2nd Gear Whine

D

Dennis D 1929

Member
Looking for some hints as to why my 29 Coupe has a bad 2nd gear whine. First gear is a little noisy and third gear settles right down with very little noise if any at all. 2nd gear is worse when you back off the gas. I'm thinking its just a bad gear in the trans. but I'd like to rule out any other drive line issues. Any buddy ever experience the same problem ? The speedo is stuck at 77000 miles, which seems pretty high for such a car. As the car blows no oil or smoke, I'm assuming its had at least a ring job. If it is a bad trans. could anyone advise me of a good rebuild shop in the Michigan area ? Thanks
 
I have similar sounds with even some noise upon deceleration in 3rd. I think I will pull the ****** come winter and look at everything inside. Hoping the noise is not telegraphing forward from the differential. When I ran it on stands and listed it appears the rear isn't the source. I need to do that with more than just myself to listen so I can rev it and let it back off some. A better set of ears would help.
 
My trans sounded like it was going to chew itself up it was so bad. PO ran it out of oil and who knows for how long, it had been in a carport since 1980 I saved her in late 2016. The teeth were flaking real bad, 2nd was the worst. Pull your floorboard and take the shift tower off. FLashlight down in there and check the condition of the teeth, all of them including the countershaft in the bottom of the case.
 
There is a strong possibility that the two roller bearings inside the cluster gear are failing.


Tom Endy
 
Tom Endy said:
There is a strong possibility that the two roller bearings inside the cluster gear are failing.


Tom Endy
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I agree had rebuilt transmission with all new Mark made gears start making a noise in 2nd gear after about 3000 miles. It got louder as miles went by.

All bearings were replaced so must have gotten some of the known bad needle bearings.

The cage holding bearing together wore out on one end and came apart.

From looks when I took apart one end of cluster gear was flopping around after bearing fell apart.

The gear surfaces on 2nd gear slider and matching cluster were all chewed up which explains the noise.
 
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High mileage transmissions and also those driven too long with low lubrication will have excessive gear teeth wear. When the profile of the tooth is worn down too far, it's teeth no longer meshes properly with the other meshing teeth thereby given a fire siren howl when engaged. The only fix on this worn tooth howl is to install new gears. New gear's teeth can howl too until they have mated by lapping their selves in, which may take a thousand miles or so. Third gear is usually silent in use because when engaged, the engine's power is transferred straight through the main shaft without any meshing gears carrying a meshing power load. It takes a trained eye to identify a gear with worn out teeth as compared to gear with new teeth. A worn out gear tooth would look flat across its tooth face where a new gear will have a slight curve in it's tooth face. It goes with question, any gears with pits across their gear tooth face should also be replaced.
 
New gears arent always the solution. I bought all new Mark gears in a rebuild and could not keep it in 2nd gear. Found a good used gear and that fixed the problem. The Mark gear was sloppy on the mainshaft.
 
denniskliesen said:
New gears arent always the solution. I bought all new Mark gears in a rebuild and could not keep it in 2nd gear. Found a good used gear and that fixed the problem. The Mark gear was sloppy on the mainshaft.
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Very true but I always test fit the gears on shafts first so I knew they were good.

Years ago about 1985 when I did this build I had just tried to build with some Argentina gears or JC Whitney ... NOW these were really bad 0.005 slop shaft smaller ID and gear larger!

At this time the Mark gears were the best you could buy.

Someone recently posted photos of the junk needle bearing and they looked just like the junk I took out that lasted only 3000 miles before they came apart.

The bearings that were still intact had needle bearing "PINS" worn to sharp points with the holes worn oversized and were close to failure.

NO I did not run it without 600W oil!
 
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I bought one complete trans rebuild kit for my '30 phaeton from Mac's. The new 2nd gear slider was so loose fitting on the Mac's new main shaft that I could not use the new main shaft at all. I ended up using Mac's new slider gear installed on Henry's old main shaft and it was a very good fit. I tossed Mac's new main shaft into my old parts bin.. My '30 trans now runs quietly and I am happy with it. (Please don't ask me how I like my new ill fitted radiator).
 
When you say second is noisy, compared to what?

Model A’s make noise in first and second gear.

You might want to change you transmission oil. We have been using 50 percent 600w and 50 percent STP. Has helped with shifting and transmission seeping.

Can’t hurt to try it. You might be happy with outcome. Enjoy.
 
Benson said:
Very true but I always test fit the gears on shafts first so I knew they were good.[/B]
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Uh yeah. I learned the hard way. At the time and the people I asked couldn't tell me the solution to fix, and I figured it out on my own. It all boils down to knowing the second/third slider needs to have little to no play. Both new shaft and new gear would not work, an old gear with a new shaft did. It's whatever it takes.
 
Yeah the noise is a cross between a whine and a rattle, real bad during deceleration. 5X greater than the first gear whine. I'll try the 50/50 mixe solution. Thanks !!
 
Spur (straight) cut gears have a tendency to whine, that's why they invented helical cut gears.
We used to call them musical transmissions, one note in first, a different note in second and not much if any in third.
 
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