked on.
Is it as simple as just compress the body and install the bolts and torque them down?
Or is there some special voo doo magic needed to assemble a pressure plate?
Need to clean the bench off and wondering if to re-use it or toss it and replace?
2, Having problems understanding how the fuel pump rod works. I want to disassemble for machine shop. Not sure if it is pressed in or is it threaded?
I did put some vice grips on it, did not budge.
This motor did have the mouse nest here, Not sure if it is rusted from mouse pee ... should they just pull out? Are they always difficult? Then the tube is hollow but has no exit point .... is it even needed? Whats it's purpose? Does it run off the cam gear and move up & down to operate the fuel pump?
I know and apologize, stupid questions a correct book could answer ... Just trying to get it to a machine shop & clean bill of health before putting any more money into it.
The cam gear is removed. Issue is either rings or bearings.
The cylinders are clean, no ridge, No size stamped on pistons appears to be stock bore. I cleaned them up with some fine sandpaper ... Honestly would not be afraid to run them as is, if it was in a car and getting some other work done.
The oil is running past the rings and draining in the pan eventually.
The valves all look as if the engine was running normal, the last time it was running. While they are not all original with the Ford script logo, we know the engine did get a valve job done in the past.
Here is what I think has happened with this engine in the past.
Pull the pan and the crank is stamped .020.
I think the Farmer over revved it, spun a bearing and had the engine gone through & repaired.
Then he spun a bearing again! .... and parked it. Bet he had a few choice words to say about it too. I think this will be a fine engine with a bit of love.
Not much progress but a update. I hope to get it tore down and to a machine shop for a checkup. Will disassemble it without rotating, hope the offending bearing is easy to get to.
Now I have 2 questions hoping someone can help me with.
1, The pressure plate. I messed up and took it apart. Going to be tricky to compress the springs and put it back together.
The surface needs cleaned but no wear marks, the body & springs have dust on them, it appears to be a new pressure plate when the motor was last worked on.
Is it as simple as just compress the body and install the bolts and torque them down?
Or is there some special voo doo magic needed to assemble a pressure plate?
Need to clean the bench off and wondering if to re-use it or toss it and replace?
2, Having problems understanding how the fuel pump rod works. I want to disassemble for machine shop. Not sure if it is pressed in or is it threaded?
I did put some vice grips on it, did not budge.
This motor did have the mouse nest here, Not sure if it is rusted from mouse pee ... should they just pull out? Are they always difficult? Then the tube is hollow but has no exit point .... is it even needed? Whats it's purpose? Does it run off the cam gear and move up & down to operate the fuel pump?
I know and apologize, stupid questions a correct book could answer ... Just trying to get it to a machine shop & clean bill of health before putting any more money into it.
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tubman
Well-known member
If you are talking about the fuel pump pushrod itself, you should just be able to remove it with three fingers. From what you say, I think the mice got ya'.
As for the clutch, don't fool with it. It's probably worn out anyway. Tell ya' what; when I put the Merc into my '51 Ford 3 years ago, I replaced the clutch, just because. The clutch I pulled out looked fine. I have it all packed up, ready to send it back to Fort Wayne clutch for the $20 core charge. If you want to send me the core charge plus cover the shipping, I'll print a new label and send it to you.
If you have a bad crank, 3 3/4" 8BA cranks are readily available. I myself have one of several that I had checked at the machine shop stacked in the corner. I used the one that the machinist guaranteed would turn .010/.010, while he said this one might have to go .020/.010. Id be willing to make a you a package deal.
That being said, I see you're in Texas so you should be find a comparable deal locally.
As for the clutch, don't fool with it. It's probably worn out anyway. Tell ya' what; when I put the Merc into my '51 Ford 3 years ago, I replaced the clutch, just because. The clutch I pulled out looked fine. I have it all packed up, ready to send it back to Fort Wayne clutch for the $20 core charge. If you want to send me the core charge plus cover the shipping, I'll print a new label and send it to you.
If you have a bad crank, 3 3/4" 8BA cranks are readily available. I myself have one of several that I had checked at the machine shop stacked in the corner. I used the one that the machinist guaranteed would turn .010/.010, while he said this one might have to go .020/.010. Id be willing to make a you a package deal.
That being said, I see you're in Texas so you should be find a comparable deal locally.
Los_Control
Member
Thanks for the tip @tubman ... I have searched but not found any complaints about removing the push rod tube. I will apply some heat to it and work on it.
The engine came out of a truck, I have the 4spd 1rst gear granny trans with the big 11" clutch.
I would use same trans, and size of clutch. Original, just installed in a different truck.
I figured I would replace the clutch disk which also looks new. Just do not trust the 50 year old material.
Since the pressure plate is mechanical, thinking it could be reused and maybe better then what we buy today? I just need to compress it enough to get the bolts back in it?
I assume a rebuilt pressure plate would include a new or resurfaced surface, new springs.
My surface has no wear marks, just crud that needs cleaned ... I assume the springs are fine.
Do we just bolt them back together, or buy a new pressure plate?
Is there any secrets to putting a pressure plate together?
Thanks for the offer on clutch and crank, I assume your car did not have a dump truck clutch in it, and shipping of a crank from Minnesota it may be easier to find one local.
The engine came out of a truck, I have the 4spd 1rst gear granny trans with the big 11" clutch.
I would use same trans, and size of clutch. Original, just installed in a different truck.
I figured I would replace the clutch disk which also looks new. Just do not trust the 50 year old material.
Since the pressure plate is mechanical, thinking it could be reused and maybe better then what we buy today? I just need to compress it enough to get the bolts back in it?
I assume a rebuilt pressure plate would include a new or resurfaced surface, new springs.
My surface has no wear marks, just crud that needs cleaned ... I assume the springs are fine.
Do we just bolt them back together, or buy a new pressure plate?
Is there any secrets to putting a pressure plate together?
Thanks for the offer on clutch and crank, I assume your car did not have a dump truck clutch in it, and shipping of a crank from Minnesota it may be easier to find one local.
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Los_Control
Member
Thanks @Ol'Ron I agree with you 100% about manuals. Only manual I have for this motor is the 1958 Motors auto repair manual. I bought it for my project truck a 1949 Dodge. I also have 2 other custom manuals written specifically for that truck ... manuals are great.
While the motors manual is good, it lacks a lot of information need at times for my Dodge.
I can assure you there is no section in there to cover disassemble a Ford V8 after it sat with a mouse nest in it for decades. Or a section that tells you how to assemble the pressure plate after you got drunk and pulled it apart. Am sure we all came home on Friday and disassembled the pressure plate on our cars.
I imagine Hot Rodders did to change the springs to go to the strip & race for the weekend.
I love you Ron, Manual will not help me with mouse pee or my own stupid mistakes.
Just asking for a little help to get it apart without destroying it.
While the motors manual is good, it lacks a lot of information need at times for my Dodge.
I can assure you there is no section in there to cover disassemble a Ford V8 after it sat with a mouse nest in it for decades. Or a section that tells you how to assemble the pressure plate after you got drunk and pulled it apart. Am sure we all came home on Friday and disassembled the pressure plate on our cars.
I imagine Hot Rodders did to change the springs to go to the strip & race for the weekend.
I love you Ron, Manual will not help me with mouse pee or my own stupid mistakes.
Just asking for a little help to get it apart without destroying it.