Jack B. Roarke
Junior Member
information on ken davis a/c for Model a ford
a/c in model a ford
- Thread starter Jack B. Roarke
- Start date
Jason in TX
Well-known member
http://www.kendavismodela.com/
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]
To contact Ken Davis:
[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]817-540-1513
modelamaniac@sbcglobal.net
Ken@kendavismodela.com[/FONT]
It works well.
You can install it yourself in your driveway with free rental tools from Autozone.
It doesnt rob the engine of noticable horsepower.
You can remove it if you sell the car or need to go back to stock.
It makes your wife happy to ride with you on trips.
The better you insulate the floor and firewall, the cooler you are.
For just over a grand, it's not worth the hassle in making the brackets yourself and buying all the parts separately.
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]
To contact Ken Davis:
[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]817-540-1513
modelamaniac@sbcglobal.net
Ken@kendavismodela.com[/FONT]
It works well.
You can install it yourself in your driveway with free rental tools from Autozone.
It doesnt rob the engine of noticable horsepower.
You can remove it if you sell the car or need to go back to stock.
It makes your wife happy to ride with you on trips.
The better you insulate the floor and firewall, the cooler you are.
For just over a grand, it's not worth the hassle in making the brackets yourself and buying all the parts separately.
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Jason in TX
Well-known member
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Jason in TX
Well-known member
I does use 2 or 3 horsepower, but it's really not noticeable when it kicks on and off. I guess it is due to the torque of the Model A engine.
I would recommend getting a leakless style pump with one of the sealed front bearings. Or get whatever kind you want, but get one with the front sealed bearing. They can handle more load. Mostly because you need to get that belt tight on the alternator.
I would recommend getting a leakless style pump with one of the sealed front bearings. Or get whatever kind you want, but get one with the front sealed bearing. They can handle more load. Mostly because you need to get that belt tight on the alternator.
azmodela
BANNED
Most of the old systems and compressors used six or more horsepower. The new ones only use one to three horsepower as mentioned. Efficiency in compressor design helps!
Franchise_24
Well-known member
Air conditioning for me is opening up the front window with the other 2 down 
Cummon, do you really need AC in a Model A!!?!?!?!? 
Cummon, do you really need AC in a Model A!!?!?!?!? 
MrTube
Well-known member
I am unaware of modern systems in cars being more efficient. R134A systems produce a far higher head pressure than R12 systems did under the same conditions. This means they use more power and it also means greater stresses on the pump and its seals.
The only improved efficiency I am aware of is the popular use of TXV's combined with variable displacement compressors. However on a very hot day (95-105F) these systems still consume A LOT of power especially when not moving fast.
Jason in TX
Well-known member
Air conditioning for me is opening up the front window with the other 2 down
It was 107 in Conroe Tx this past weekend for the Texas Tour. Guess how hot the wives feet and legs get on top of that riding above the exhaust? Rolling down the windows just makes it a windy oven.
I went to a junk yard here in South Texas once that was full of late 40s and early 50s cars. Of 30 cars that I poked my head in, about 22 of them had add on A/C units that were probably done in the early 60s. They thought cars needed them then as well.
What I'm getting at is YES. Model As are much more pleasant to drive in Texas with A/C.
You northerners put heaters in your cars. They didn't come with heaters. I would say in January when I drive my car I don't need a heater. A jacket is warm enough. Also with your heaters, You have to cut holes in your firewall.
With this A/C system you can add it and then remove it and put the car back to stock without a visible sign of it ever being there.
Jason in TX
Well-known member
Mr Tube? Im aware that your other hobby is old refrigerators and refrigeration units.
Have You driven a Model A with an A/C unit? All I've said is that you don't notice (seat of the pants dyno) the car loosing speed or power when the compressor turns on. Can an accurate engine dyno pick up in power loss? Probably. Does the sweaty driver and passenger notice horsepower reduction or power consumption when the inside of the car goes from 101 degrees to 75 degrees? Not at all.
Have You driven a Model A with an A/C unit? All I've said is that you don't notice (seat of the pants dyno) the car loosing speed or power when the compressor turns on. Can an accurate engine dyno pick up in power loss? Probably. Does the sweaty driver and passenger notice horsepower reduction or power consumption when the inside of the car goes from 101 degrees to 75 degrees? Not at all.
Franchise_24
Well-known member
Nope, no heater for me. I do see your point about 107 degree weather tho. I've had my share of hot days in the Coupe, I've seen upwards of 95 to 97 I think and it does get warm. To me the only cure is driving to get the wind blowing lol.
MrTube
Well-known member
No Sir,
My responses are only in regards to power consumption not whether or not you should have one in an "A".
I'm a person that hates heat so much I learned how to maintain and build my own refrigeration systems so believe me I would never be against installing one in any vehicle or building
Perhaps the system is much smaller than I originally thought. Comparing the compressor size to the alternator it does appear very small.
Just out of curiosity Jason, do you know how many BTUs that system is capable of?
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Jason in TX
Well-known member
Ok. I'm getting you now. You like the science behind it. Hey, I don't work for Ken Davis or anything, but now I'm having to research power consumption and BTU performance of the systems that another person sells.
I'm glad that if I review a restaurant that I like, I don't have to tell the person the amount of calories I ate, the temperature at which the chicken Cordon Bleu was cooked, and the grams of butter used in the recipe. I just say it tasted great! But we are Model A fanatics and that is a different story.
Good thing I like digging on the internet for information, but Ken better cut me a deal on my next A/C unit after all this work!!! (Photoshop, pictures, graphs, data charts. shwew! Tough crowd!)
A/C only (HEAT UNIT ALSO AVAILABLE) evaporator unit designed to mount under the dash board. The evaporator has four round louvers. The controls are located in the center of the unit. The evaporator has a three speed blower motor with a dual fan setup. The evaporator unit has passenger side hose outlets, the fittings for the hoses will be on the passenger side of the unit when it is installed. The evaporator has approximately 290 CFM and 14000 BTU. The evaporator unit is compatible with R-134a and R-12 refrigerants.
The evaporator unit includes:
BELOW IS THE PERFORMANCE OF THE COMPRESSOR: "COP" I BELIEVE MEANS "COMPARISON OF PERFORMANCE" BETWEEN REFRIGERATION CAPACITY AND POWER CONSUMPTION. THE FLATTER THE CURVE, THE MORE EFFICIENT THE COMPRESSOR IS ACROSS RPMS. I REQUESTED THIS MODEL OF COMPRESSOR AND THIS IS WHAT IS IN MY CAR CURRENTLY. BASED ON AVAILABILITY, THERE ARE OTHER MODELS OF COMPRESSOR THAT HAVE ALMOST IDENTICAL PERFORMANCE CURVES. IF YOU LIKE RESEARCHING DATA, LET KEN KNOW WHAT EXACT MODEL NUMBER COMPRESSOR YOU WANT AND HE WILL WORK WITH YOU.
Compressor Specifications
Bore - ø35
Stroke - 28.6 mm
Displacement Per Revolution - 138 cc/rev
Number of Cylinders - 5
Max. Allowable Continuous Speed - 6000 RPM
Max. Downshift Speed - 7000 RPM
Refrigerant - HFC134A
Oil - (SP-20 or Equiv) 175 cc
Rotation (Clutch View) - Clockwise
Clutch Specifications
Rated Voltage - 12V / 24V
Breakaway Torque - 3.5 KG-M
Minimum Engagement Voltage - 7.5v Max / 16v Max
Power Consumption - 42~50W (AL / CU)
Max. Allowable Continuous Speed - 6000 RPM
Max. Downshift Speed - 7000 RPM
I'm glad that if I review a restaurant that I like, I don't have to tell the person the amount of calories I ate, the temperature at which the chicken Cordon Bleu was cooked, and the grams of butter used in the recipe. I just say it tasted great! But we are Model A fanatics and that is a different story.
Good thing I like digging on the internet for information, but Ken better cut me a deal on my next A/C unit after all this work!!! (Photoshop, pictures, graphs, data charts. shwew! Tough crowd!)
A/C only (HEAT UNIT ALSO AVAILABLE) evaporator unit designed to mount under the dash board. The evaporator has four round louvers. The controls are located in the center of the unit. The evaporator has a three speed blower motor with a dual fan setup. The evaporator unit has passenger side hose outlets, the fittings for the hoses will be on the passenger side of the unit when it is installed. The evaporator has approximately 290 CFM and 14000 BTU. The evaporator unit is compatible with R-134a and R-12 refrigerants.
The evaporator unit includes:
- Three speed blower motor
- Adjustable temperature thermostat
- Evaporator unit mounting hardware
- Expansion valve
- Drain tube & cork tape for hose fittings
- Orings
- Two rubber grommets
BELOW IS THE PERFORMANCE OF THE COMPRESSOR: "COP" I BELIEVE MEANS "COMPARISON OF PERFORMANCE" BETWEEN REFRIGERATION CAPACITY AND POWER CONSUMPTION. THE FLATTER THE CURVE, THE MORE EFFICIENT THE COMPRESSOR IS ACROSS RPMS. I REQUESTED THIS MODEL OF COMPRESSOR AND THIS IS WHAT IS IN MY CAR CURRENTLY. BASED ON AVAILABILITY, THERE ARE OTHER MODELS OF COMPRESSOR THAT HAVE ALMOST IDENTICAL PERFORMANCE CURVES. IF YOU LIKE RESEARCHING DATA, LET KEN KNOW WHAT EXACT MODEL NUMBER COMPRESSOR YOU WANT AND HE WILL WORK WITH YOU.
Compressor Specifications
Bore - ø35
Stroke - 28.6 mm
Displacement Per Revolution - 138 cc/rev
Number of Cylinders - 5
Max. Allowable Continuous Speed - 6000 RPM
Max. Downshift Speed - 7000 RPM
Refrigerant - HFC134A
Oil - (SP-20 or Equiv) 175 cc
Rotation (Clutch View) - Clockwise
Clutch Specifications
Rated Voltage - 12V / 24V
Breakaway Torque - 3.5 KG-M
Minimum Engagement Voltage - 7.5v Max / 16v Max
Power Consumption - 42~50W (AL / CU)
Max. Allowable Continuous Speed - 6000 RPM
Max. Downshift Speed - 7000 RPM
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Jason in TX
Well-known member
That's kind of a silly argument.
"They did it then, so that's the way it should always be done now."
What did people in the North or any where else for that matter when it got 20 inches of snow on the ground back in the day with any Model "A", Remove the gas and coolant, put it on jackstands in their garage or barn and not drive it for 5 months??? .. I doubt it!!
Technology today allows us to bolt a device on our cars that will keep us 30-40 degrees cooler when we drive it, and if we want to remove that device, you just un-bolt it.
Cars only had one tail light from the factory. Do you add a second tail light and a 3rd brake light, or just go with the 1 tail light because they did it in 1931 so it must be good enough for now. Seat belts.... they hadn't started putting those in cars in 1930.... That logic could go on and on.
The basic issue here is someone asked how the modern A/C units work in the Model A. I replied "They work well." and then I provided data to show their functionality.
I didn't say, "We should all hot rod our cars and throw away history."
I think I'm going to go out in the garage and fix my original starter switch on the bone stock 6 volt Vicky now. I could upgrade to a starter solenoid but the original Henry Ford way works just fine.
"They did it then, so that's the way it should always be done now."
What did people in the North or any where else for that matter when it got 20 inches of snow on the ground back in the day with any Model "A", Remove the gas and coolant, put it on jackstands in their garage or barn and not drive it for 5 months??? .. I doubt it!!
Technology today allows us to bolt a device on our cars that will keep us 30-40 degrees cooler when we drive it, and if we want to remove that device, you just un-bolt it.
Cars only had one tail light from the factory. Do you add a second tail light and a 3rd brake light, or just go with the 1 tail light because they did it in 1931 so it must be good enough for now. Seat belts.... they hadn't started putting those in cars in 1930.... That logic could go on and on.
The basic issue here is someone asked how the modern A/C units work in the Model A. I replied "They work well." and then I provided data to show their functionality.
I didn't say, "We should all hot rod our cars and throw away history."
I think I'm going to go out in the garage and fix my original starter switch on the bone stock 6 volt Vicky now. I could upgrade to a starter solenoid but the original Henry Ford way works just fine.
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MrTube
Well-known member
Jason,
Sorry for being a pain
Looks like that compressor consumes around 4HP at 2000 rpm and as high as 5.3HP at 3000rpm. Not sure what RPM it spins on the A but I guess its moot.
4-5HP is a small price to pay to be comfortable and as I said I love the install.
In response to Fred's comment, QUESTION, what makes you happy when you drive your model A? If its A\C then by all means put it in!. If its a high compression head, high performance cam and overdrive, put it in!.
If its driving a 100% STOCK model A then that is exactly what you should do. Each person has their own opinions and thats how it should be.
Sorry for being a pain
Looks like that compressor consumes around 4HP at 2000 rpm and as high as 5.3HP at 3000rpm. Not sure what RPM it spins on the A but I guess its moot.
4-5HP is a small price to pay to be comfortable and as I said I love the install.
In response to Fred's comment, QUESTION, what makes you happy when you drive your model A? If its A\C then by all means put it in!. If its a high compression head, high performance cam and overdrive, put it in!.
If its driving a 100% STOCK model A then that is exactly what you should do. Each person has their own opinions and thats how it should be.