34 Ford Need Advice

V

vikx

Junior Member
Hello all from Washington State, newbie here.

I need some advice please. We have a 34 steel Ford Tudor with a new flathead, ported and polished, 3 twos. Has a rebuilt ******, newer than 34; maybe 39? It has new wiring, 12 volt conversion, heater, hydraulic brakes, original running gear, relined gas tank, good upholstery. It's what I call a retro rod, redone in the mid 60s. I would say condition is very good. It's a nice car.

My partner is sick and can no longer work on it. I believe it is ready to run except for exhaust, battery and fuel. There is some minor wiring that needs to be done; mainly the engine fan. Wires are all in place.

We have offered it for sale locally but haven't advertised. Reaction has been mixed. My question is: Should we sell now as is, or spend more money to get it running? The work would have to be completed by a shop. I would guess 1000 for the mufflers alone. Needs tires of course. We were SO CLOSE...sigh.

I'm sure you all know we have a fortune in it. It was a true "garage" find in Seattle. We paid 18K for the car before all the work was done, plus the flathead by Dave Tatom in Mt. Vernon.

Any advice is greatly appreciated. Any money will go toward my partner's senior care. Just not sure if it's worth spending more right now. Questions welcome, I'm not positive of all the details but will get you correct answers. Thank you very much. vikx

Here's a link to photos: https://34fordtudor.shutterfly.com/
 
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that is a nice looking car, but any unfinished project will not bring back the money you spent to get that far. if you cant do the work yourself, it is a gamble to spend more and hope to get it back. 34's are desirable enough, but people willing to spend a lot on a project are hard to find. no advise here, just good luck for you
 
Hi, vikx, Welcome to the FordBarn Forums, I hope you get some good help here. Sorry to hear about the hard times. Sorry if I seem a little rough.

You have a very nice and valuable car. But if you got into it at 18k and are into it deeper since, then some of that money is lost, sorry, but my opinion. It will never bring top of the market for 34's because of the diversion from stock so stop looking at those numbers.

If you are looking for dollars quickly, sell it not running, but PLEASE NOT to the first person that comes by. Better would be running, turning, and stopping. And top dollar will be finished, sorted, and rubbed up & beautiful and take longer, and cost more.

On a brighter side, depending on where you are, it might be possible you would have folks help/volunteer to get it in good selling shape so you can get to your real goals. $1000 for exhaust is not reality, it can be done, even to show car standards without that kind of budget hit.

PS. Again, trying to be helpful, was the engine dynoed to 276 HP? You said it's modified and ported and polished, so that is actually possible given a large investment. But there might be confusion, because many of that type of engine are 276 cubic inches. All this because I read on the website about the HP data and you don't want to seem uninformed in your description.
 

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There are butchers that would love to put a red wrench to that car, cut the front end out from under it for a Mustang POS, cut the x member out and put a garbage truck engine in which would destroy a fine car. I realize its yours to sell and I can assure you there is someone out there that will buy it and take proper care of it.
 
I think the biggest bang for your buck would be to get the engine running, which will include mufflers. From your description it sounds like there isn’t much work left. Are there any shops near you that could give you an estimate to get it running? Don’t worry about wiring the fan, just watch the temperature gauge. A trip around the block shouldn’t be a problem but idling for a long time might be. Are the brakes functional or is that another potential money pit? As a previous poster mentioned it is probably 276 cubic inches and not 276 horsepower. Don’t spend money on the tires, as you will probably not get it back. The existing tires look ok in the photos. If you have the paperwork showing what was done and maybe some dyno results from Tatum on the rebuild it should be valuable in establishing the price. How long ago was it rebuilt?

Also post your situation (and advertise) on HAMB, https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/forums/the-hokey-***-message-board.5/

Does your partener have any trustworthy car friends that could look at the situation relative to how much work is left? Not necessarily someone to do the work just someone to help scope the remaining work?

Best of luck,
Charlie Stephens
 
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I'm not sure how big an issue the "not running" factor is. For a true knowledgeable Ford guy, maybe not much. After all, Dave Tatum has a good reputation and is one of the best flathead guys around. An exhaust system can be had from Waldrons for about $350 to $400 bucks and it will fit nicely with no bloody knuckles.
How about you buy the exhaust, work a deal with Dave and put the car in his shop (it would look good next to his yellow roadster). He must know some young guy who will climb under and install the exhaust. Then what, at the most a hot wire from the battery to the coil and fire that sucker up. I'm sure Dave would like to hear it run, and so would you and your friend. Then put a price on it and list it. I think on both Fordbarn and the HAMB.
 
Thank you all so very much! I really appreciate the wise info and am listening closely. Also thanks for the info on the HP/cu inches. I'll change that and get correct info later tonight. Not sure if partner (Vic) has the paperwork from Tatom, but he should. Vic is an ex auto machinist from Calif and did the porting and polishing. There are photos of some of it. It's balanced but I guess all fancy motors are.

The motor was done a few years ago; it's been manually turned over periodically to keep things happy. The car needs all fluids; we were waiting til it was ready to run. Stale gas is a real bummer...

The wiring is very complete. The coil needs to be hooked up (wires w/ring terminals are there) and I don't know which way the fan should blow; out or in? (it's behind the radiator) So does it pull air thru or blow air out to cool?? I did the wiring but am not super familiar with engine components. Certainly don't want to make a mistake!

I agree that it would be a shame for someone to cut this car up and turn it into just another mustang/hot rod. However, that makes it worth less, right? It's been our love for many years and we so enjoyed the originality of it. Even the steering wheel controls work, headlights, etc. The guy we got it from fibbed about the engine being rebuilt (not) and "all new wiring". Well, if you call that thrown in a box, I guess he was right.

Anyway, it has been a labor of love over the years and we did get help from local people, since retired. There is a classic car dealer here in town that will do the exhaust and I will get a price later. The dealer said he will get it running as well. Hmmm. For how much??

Vic is going to call a couple of people to see if we can get some help.

I hesitate to list it for sale until we get some of this ironed out. Price must be realistic but we also don't want to lose by not doing a little work that will give us a better return. Believe me, I've been there/done that over the years. I don't think any of us break even...

Again, thank you all for your help! I'll get back to you with details. Please let me know if I am missing something.

PS: Not sure on the brakes. The cylinders were rebuilt and bled but the master cylinder dribbled when I pushed on the pedal. Maybe bleed again? And all the exhaust is here, just not installed. I don't weld but can handle a wrench; does it need welding?
 
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I thought Tatom moved and was no longer doing work. Is he available and where?? When the motor was built, he was on the river road in Mt. Vernon, Wa. Yes, we would love to hear it purr....
 
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vikx said:
I thought Tatom moved and was no longer doing work. Is he available and where?? When the motor was built, he was on the river road in Mt. Vernon, Wa. Yes, we would love to hear it purr....
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===============================================


A quick search got me this link ( listed below ).
I don't know how current this link is though. good luck.

http://www.davetatom.com/





.
 
vikx said:
.... And all the exhaust is here, just not installed. I don't weld but can handle a wrench; does it need welding?
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Some parts were welded assemblies from the factory and some parts slipped together and were held by clamps, you are going to have to check to see what you have.

Charlie Stephens
 
I'll do some more research on Tatom. Last time I drove by, it didn't look like he was there. Hopefully not too far away. Wouldn't it be great to have him start that flathead??

I'll ask about the mufflers.
 
More Motor info: the block is a 1953. Bored . 125 over with a 4" stroke. Cubic inches may be 272 or 276. I need to find the paperwork from Tatom. The connecting rods were sent to Calif to be equal from wrist pin to crank, center to center. The motor is blueprinted. It has new 283 Chevy valves and the exhaust seats are hardened to run unleaded fuel. Top of block decked to match the heads and has a pressure oil system.

Basically, top of the line. This probably doesn't matter but thought you all would like to know.

Mufflers do need to be welded.
 
I'm sorry to hear of your situation.

I'm not saying to do this, but throwing the idea into the ring to see if anyone thinks it has merit.

There is a hell of an investment in the engine. Lots of people might be interested in the engine, (and be prepared to pay good money for it) but might not necessarily want a 34 sedan.

Would it be a good idea to pull the motor and sell it separately?

If you have the original motor that could go back in and the car could be sold.

Unfortunately, (forgive me for this) you will almost certainly have to take a "hit" on this whole deal.

Ok, that said, lets look at the situation. there is always a "on the other hand.." viewpoint. If you were to take every job that needs doing, and ask for advice I'm sure we could guide you through each one. The fan wiring, for example, is not hard, the fan needs to pull the air through the radiator in the same direction that the air comes through when the car is in motion. The coil wiring is not difficult.

It may be that a "working party" could be organised on a certain day where local friends and barners (or hambers) could drop in and do what they can to get things moved along. It might just cost a few pizzas and refreshments, but I'm sure people will pitch in and help if they can.

There might be someone local that could do the exhaust at cost, even if just a simple system to allow it to be run and driven.

I hope this helps in some way, I wish I was closer and could help more.

Mart.
 
I would suggest that the best course is to get the engine running by the easiest method possible. I would not suggest finishing the car, just get it running. If possible "yard driving" would also be a plus. Things like lights and horn do not need to be working, but brakes and steering would be nice.
The important thing is to have the engine running. Everything else is less important. A valid buyer will overlook the remaining items. Also, when you do decide to advertise, the HAMB on Jalopy Journal will probably be a better place for this car.
 
You don't have to have an exhaust system to get the car started. It will run fine off the exhaust manifolds. You can use temporary wiring to get it running but get it running otherwise everyone will try to beat your price down based on that. If you get it so it can be yard driven even better. Its a good looking car and with the proper price it should sell.
 
You know, I have thought about selling the motor separately.... it is a nice one.

One neighbor works on classic cars and might come over to weld the mufflers. It would be less costly to do that here rather than have it trailered to town and back.

So that is the next step; get it running. The wiring is all in place, I can test the fan and make sure it pulls thru and connect the coil, add fluids and she should be ready to fire up.

Again, appreciate all your help and suggestions. You've helped make the decision. Thank you.

I have no idea how to price this car, that's a big if.
 
I hate being realistic, but most of the time with old cars, when you have to have a shop or someone else do the work, you will not get the money out of it that you put into it.
It is seldom that even someone who does their own work on them can break even when they have to sell it.
That being said, I agree, it would probably sell better if you just get the engine running, the rest of the stuff is minor in the scheme of things. You might come out ahead reading up on how the engine operates and get it running yourself. They aren't complicated.
 
Mart said:
I'm sorry to hear of your situation.

I'm not saying to do this, but throwing the idea into the ring to see if anyone thinks it has merit.

There is a hell of an investment in the engine. Lots of people might be interested in the engine, (and be prepared to pay good money for it) but might not necessarily want a 34 sedan.

Would it be a good idea to pull the motor and sell it separately?

If you have the original motor that could go back in and the car could be sold.

Unfortunately, (forgive me for this) you will almost certainly have to take a "hit" on this whole deal.

Ok, that said, lets look at the situation. there is always a "on the other hand.." viewpoint. If you were to take every job that needs doing, and ask for advice I'm sure we could guide you through each one. The fan wiring, for example, is not hard, the fan needs to pull the air through the radiator in the same direction that the air comes through when the car is in motion. The coil wiring is not difficult.

It may be that a "working party" could be organised on a certain day where local friends and barners (or hambers) could drop in and do what they can to get things moved along. It might just cost a few pizzas and refreshments, but I'm sure people will pitch in and help if they can.

There might be someone local that could do the exhaust at cost, even if just a simple system to allow it to be run and driven.

I hope this helps in some way, I wish I was closer and could help more.

Mart.
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A little twist on Mart's post. Selling the engine separately might be a good idea but leave it in the car until the buyer for the engine hands you the cash. A buyer for the engine would want to see it running and if possible driving. Now you have to get a replacement engine back in or sell the sedan at a reduced amount. Sounds like a lot of work even if the original engine is available and ready to install.

Charlie Stephens
 
That's why I was questioning whether to go further with the car: cost of shop repairs, not cheap.

The mufflers must be on the car because of nasty neighbors. They will report me in a heartbeat for excessive noise.

I "think" the motor is ready to run after a few minor tasks. More research today.
 
Hi again vickx, You are being very helpful with your information, so good-on-you.

Can I make another suggestion that should help? When you have more questions about getting something working, or where something goes, try to keep the conversation going in this thread vs. starting a new thread. It's okay if this one wanders from the original topic because it will all be right here in one place. I say this should help because it makes it easier for those following the "case" to be helpful. This is only a gentle suggestion.

Now a question/request: Try to get a number on what you think the engine has cost you so far? I don't do much pricing/buying/selling, but even I know that there are many thousands invested, and Mart makes a good point in post #13.

Don't let that slow you down from getting it started. Started and running is always better. (Take lots of videos.)
 
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