59AB engine dies while driving at highway speeds

Might think to put voltmeter on the pos side of the coil... (assuming neg ground). And drive the car this way... Eliminates all kinds of other problems- the idea is that when your engine dies, you would see voltage at the coil still, would be coil failure- (or maybe condenser) If not, resister/ ign switch etc...
Karl
 
Ah, now for a different tack; When i drove my model A from Indiana to Eugene, i had the same problem--though it was electrical because there was gas in the carb whenever i looked. But the problem was gas. why? well, the gas cap's vent hole was painted over and sealed. So when the engine died, by the time i got to carb, there would have been enough time for air to seep into the tank. Now with a fuel pump engine i don't know if this could be a problem or not, but it would be worth a spin around the block without a gas cap or a rag in the filler hole.
 
long time ago, I was having the same problem in a car with points, dist, coil, battery:


I tried it all and Finally I went to electronics store and bought 3 of those itty bitty milliamp bulbs with pigtails that light up and draw almost no amps. I made very long pigtails. I taped all of the bulbs on the dash of the car. I hooked one to the hotwires between at the switch. I hooked one at the coil. I hooked one to the dist. on the low voltage side . all burned red when running. one day, the light at the distributor went black/out just as my engine died; other lights continued to burn. I knew it was in the distributor. when I disassembled the dist, under the point plate I found the wire was broken in two pieces but sometime they touched and sometimes not. I replaced the two-inch wire and it ran dependably.

this was my technique to find the problem.

fordman
 
fordman said:
long time ago, I was having the same problem in a car with points, dist, coil, battery:


I tried it all and Finally I went to electronics store and bought 3 of those itty bitty milliamp bulbs with pigtails that light up and draw almost no amps. I made very long pigtails. I taped all of the bulbs on the dash of the car. I hooked one to the hotwires between at the switch. I hooked one at the coil. I hooked one to the dist. on the low voltage side . all burned red when running. one day, the light at the distributor went black/out just as my engine died; other lights continued to burn. I knew it was in the distributor. when I disassembled the dist, under the point plate I found the wire was broken in two pieces but sometime they touched and sometimes not. I replaced the two-inch wire and it ran dependably.

this was my technique to find the problem.

fordman
Click to expand...

Haha! The forerunner of todays diagnostic systems..... brilliant.
 
Seth keep us posted, I'm haveing a similar problem w/ My 77 F150 and troubleshooting it tommorow. I have an MSD ignition, even more fun. Scott
 
Lee-46 Mercury said:
Ah, now for a different tack; When i drove my model A from Indiana to Eugene, i had the same problem--though it was electrical because there was gas in the carb whenever i looked. But the problem was gas. why? well, the gas cap's vent hole was painted over and sealed. So when the engine died, by the time i got to carb, there would have been enough time for air to seep into the tank. Now with a fuel pump engine i don't know if this could be a problem or not, but it would be worth a spin around the block without a gas cap or a rag in the filler hole.
Click to expand...

Lee I have thought of that and I took the gas cap off and tried driving a about 4-5 miles that way and still experienced the engine dying. Good thinking though.
 
fordman said:
long time ago, I was having the same problem in a car with points, dist, coil, battery:


I tried it all and Finally I went to electronics store and bought 3 of those itty bitty milliamp bulbs with pigtails that light up and draw almost no amps. I made very long pigtails. I taped all of the bulbs on the dash of the car. I hooked one to the hotwires between at the switch. I hooked one at the coil. I hooked one to the dist. on the low voltage side . all burned red when running. one day, the light at the distributor went black/out just as my engine died; other lights continued to burn. I knew it was in the distributor. when I disassembled the dist, under the point plate I found the wire was broken in two pieces but sometime they touched and sometimes not. I replaced the two-inch wire and it ran dependably.

this was my technique to find the problem.

fordman
Click to expand...


That is actually pretty cool fordman, kind of like OBD .5. I like it!!

Lonnie
 
Good morning guys.

This morning (Monday) I called Bubba and spoke with him about my ignition problem. He believes that the coil is getting too hot also. After some discussion we decided that our first step was going to be installing a 1.5 ohm ballast resister ahead of the coil. He told me that he has had another person with these same symptoms call and the ballast resistor solved the problem. Bubba is sending me the resistor today so hopefully I will have some more news by Tuesday or Wednesday of this week.

Bubba is obviously well versed in ignition systems so perhaps he can speak about this here. He can better explain what is happening as this coil is getting too darn hot.

Thanks for you hlep Bubba, it's greatly appreciated!
Seth
 
Seth, I think Bubba is a great information and repair source for any type distributor, be it a stand points or an electronic system. Many folks here and on other similar forums have known this for some time but I have only learned about his fine service about 6-8 months ago. He (or his shop) will get any type of distributor work I ever need to get done now or in the future.
 
Seth Swoboda said:
Good morning guys.

This morning (Monday) I called Bubba and spoke with him about my ignition problem. He believes that the coil is getting too hot also. After some discussion we decided that our first step was going to be installing a 1.5 ohm ballast resister ahead of the coil. He told me that he has had another person with these same symptoms call and the ballast resistor solved the problem. Bubba is sending me the resistor today so hopefully I will have some more news by Tuesday or Wednesday of this week.

Bubba is obviously well versed in ignition systems so perhaps he can speak about this here. He can better explain what is happening as this coil is getting too darn hot.

Thanks for you hlep Bubba, it's greatly appreciated!
Seth
Click to expand...


Ok guys let think about this one for a minute. It appears that the ignition system is getting too hot and causing a shut down.
Shut downs are usually caused by the same culprit !!! HEAT !!!!!
Heat is caused by the flow of current and it appears in this case we seem to have way too much heat. Makes me think we could have a problem with too low of resistance in the primary ignition system..
In Seths issue here there is no condensor to break down as its a electronic system controlled by a control module ( one of mine no less :confused:)
The coil is a oil filled 1.5 ohm primary coil that in the past has been a very reliable product.
So its pretty simple , the battery voltage goes to the positive side of the coil thru the coil and out the negative side to the control module. The control module uses a current limiting circuit and when abused or over supplyed with too much current it just shuts down.
Assuming every thing is on the money the 1.5 ohm coil would allow the circuit to flow 8 amps which may be too high for the controller.
I sent Seth a 1.5 ohm external ballast resitor today which when installed will make the circuit have 3 ohms of resitance and the flow will come down to 4 amps ( a much more control-able level of current) . Hopefully this will fix the problem. Wed we are building crab distributors and a few of the electronic version. I will get some on the lab scope and download some waveforms for further discussions.

Seth will let us know i am sure....:eek:
 
Great discussion Bubba. After we talked this morning I got to thinking about things more. Perhaps this is a simple case of Ohm's law? This is what I am thinking and please correct me if I'm wrong or just plain stupid, lol.

Things I know for sure.
1. I have a 12 volt coil
2. When the truck was running I placed a volt meter on the input side of the coil and I got a reading of 14 volts.

Ohm's law tells us that I=v/r

I = current, v=volts & r=resistance.

Knowing this if I take 14 volts and divide that by 1.5ohms (the resistor that Bubba is sending) then I get 9.333333. 9.33333 is a whole lot better than 14volts that the poor coil was experiencing, correct? Maybe Mr. Ohm was on to something and if I had paid more attention in science class I would have figured this out an easier way.

I also read up a little bit on ignition systems. From what I have read and if I understand correctly ignition systems require more voltage on start up than while the engine is running? I believe earlier on there were even some types of resistors that would allow more volts at start up and then reduce them after. Anyway just some thoughts. Chime in where I'm wrong please so that I can better understand.

Seth
 
I think Bubba has it correct. Let us know how you make out with the resister installed. My father had a 63 ford Galaxie , still pionts style ign. but after 235,000 miles car did the same thing as yours . Turned out to be the coil had give up after all those miles.
 
Knowing this if I take 14 volts and divide that by 1.5ohms (the resistor that Bubba is sending) then I get 9.333333. 9.33333 is a whole lot better than 14volts that the poor coil was experiencing, correct?
Click to expand...

9.3333 is the amperage through 1.5 ohms with 14 volts. With a 1.5 ohm coil plus a 1.5 ohm ballast you will have 3.0 ohms. 3 ohms and 14 volts will result in 4.666 amps.
 
BillM said:
9.3333 is the amperage through 1.5 ohms with 14 volts. With a 1.5 ohm coil plus a 1.5 ohm ballast you will have 3.0 ohms. 3 ohms and 14 volts will result in 4.666 amps.
Click to expand...

Correct and i am betting that the 4.6 amps will run very well.

Good point on the 14 volts. I assume we are running a alternator when we have 14-14.6 volts and 12.5- 13.5 when using a generator .?????
Sound correct to you guys ?
 
BUBBAS IGNITION said:
Correct and i am betting that the 4.6 amps will run very well.

Good point on the 14 volts. I assume we are running a alternator when we have 14-14.6 volts and 12.5- 13.5 when using a generator .?????
Sound correct to you guys ?
Click to expand...

Bubba,

I am actually running the generator that has been converted to 12 volts. Do I need to adjust the generator output?
 
Seth, sound's like Bubba's Ign. got you in the right direction. On my 59AB I'm useing certified Auto elec. Ford one wire alt/brackett for flatheads and it was shipped W/coil and a 1.5ohm resistor.

Another note, Bill Sinclair's Thunder Road Elec guide on pg. 111 has a good schem. if your useing the four terminal starter solenoid.

On my 77 F150 it was a failed magnetic pickup. Our good friend "rusty" showed up again:eek:
 
SETH,when I was a young fellar my grandfather had 39 ton and a half,that did the same thing,he had the points,condenser,and coil changed also had timing checked. This did not cure the problem,so then he had the fuel pump rebuilt,then came a new fuel pump neither solve the problem.Then out of blue he decides to pull the engine and have it rebuilt.Guess what problem was still there.The problem turned out to be the gas tank not venting quick enough,so make sure your gas cap is venting.Hope this helps EPW
 
Had the same problem couple weaks ago older flathead came over said it was condensor or coil condensor everything was new ended up it was the coil Rog.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top