1951 Ford F5 beginner help

Chris51FordF5

Chris51FordF5

Junior Member
Hi, I am entirely new to old flathead fords, and this truck is also my first old truck resurrection. I have the honor of being given my great grandfather's 1951 Ford F5 truck. He bought the truck in the 60’s to use on the farm, and it was driven by my uncle till 2004. Great grandpa made it to 102 and I’m hoping this truck can too, with some help.

About the truck: Far as I can tell it’s a 1951 Ford F5 with a 5 star deluxe cab. It has a flathead V8 that “ran just fine” when my uncle parked it in 2004, and a 4 speed synchro silent transmission and a brake booster. Being the deluxe it has a radio, lots of chrome and two toned upholstery (or what's left of it). The truck has been stored outside in ND since it was parked and the side windows were broken at some point, but it seems to only suffer surface rust from what I can tell.

I ideally want to get the truck running, driving and stopping well enough to drive it long distances and haul, just as it could back in the 50’s.

I've been doing research like crazy, got myself a 51 shop manual, and have a pile of parts catalogues from various companies that still make some things for the truck. One big difficulty is that I live in California and will need to go up to North Dakota to get the truck resurrected, my hope is I can go up with parts and tools, go through the truck and replace the fluids, rubber and some parts, (thinking new water pumps etc) I will have access to a shop up in ND too. So I need to do my research and sourcing parts out here in CA without access to the truck till I go up with tools etc.

These are the things I could really use help with:
Replacing the widow makers
I am pretty sure the truck has 5 bolt widow makers on it. So I am looking for a good set of 7 replacements for the truck, preferably with rubber. I have combed the forum and it looks like I need a set tubeless 5 bolt wheels from an old truck or rv. I have seen a couple companies will make custom wheels that fit these trucks or folks remove the centers from widowmakers and weld them to new rims but I really can’t afford these options at all. I see that lock ring wheels will work as well, but if I can find them the one piece wheels seem like the way to go. If anyone has any leads or has some of these I would love to pick them up, I can drive to pick them up, but if anyone knows of any on the western side of the country that would be amazing. This is my biggest worries, I want to have the truck rolling on safe rubber, any help is much appreciated.
Servicing the brake booster
I can’t seem to find any good info on rebuilding these, or parts for them. I see they rely on a large rubber gasket and I’m worried it’s shot. Any other brake help would be great too, I’m learning fast, but have lots to learn.
Finding a two speed rear axle
I would love to drive this truck, I don’t expect or need the thing to go at all fast, but it would be great to get it going 50 or so comfortably for long distances. My truck doesn't have a two speed rear end, but I think one would make life easier. What do you all think/ anyone got any tips or have one lying around?
Any other tips for a beginner regarding this old truck
I am really new to this and am excited to learn as much as possible, I'm sure I am not asking about many things I need to be looking at because I haven’t realized the importance or difficulty in working on the truck fully yet.

Thanks for reading/ listening to my situation and thanks for any help in advance. I'm really looking forward to working on this old truck and getting it going. I have more photos of the truck in a folder on my profile.
 

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Where at in North Dakota? If close to Mandan area, I would possibly be able to give you a hand, my work schedule is tight, though.

If close to Mandan, I know of a wrecking yard or two that will yield some lock ring wheels and a two speed. Don't come now as everything around here is under four feet of snow.i
 
Thanks for the offer! The truck is out in Cando ND at a farm near the Dale and Martha Hawk museum. I won't be able to get out to ND till this summer some time.
 
Chris51FordF5 said:
Thanks for the offer! The truck is out in Cando ND at a farm near the Dale and Martha Hawk museum. I won't be able to get out to ND till this summer some time.
Click to expand...

I've been to the Hawk Museum a few times as my inlaws live in Rugby. Mandan is 3 hours or so from there. A trip to the wrecking yards near me would benefit you.

I'm going to get an 8ba and T98 out of a 52 F6 from one yard. I'm pretty sure it had a two speed.
 
That looks like a pretty solid and straight F5. You may or may not benefit from a two speed axle. Your truck could already have a 5.83 axle, if that is the case, that is the same ratio as high range in the high ratio two speed. The brake booster could be sent out thru Napa or O'Reilly for rebuilding. You really should replace all of the brake lines as they can rust thru from the inside or were they are clamped to the frame. The brake hoses are available thru O'Reilly and probably Napa. I believe the wheel cylinders and master cylinder are available thru Napa or Rock Auto. The brake shoes will probably have to be sent to a shop that relines them.
Mark
 
Hi Everyone. Chris51FordF5 you sure did get a great gift! Congratulations, and Welcome to the FordBarn Forums!
 
That's a fine looking truck. Always good to have another big'un get back on the road. My suggestions:

Plan to replace/clean the entire fuel system: tank, hard/soft lines, carb. The soft lines should be replaced and the condition of the tank and hard lines confirmed as clean and sound. You'll want to install a line filter and rebuild the carb.

Mark is spot on about the brakes.

Your wiring is 65 years old. At the very least, you need to inspect for any frayed areas or sections with compromised insulation. While exciting, electrical fires are really not a goal event.

Don't forget the grease gun and the lube chart from the Shop Manual.

As you replace the points/condensor, be aware that the new condensors are routinely defective. You'll want to keep that in mind when doing any post-tune up trouble shooting. Don't toss any old parts for the first year
 
welcome to the 'Barn.....good luck with the project....so cool to keep a family heirloom in the family and running, too....lol....Mike
 
Thanks everyone for the support and fast responses!
Absolutely going to go through the entire fuel system, from tank to carb, I am currently planning on rebuilding the mechanical fuel pump too. I was going to replace all the belts, and radiator hoses as well as the thermostats and pumps. I was told the sealed bearing pumps are much better than the stock ones... but I could also just rebuild, I just want the max cooling since I plan on using the truck on longer trips. Brakes will be fun too... I need to call NAPA for the cylinders and booster overhaul, if they will do all that it would be a great.
Any way to tell if the axle is 5.83? What do others think about the two speed axel question?
1952henry thanks for the two speed axle tip, Ill keep that in mind as I keep researching.

Thanks again everyone, its a real pleasure being here
 
Start by adding my welcome. Great that you're saving the truck. Sounds like you've done your homework and know much about the truck already. Mark is right on the two speed axle. Either of the available optional ratios will only offer an additional low range, nothing higher. You can see in the below charts that the optional single speeds were 5.14/1, 5.83/1, and 6.67/1. The two speeds were 5.83/8.11/1 and 6.33/8.81/1.

If you now have the 6.67/1 or 5.83/1, and want to look into changing to the 5.14/1, our friend Chuck Mantiglia of Chuck's Trucks in CT I believe has available NOS 5.14 gear sets. Link below to Chuck.

You asked how to know what your present axle ratio is. Hopefully the truck is a late year 1951 build because the late 51/52 style glove box data plates contain the final drive ratio. If your truck was built before September you can block one corner, jack up the other side, chaulk mark the driveshaft and one wheel, then spin the wheel TWO revolutions. Slightly less than six revolutions of the driveshaft is the 5.83, more is the 6.67. If slightly more than five you're home free.

BEFORE doing this let the air out of the outer duals. The widowmakers that are most dangerous are the outer duals. This is because those side rings will blow out away from the truck where all others will blow inward.

Sounds like you already know the benefits of 19.5s and 22.5s. If nobody speaks up having sets I can check with guys who might have them. Owen (1952henry) I bet can help you at minimum find a set of locking side ring 20s there in ND. Ideal donors are any Dodge, IHC, or pre-1948 Fords and Studebakers. Stu

http://www.chuckstrucksllc.com/startframe.htm


 
too bad you are on the west coast, I just hauled home a 51 F5 with 2 speed and a dump bed mounted on it, pto, pumps, tank, cylinders etc that you can get cheap!! I am in SC if anyone is intereseted
 
I texted our friend Josh (Bonus Built Acres), and he has available a set of the 19.5" tubeless wheels. Josh lives in Salt Lake City, and is driving right now so can't drop by to comment. Shipping through Fastenal's 3rd Party Logistics is easy and cheap, as is Greyhound.

The 19.5" wheel uses radial 8R19.5" tires that are 33.5" - 34" tall. That size is a near perfect match to the 18" wheels and 7.00-18" tires original to the F-4 model. Your F-5 probably has 20" wheels and 7.50-20" tires at about 36" - 37" diameter. The biggest oem size was an 8.25"-20" at 38" diameter.

The other tubeless wheel is the 22.5". The narrowest tire today available is the 9R22.5" that equals the 38" of the 8.25"-20". An original set of the 22.5s will be rare and expensive. A set was on eBay a few weeks ago but are no longer listed. Brand factory new (Turkish import) 19.5" and 22.5" wheels are available through Les Schwab and their wholesaler American Wheel Specialist of WA. These work perfectly, naturally cost more, and have a different appearance. They have a much wider and flatter center disc face.

We have many many members who have made the swap to 19.5s on their F-4/5/6s. The shorter tire with take about a 10% toll on top speed we're told.
 
The Ford/Timken axle housings usually have the ratio stamped on them, although it may be hard to read. They will be stamped 7 36 for 5.14 ratio; 6 35 for 5.83 ratio, like the photo; or 6 40 for 6.67 ratio.

This is the drivers side housing. The pipe plug is the drain at the bottom.
Mark
 
Thanks so much everyone for the continued help! Thanks Stu for your postings and recommendations for wheels for me, I have read many of your postings on these wheels and have great respect for your knowledge and experience. That said I am still unsure what route to go... I have heard the lock ring wheels are really fine replacements for the widow makers, they are period correct, closer to the right size and will preserve my ratios and are safe if in good condition, but rubber is hard to get for them new (right?). $600 for a set of 7 with semi decent rubber seems like a pretty decent price for lockrings. Right?

On the other hand the tubeless tires are going to be easier to replace the rubber (right?), but the high end will be a bit less, that may be a problem. (anyone had experiences with this setup exactly?) I also hope to haul some weight with the truck, Im not sure if there is a big difference between the ratings on the two options.

Is there any huge benefit to lockrings over 19.5" tubeless rims? What would you recommend or prefer.

Also I haven't checked ebay much for these wheels not knowing what exactly what to search, do they come up often/ I can, and would be happy to wait for good wheels with good rubber for the right price, or should I jump now.

Stu, do you have Josh's at (Bonus Built Acres) contact info/ possible cost of wheels, and thanks again so much for your help.

Also thanks all for rear axle info/ help, sounds like Ill have to do some of this learning when I back at the farm with the truck.
Wish I could send you all pictures of the truck as I work on it, but I won't be able to till I get out to it this summer!
 
My comments in bold. If I might suggest, also, join us over on FTE. There are more there than here with trucks like yours. Stu

Chris51FordF5 said:
Thanks so much everyone for the continued help! Thanks Stu for your postings and recommendations for wheels for me, I have read many of your postings on these wheels and have great respect for your knowledge and experience. That said I am still unsure what route to go... I have heard the lock ring wheels are really fine replacements for the widow makers, they are period correct, closer to the right size and will preserve my ratios and are safe if in good condition,

All true.

but rubber is hard to get for them new (right?). $600 for a set of 7 with semi decent rubber seems like a pretty decent price for lockrings. Right?

Rubber is easy to find. Les Schwab is on every street corner out west. Or there are online sellers. Coker, Lucas Tire, M.E. Miller, Universal Vintage Tire and others. The $600 for a set of seven isn't bad.

On the other hand the tubeless tires are going to be easier to replace the rubber (right?),

You aren't doing the service yourself so it shouldn't matter. Pay Les Schwab to do it.

but the high end will be a bit less, that may be a problem. (anyone had experiences with this setup exactly?)

This is the material issue. You have to decide where you'll be driving. Either decision you make I'd keep it off I-5.

I also hope to haul some weight with the truck, Im not sure if there is a big difference between the ratings on the two options.

Won't matter. The 19.5s hauled around a loaded Class A motor home just fine.

Is there any huge benefit to lockrings over 19.5" tubeless rims? What would you recommend or prefer.

I offer information. You decide.

Also I haven't checked ebay much for these wheels not knowing what exactly what to search, do they come up often/ I can, and would be happy to wait for good wheels with good rubber for the right price, or should I jump now.

They seldom show up. These are in CA and less likely to have damage than others exposed to weather.

Stu, do you have Josh's at (Bonus Built Acres) contact info/ possible cost of wheels, and thanks again so much for your help.

I texted Josh and he has probably dropped by. You can private message him if he doesn't comment.

Also thanks all for rear axle info/ help, sounds like Ill have to do some of this learning when I back at the farm with the truck.
Wish I could send you all pictures of the truck as I work on it, but I won't be able to till I get out to it this summer!
Click to expand...
 
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A bit more information on the two CL wheels in Fremont. They have been for sale on CL since at least last May. The guy has listed them multiple times over the year. They are an exact Budd part number match to one of mine so I talked to the seller about them. He's not easy to get ahold of, and seems fairly firm on his price. For me to buy and deal with the cost and logistics of shipping would be silly (although I still watch them!). You are close enough to go pick them up if locking side ring 20s is the path you decide to take. Stu
 
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