1950 F3 Wheels

M

msstring

Senior Member
What are you all using for rear wheels on original brake drums. Today I bought a set of 17" later model 8 hole rims only to learn that they are a larger diameter hole pattern by about 1/2". I have the original rims but the are split rims and nobody wants to put tires on them anymore. I thought Ford 8 hole rims were 8 hole rims, I guess not.

Any suggestions? I don't want to break the bank on rims, would like to find something used.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk
 
The most knowledgeable fellow about wheels on this forum is truckdog62563. He has posted on the early bonus built truck wheel replacements before. A search may find some info with the right search string.
 
You’re describing a problem that has been well flushed out over on the FTE forum. The 14” Lockheed rear drums on ‘48 to ‘51 F-3s dictated the use of the 17” stock widow maker wheels. No 16” stock OEM style wheel has been found to clear them. There are, however, solutions that have been found. Two of the solutions are OEM tubeless 17.5” and 19.5” wheels offered on F-250s between 1956 and 1966. These allow use of stock hub caps too. The 17.5s are either of two Budd part numbers, #70720 or #73240, and the 19.5” is #71410. As you might expect these aren’t plentiful. But they show up on eBay pretty regularly.

The third solution is to have your stock widow maker centers remounted into tubeless 17” x 7” modern outer rims. Slightly wider than the stock 5.5” wide widow makers, but when the difference is balanced with a proper offset they work well. These allow use of stock 7.50-17” tires. Several FTE members have had good service in having these built by Stockton Wheel in CA.

There is also a modern 17” Dodge wheel that works. Going from memory here they are 7.5” wide and require use of a spacer on the front axle to my recall. They don’t accept stock hub caps. I can look up the part number if this option interests you.

The other common solution is a replacement D60 rear axle from a 1972 or earlier F-250. This lets you use any 1997HD or early 16” F-250 wheels having the 8 x 6.5” pattern. Stu
 
I also have an interest in truck rims and the part that confuses me here is the 1/2" difference in 8 hole lug pattern. I bet those 17" wheels were quite new, like the super duty years. That is when they left the 8 on 6.5 and for some reason went to 8 on some metric measurement. Kind of a dirty trick for us used tire/wheel scrounger guys!.
 
Wow, I had no idea... I guess I have some things to think about. I like the idea of a different axel with maybe a little lower gear ratio. But what effect would that have on the brakes? Does the drive shaft bolt up or do I have to customize that then... so many questions.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk
 
Agree the 17s were probably 1998 or later metrics. Dodge used the 8 x 6.5” right up to the present, or near present, which is why they are an option.

The rear axle swap has been written up real well too, but I’ve only paid passing attention to it. A Google search would yield a lot on it. The 34” frames were SAE standard on pickups through 1972 and a few more years on cab/chassis one tons. The prime F-250 years as I recall are ‘67 to ‘71 where it’s as near as can be imagined a bolt in swap. The 1972 requires a minor mod of some kind. Whether the others might require a switch to a combo u-joint or different yoke I can’t say. Or maybe a shortened drive shaft too I guess.

Another cheap fix is to find a guy with an F-2 and swap in the whole axle. They have 12” Lockheeds and you’d be done. Or find a late ‘51 or ‘52 F-3 and swap in its complete Timken. They have 12” Bendix brakes. You’d have to then swap in the driveline emergency brake drum on the ****** with hardware too. Stu
 
These two components have always been in question on the forums that cover the Bonus Built trucks. Widow maker wheel problems and the earlier Timken Detroit rear axle's lower than low ratios always have folks looking. Chuck's trucks is about the only supplier for the lower rear axle ratio for them. His are 4.11:1.

This is only one of the many swap threads: https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/278076-f2-f3-f250-f350-rear-axle-swaps.html

Dana 60 & 70 axles and maybe a few others had widths that can work. Driveshafts generally need mod and perches vary but some may work OK as is.
 
Last edited:
I swapped in a Dana 60 with 3.73 ratio from a 1972 F250. Almost a direct bolt in.

The pinion angle is not ideal as is but, I've been running it without vibration. Pinion shims might work but, I'll probably cut off the spring perches and reposition them. One of these days.

I had to shorten the drive shaft. Some people needed a conversion U-joint. I did not. The same U-joints fit. Must be variations in the yoke on the diff.

I had to adapt the brake lines. I used the stock lines and hoses up to the junction block Tee on the axle and adapted to the larger steel lines that went to the brake cylinders.

I am using original 1948 16" F2 wheels. Later model 16" stock Ford wheels I got from a E300 Van also fit.

The Dana 60 had the parking brake linkage. I have a driveline parking brake so I removed the levers that the cables connect to.

It really is an easy swap. The FTE forum has a lot of info including the conversion U-joint IF you need one.
 
Thanks for all the great information guys, I really appreciate it. I happen to find a set of 6.5 to 117 adapters. Not sure if it is a permanent solution but maybe a quick fix to get some newer rubber under it. These have the bonus advantage of spacing the wheel out a bit. But they didn't come with all the nuts so I would need to find them now. I assume that shouldn't be too hard... But not without challenge. The pockets for the nuts are not big enough for the original nut & 13/16" socket. And, some of the threads on the adapter bolts are buggered up. They are too long anyway so I can cut the bad parts off. But I don't know what threads they are. They also have the tapered end and the wheels I have are designed for the newer flat style nuts.
0a66d03e14436997c818ba1d63507627.jpg
4fede864915e06d905d7cc05fbe131bd.jpg
76d447a6457c2965dc88020b97c7ac2d.jpg
2b7cb972304e997e842aca81f5452c7e.jpg


Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk
 
I hoping to do an axle swap with a Dana 60 on my 1950 F3. I'm having a tough time locating one up in Canada. I have found a Dana 60 off a 67 Dodge D200. Any chance I can use that for a swap?
 
Measure the spring pads on your Timken and compare to the spring pads on the Dana 60. Almost a safe bet a different yoke would be in order.
 
Many years ago i owned a company that had several F350 9' flat bed trucks. One of the trucks was the first F350 we purchased, it was a '64 V8 4sp, last year to have solid I beam front axle and the wide 5 lug bolt pattern. The wheels were 16" dual rear axle w/750 x 16 tires. We purchased the truck used so what we bought it what we got. We also had a couple of '64 Ford F250's, V8 4spd with 750 x 16 8 lug wells.
The truck was a very good truck, quite slow, turning a lot or RPM's at 55/60 mph. Over a period of several years we had a lot of engine trouble with the '64 F 350, we were lucky to get 50K out of an engine. The last 292 we put in the truck was a new Ford rebuilt, it grenaded with less than 30k on it.
We re-powered the truck with a low mileage 76 360 which was the same power plants our other F350's had. I had purchased the other F350's new so I knew that the gear ratio was 4.10 with 750 x 16 tires, 8 lug Firestone split rims.
We checked the gear ratio on the '64, assuming it would be 4.56, a standard gear ratio for F250/350'S during the early/mid '60's. To our surprise the '64 had 5.13 gears, no wonder we could not keep engines together in the truck.
I found a later model Ford F350 dual wheel rear end that was 4.10. We swapped out the old rear end for the 4.10, purchased 8 lug 16" spit rims and ran the truck for five more years, the next owner ran it for another ten years.
I don't recall how we handled the front end, I would guess that we swapped in a '64 F250 axle which would have been a bolt in application.
As time went bye I sold the '64 5.13 rear end to a man that had a Ford F350 off road welding truck, the 5.13 ratio worked very well for him.
Foot Note! In 1980/81 we switched all of our trucks from tube type split rims to tubeless radial tires, ending tube failure and constant flat tires.
 
Last edited:
blucar said:
Many years ago i owned a company that had several F350 9' flat bed trucks. One of the trucks was the first F350 we purchased, it was a '64 V8 4sp, last year to have solid I beam front axle and the wide 5 lug bolt pattern. The wheels were 16" dual rear axle w/750 x 16 tires. We purchased the truck used so what we bought it what we got. We also had a couple of '64 Ford F250's, V8 4spd with 750 x 16 8 lug wells.
The truck was a very good truck, quite slow, turning a lot or RPM's at 55/60 mph. Over a period of several years we had a lot of engine trouble with the '64 F 350, we were lucky to get 50K out of an engine. The last 292 we put in the truck was a new Ford rebuilt, it grenaded with less than 30k on it.
We re-powered the truck with a low mileage 76 360 which was the same power plants our other F350's had. I had purchased the other F350's new so I knew that the gear ratio was 4.10 with 750 x 16 tires, 8 lug Firestone split rims.
We checked the gear ratio on the '64, assuming it would be 4.56, a standard gear ratio for F250/350'S during the early/mid '60's. To our surprise the '64 had 5.13 gears, no wonder we could not keep engines together in the truck.
I found a later model Ford F350 dual wheel rear end that was 4.10. We swapped out the old rear end for the 4.10, purchased 8 lug 16" spit rims and ran the truck for five more years, the next owner ran it for another ten years.
I don't recall how we handled the front end, I would guess that we swapped in a '64 F250 axle which would have been a bolt in application.
As time went bye I sold the '64 5.13 rear end to a man that had a Ford F350 off road welding truck, the 5.13 ratio worked very well for him.
Foot Note! In 1980/81 we switched all of our trucks from tube type split rims to tubeless radial tires, ending tube failure and constant flat tires.
Click to expand...
Interesting, I need to find out what ratio I have. Would be great to have another gear but would also like to keep it stock. I wonder if anyone on can say what a safe max RPM is for stock 8BA? It seems to run comfortably at 65 MPH. But, not sure how long I want to push it at that.

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk
 
I think if you have any kind of "truckish" gears, then cruising at 65 would be close to an explosion ! Just my opinion of coarse, but many of the low geared trucks are stressed at 55 mph
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top