36 Starter to oilpan bracket - Opinions requested

Henryat1140

Henryat1140

Senior Member
I recently rebuilt the starter in my 36. The starter rebuilder did a good job and the starter works fine.

My friend JM - who is very knowlegable about mid 30's v8's suggested I install the small angle bracket which goes between the top starter attaching bolt and the oil pan. Evidently on the old FB there was a lot of discussion about the benefits of this bracket, but I couldn't find anything using a search on the new forum.

I would like to install one because of the stated benefits: more support for the torque of the starter and a better ground all seem like something worth pursuing.

In fact JM lent me a couple of ones he thought might work, but it seems the brackets which are around are for a 39 and later car.

So. . . . .

1. Does anyone know for sure what was the first year this bracket was used? The green bible lists it but only for 39 and later, as does C&G.

2. Does anyone have one they would part with which is correct for a 36?

3. Any sources other than C&G?

I guess what I'm trying to find out is if they really did use this on cars before 39, specifically my 36, and where I could get one.

The Ford basic part number is 11140.

Worst case I could make one.

Regards and thanks for any assistance.

Attached is a picture but it show the installation on a 40 Ford.


Henry
 

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Unless you are going for point judging, put one on for a little insurance. 99% of the judges would never notice it anyhow. It was first used in 39.
 
Ford "running change" notes show that part #82A-11140-A1 was referenced in April of 1938 which was to be used to correct "thump".
 
Flatjack,

That is a very definitive answer to the question, and I thank you for your time and effort in looking it up.

Like Lawson says, I'll probably fabricate one and put it on.

Regards and thanks again for your information.

Henry
 
I make my own out of 3/4" or 1"x 1/8" flat aluminium bar.....easy to bend!
Use a vice to hold about 1", then use a shifter to put a twist in it so the the 2 ends are opposite... bend the sump end at a right angle..... drill hole distances to match........
 
Roo.. so I see you Ausies are afflicted with the same spelling disability as the Kanuks! They can't spell aluminum either.

Just kidding... I hear western Australia is a beautiful place to live?
 
:D Nice one Al ! Let's start off with there being 2 s's i "Aussie" not 1.....The Kanuks are correct...only in the US it's spelt (incorrectly) that way, all other english dictionarys say different...
I'd say the (Kanuks) also know the difference between Tyre...and Tires..
How can something a car drives on be the same as tire (weary)..
You blokes need help....LOL........:D
Enjoyed the banter mate...hope your starter gets sorted......:D
Ken...........
 
Bought one from Mac's about 6 yrs ago still haven't put it on yet. Have been driving my 36 for 26 yrs now never any trouble w/o it?? ken ct. Not even sure where it is now?
 
AJAYS ford parts in New Zealand have a thousand of them, all gen ford ones,I know I had to prize a couple out of the greased pile in the box.They are now fitted to my 33 and 34.
Lawrie
 
flatheadfan said:
Mac's has them. $5.75. I have one on my '35.

Tom
Click to expand...

Just looked in MAC's latest catalog on pg. 110 and they show a starter bracket just like the one I have on my '35 fordor.

Tom, the real shocker is their price has came down to $4.95! We better stock up on this deal ;)
 
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As stated by Henry (my dad) JM very kindly has lent us two of these brackets to see what was up. In the first photo we see one of JM's brackets that looked like it may have been original or at least very old. In the second photo we see the second of JM's brackets that looked like it was newish, and was made by someone.

Since neither of these brackets seemed to line up very closely at all, we put aside the project for a week. During that time a piece was ordered and delivered by Mac's.

The Mac's piece did not line up any better than the first two, but being a new piece I didn't feel the same about making that one work (we didn't really want to destroy one of JM's brackets, seeing as he was so kindly helpful in lending them to us). I screwed up and didn't take any shots of the Mac's bracket before we modified it. It took about 30 minutes fitting it, removing it and applying a little force to it using pliers and a vice, and repeating about five times. To get this one to work it had to be adjusted in two planes or dimensions.

So the end of the story is that we've got a rebuilt starter, and a new bracket. Also, considering how all three brackets were off by about a half-inch, I'm willing to be convinced that our starter may have a little different dimensions than an original one. On that note, when we removed it after returning from Saratoga Springs, we found a sticker on it saying it was a real Ford reconditioned/rebuilt starter.

One last item deals with the oil pan which has a slightly downturned lip. None of the three brackets seemed to be created to avoid the lip. A suggestion was made to grind away a small part of the lip, but all the bending we did ended up shaping the piece to not get in the way of the lip (see top right of last picture).

(Sorry about the photo quality, I used my phone, and it was an awkward place to try to capture.)

-Jeff/Very Tangled/Henry's Son

Follow-up, I went to Mac's online catalog and snipped a photo of their bracket.
 

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Did you try switching ends on the bracket. I do not recall having any trouble with the one on my 35 PU, which by the way has a 39 engine.
 
Roo, Sorry taking so long to get back... If you want to see some really bad spelling, check what the English do with the language! (sorry about the single "s", my bad!)
 
Jeff, something has to be different on your engine or maybe the mounting holes for the starter have been shifted to a slightly different location radially. Perhaps the original starter mounting threads in the oil pan stripped out and someone drilled and tapped new holes for mounting the starter. Did you notice if there was more than two mounting holes where the starter mounts to the oil pan? I believe any of the three brackets you have should have bolted right in place without the need to reconfigure the bracket. I'm not usually a gambling man but I'm willing to bet that someone has previously changed the mounting location of that starter.
 
Hello All,

We really don't know the history of our car. The most previous owner had it since 1996 and when we bought it many attempts were made to quiz him about what had been done or not done to the mechanicals. He only would say the car belonged to one Jack McCabe of the McCabe funeral home family in Pittsburgh. He said the car had been restored in the early 90's, but knew little beyond that. I contacted the funeral home but was told Jack McCabe had died some years ago and no one in the family had any info on the car. I also tried a search at Pennsylvania DMV, but they only had the last two owners so that was no help.

All this by way of explanation we really don't know what might have been changed on the car/engine. The engine has a Ford factory rebuilt tag on the bell housing. It runs really well, does not run hot, in short a very nice engine.

WHY the starter bracket didn't work I can't say - only like Jeff said it was about 1/2" off.

Lawson, we absolutely tried all three brackets every orientation before finally getting the one from mac's to work - but not without bending.

AFAIK, the oil pan, block and starter are genuine OEM Ford parts.

So it's still a mystery.

Regards, and I hope this thread will be of assistance to someone else faced with the same situation.
 
Henry & Jeff,
Attached are pictures that I just took of my '35 221 engine and '46-'48 59 engine showing the mounting of starter to pan rail/oil pan bracket. The same type bracket is used on both engines. Maybe these pictures will help answer the question or possibly muddy the water further :-)

ps.....if you compare my pictures to Jeff's pictures, I think you will see that the starter bolts on mine are shifted more in a CW direction than the starter bolts shown in Jeff's pictures. In other words in Jeff's pictures the starter bolt, where bracket is connected, seems to be even with or slightly above the pan rail and on my pictures the starter bolt where bracket is connected is a little below the pan rail. Thus the theory in my post #17 may be correct. What say you others who view this?????
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I was able to install mine on my 34 by using small flat washers between pan & bracket worked fine.
Gary.
 
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