Unrestored, early 29's, splash apron bolt placement...

Steve Plucker

Steve Plucker

BANNED
If any of you have an unrestored, early 1929 Model A, just how was the hex head bolt placed which attached the rear of the running board splash apron to the top of the frame?

Hex head bolt coming UP from the bottom so nut, flat washer, and lockwasher are on top...OR

Hex head bolt going DOWN from the top so nut, flat washer, and lockwasher are on to bottom?

Thanks.

Pluck
 
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Is this that special carriage bolt with the large fairly flat head?
If so, then I've only seen them with the head on top.
 
Tom Wesenberg said:
Is this that special carriage bolt with the large fairly flat head?
If so, then I've only seen them with the head on top.
Click to expand...

NO...It is the bolt, same as the other bolts that attach the front fender to the splash apron.

You will have to crawll under the car to see the placement.

Thanks Tom.

Pluck
 
It is the bolt that attches the rear of the running board splash aprons to the top of the frame. It is a hex head bolt and hex head nut. Two on each side.

Sorry, I should have clarified myself.

Pluck
 
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Steve,
I always thought the bolts were large headed carriage bolts with a low crown. That is what model A parts places sell. I never heard of a hex headed bolt being used to bolt the splash apron to the frame. Please enlighten use if this is not correct.
Rusty Nelson
 
Steve, Again my 29 Fordor date 12-28-28 and fairly unmolested has a small hex head bolt coming from the bottom up on both sides. Philip
 
Pluck,

You have a study on your website "The A-20606: 1/4”-20 x 9/16 “Special Head” Carriage Bolt" where you go over the other carriage bolts used in the assembly of the splash shields. Although the subject of your study wasn't about the rear splash apron bolt for the frame you did mention it in your chart on page 5, the last column.

It looks like from your data that there was a hex bolt in this area until sometime in '29 when it changed to a carriage bolt. Of course there's not enough data on that subject to be conclusive, but at least maybe a hint of what happened in production.

Here's a link to the study on your website - http://www.plucks329s.org/pdf/studies/RearFenderCarriageBolt.pdf

Is this the bolt you are asking about? Maybe the hex bolt only exists on the '28 A's?

-DAN
 
I've somewhat confused about this thread, as it seems Steve previously answered his own question. Be that as it may, doesn't a large flat-headed bolt usually attach to the sheet metal side of a part to provide better support without grinding into the metal?
 
Dan Partain said:
Pluck,

You have a study on your website "The A-20606: 1/4”-20 x 9/16 “Special Head” Carriage Bolt" where you go over the other carriage bolts used in the assembly of the splash shields. Although the subject of your study wasn't about the rear splash apron bolt for the frame you did mention it in your chart on page 5, the last column. Yes...I was not sure of the placement of the hex head bolt but see that it came up from the bottom with the nut, lockwasher and flatwasher on top of the Running Board Splash Apron. That is the question I have asked to see what others have.

It looks like from your data that there was a hex bolt in this area until sometime in '29 when it changed to a carriage bolt. Yes it did. Of course there's not enough data on that subject to be conclusive, but at least maybe a hint of what happened in production.

Here's a link to the study on your website - http://www.plucks329s.org/pdf/studies/RearFenderCarriageBolt.pdf

Is this the bolt you are asking about? No, it is the hex head bolt which was changed in mid 1929 to the Special Head Carriage Bolt. Maybe the hex bolt only exists on the '28 A's? It went into Mid 1929.

Pluck

-DAN
Click to expand...

See above...
 
ericr said:
I've somewhat confused about this thread, as it seems Steve previously answered his own question. Not really...I needed to know about the placement of the hex head bolt in order to secure the Running Board Splash Apron to the frame. Be that as it may, doesn't a large flat-headed bolt usually attach to the sheet metal side of a part to provide better support without grinding into the metal? There was a flat washer on top of the Running Board Splash Apron followed by a lock washer and nut. This was replaced with the Special Bolt sometime in Mid 1929.[/QUOTE]

Pluck
Click to expand...
 
My 2-23-29 Tudor is too buried to see, but I just looked at my 9-27-28 Phaeton, and it has the hex bolt with the hex nut on the top side of the splash apron.

I also noticed the air gap at the rear of the apron to the body is 1/2" while the front is zero air gap. The cowl sets on a thin (maybe 1/8") piece of reinforced rubber, and the body right behind the cowl might be able to slip in a piece of paper, but that's about it.
 
Steve on my truck the head was hex but not normal size. The head on mine was 5/16" but it was a 1/4"X20 bolt that went throu the fender then the splash apron and then the frame with a lock washer the nut. Hope thing are going well.
 
Tom Wesenberg said:
My 2-23-29 Tudor is too buried to see, but I just looked at my 9-27-28 Phaeton, and it has the hex bolt with the hex nut on the top side of the splash apron. As it should be.

I also noticed the air gap at the rear of the apron to the body is 1/2" while the front is zero air gap. The cowl sets on a thin (maybe 1/8") piece of reinforced rubber, and the body right behind the cowl might be able to slip in a piece of paper, but that's about it.
Click to expand...

Thanks Tom...I think if you were ever able to view the Tudor, it will be the same way as the Phaeton.

Pluck
 
Steve Plucker said:
If any of you have an unrestored, early 1929 Model A, just how was the hex head bolt placed which attached the rear of the running board splash apron to the top of the frame?

Hex head bolt coming UP from the bottom so nut, flat washer, and lockwasher are on top...OR

Hex head bolt going DOWN from the top so nut, flat washer, and lockwasher are on to bottom?

Thanks.

Pluck
Click to expand...

Upon further reflection, you might have the higher ground on this question.
If the head of the bolt is underneath the frame, maybe it makes the apron easier to replace. From past experience, if the head is on top of the apron, you have to elevate the body slightly to remove the apron, otherwise there is not enough space to get the bolt out.
 
ericr said:
Upon further reflection, you might have the higher ground on this question.
If the head of the bolt is underneath the frame, maybe it makes the apron easier to replace. From past experience, if the head is on top of the apron, you have to elevate the body slightly to remove the apron, otherwise there is not enough space to get the bolt out.
Click to expand...

You are very observant and I believe you are exactly right on that observation.

Pluck

 
I'm not sure you don't have to elevate the body to remove a splash apron. I might be possible, but I highly doubt it. I had to elevate the body when I discovered a minor flaw in the paint after I installed the splash apron on my 28 coupe. The body blocks (several) rest on the top part of the splash apron. If the body isn't raised a little, there is no way the splash apron can be remove. Don't ask how I know. It would be even harder to reinstall it. So my point is: I don't think the direction of the bolt make any difference, since the body needs to be raised to remove and reinstall the aprons.
Rusty Nelson
 
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wrndln said:
I'm not sure you don't have to elevate the body to remove a splash apron. I might be possible, but I highly doubt it. I had to elevate the body when I discovered a minor flaw in the paint after I installed the splash apron on my 28 coupe. The body blocks (several) rest on the top part of the splash apron. If the body isn't raised a little, there is no way the splash apron can be remove. Don't ask how I know. It would be even hard to reinstall them. So my point is: I don't think the direction of the bolt make any difference, since the body needs to be raised to remove and reinstall the aprons.
Rusty Nelson
Click to expand...

Rusty I think you are correct, a nut on the top might minimize the amount one needs to raise the body but you would still have to loosen the bolt block bolts.
 
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