What constitutes a good Touring Motor?

J

Jim Kroeger

Member
Since my Model A engine block is cracked beyond repair, I am fashioning a new block and want to build a touring motor. I intend to put in a balanced and weighed crank, oversize valves, high compression head, a touring cam and a v8 clutch. I am having a hard time deciding whether to pressurize the oil system or go with babbit or inserts. Does anyone have some recommendations? Thanks. Jim
 
I've never had a pressurized system, so I only know 1/2 the story. However, Jim Brierley told me unless I was planning over 4000 RPM, the stock system was good enough. If he doesnt know, nobody knows, IMHO.
Good Luck with your new motor.:)
 
Looks like you have everything covered!:cool: I've heard that "babbit is forgiving" more then once. So when it is my turn to build a touring motor
I'll go babbit. Also, the block I'll be using is a "B" diamond and already factory "pressurized", if that is what you want to call it.:rolleyes: No mods there except for the oil pump to be opened up some for a larger flow.
If I was using a stock "A" block to build up on. I would again go babbit
and have just the center main set-up with a an extra oil line, plus open up the oil pump.:) Jus' what I would/will {hopefully} do........good luck!;)
 
1930 coupe said:
Something to think about before you machine out the block for inserts and oversize valves.
25 years from now when the next owner of your car takes the engine to be rebuilt, he will be told by the rebuilder, sorry your engine cannot be rebuilt because the inserts and oversize valves are no longer available, you will need to find another block that has not been modified. Your block will have to go in the scrap pile. If you stick with babbitt and standard valves future owners can keep it running for another 100 years or until fuel is no longer available.
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Please allow me to play 'Devil's Advocate' with you. If someone is worried about availability of inserts, I tell them to spend an extra $85 for a spare set and place them on the shelf in the event there is a "next time". Also understand that we have the ability to have babbitt re-poured into existing insert shells and re-machined. We even have the ability to weld metal into main webs and caps and (re)line-bore a block that will accept Babbitt. We can repair what has been previously modified. The same mindset can be applied to installing O/S stainless seats in a block to go back to 1.500" valves, --OR making 4 new O/S valves.

I totally understand your point and I also realize you are deeply involved in engine rebuilding too however I say all of this to explain it this way, so often hobbyists pass on (mis)information that makes a project seem hopeless for the future. The truth is there are many orphan cars out there being restored where there just is not any replacement parts available. Therefore someone must think the entire process through and fabricate whatever it takes to get the job done. That same mindset should apply to an 'A' engine too. It is my opinion there will always be a way to restore the engine "if" there is a will to do so.
 
I have never understood the need for a touring motor.

Read your history and you will find that the factory motors were run 55 to 60 MPH and got 50,0000 to 80,000 miles on the original babbitt.

So what more do you need?

Now granted stuff like counter weighted cranks certainly have their advantages. The real problem with the engine is in the lack of attention to details. Getting anyone to grind the crank accurately is not an easy task. Does not matter how well you have the crank counter balanced if the mains are not ground in line and with the correct radius relief.

For reliability, well the original motor was known to be be pretty trouble free. The major issues of the day were non standard fuels, poor quality oils, crappy batteries, and crappy tires. Most of those can be corrected today if you just buy the right stuff. Fuel is about the only thing you can not mess up.
 
Hi Jim,

A word only on the idea of oil pressurization. I believe that a motor producing up to 85 horsepower and not exceeding 3600 rpm will do just fine with a splash system. A few years ago we had one of our crankshafts break right along the oil drilling, just like tearing a check off on the dotted line. Since that time, I have recommended that cranks not be drilled unless being put to use in a high-performance upfit engine. My own engine is very much like the one you describe, minus the oversize valves. Runs like a clock... Happy Holidays and Happy Motoring!

Chris
 
I agree that oversized valves and intakes are not needed. My stock engine will run as fast as I want to go, but I don't like to run an engine at it's limit, so if I wanted to drive 55 or 60 for long periods I'd install an overdrive or higher speed rear end.

Counterweights are such a benefit to the life of the babbit, so I'd go with them. A 5.5 head should increase efficiency, so I'd go for that also.
 
Many have their opinions. I have no problems with an old worn out 50 year old engine. But, when re-done it'll probably be; babbitt, counter weighted, fully balanced, V8 clutch, lighter flywheel [maybe 20-30# lighter], the lesser Stipe camshaft and HC head.
 
I agree with what Tom says....a 5.5 or other HC head and an OD will serve you very well for touring on today's roads. On interstates and freeways I like to travel at 60 mph, and my 1930 TS will do that all day with the Mitchell OD. Even with re-built engines, most of our local club members will not venture out on the freeway without an OD. The fact is that most Model A owners I know just do not want to push their stock A's that fast for any length of time, regardless of the fact they could originally do that.
 
As a rookie owner that just got a '31 pick-up, what is involved with having an A engine converted to insert type rod & main bearings?
 
BRENT in 10-uh-C said:
Please allow me to play 'Devil's Advocate' with you. If someone is worried about availability of inserts, I tell them to spend an extra $85 for a spare set and place them on the shelf in the event there is a "next time". Also understand that we have the ability to have babbitt re-poured into existing insert shells and re-machined. We even have the ability to weld metal into main webs and caps and (re)line-bore a block that will accept Babbitt. We can repair what has been previously modified. The same mindset can be applied to installing O/S stainless seats in a block to go back to 1.500" valves, --OR making 4 new O/S valves.

I totally understand your point and I also realize you are deeply involved in engine rebuilding too however I say all of this to explain it this way, so often hobbyists pass on (mis)information that makes a project seem hopeless for the future. The truth is there are many orphan cars out there being restored where there just is not any replacement parts available. Therefore someone must think the entire process through and fabricate whatever it takes to get the job done. That same mindset should apply to an 'A' engine too. It is my opinion there will always be a way to restore the engine "if" there is a will to do so.
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Right on all counts especially the misinformation part.
Additionally we have the capability nowdays for the average rebuilder to go and mine the ore, smelt it into cast iron and build a new block all in his back yard. That may sound like a bold statement but there is info on the internet on how the average back yard mechanic can do it. All you have to have is the desire.

To answer your original question, no, you do not need full pressure oiling in a street/touring engine. You can up the horsepower to 60 or 70 with the stock oiling and use either babbitt or inserts.

By the way, NO block is damaged to the point it can't be restored unless it has been vaporized by a nuclear reaction. Modern welding techniques are amazing. Keep the old block if you have room to store it.
 
I am with most the guys here for touring engine in not going full pressure
I would add a Filtering system as it can only add to the life of a engine
I would also dynamic balance everything and consider a harmonic balancer and counter weight crank
I try to make as much power as possible in the low to mid rpm range with cam valves and head
as I believe you want to up hills at 2000 rpm in top gear and not 3000 rpm in 2nd
 
Future Stock said:
As a rookie owner that just got a '31 pick-up, what is involved with having an A engine converted to insert type rod & main bearings?
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Future Stock, first welcome to the Ford Barn. If you don't the info you need in this post, start an original or a great way is to do a search. You'll get tons of pointers from searches, good luck. Since I'm no mechanic, unfortunately, I'll let those that are give you pointers.
 
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