How important is the front oil slinger?

K

K9

Junior Member
Hi, Folks;
Building my first Flathead, a '51 8BA. I'm sure this has been discussed before, but I tried searching the forum and got nowhere.

I admit it, I screwed up. Crank is installed, timing gear installed, I'm running the one-piece "modern" front seal as opposed to the rope. I got the smooth (not spiral grooved) sleeve for the seal lip to run on. It was not a tight fit on the crank nose, actually, it would turn easily by hand. So I got some bearing retainer stuff made by Loctite and got it on there really good and tight. When I was done I was horrified to discover that I didn't install the sheet metal oil slinger on first.
:rolleyes:
Now it will be damned near impossible to remove the sleeve to install the slinger without making a mess or damaging the sleeve or crank nose.
Just how important is that oil slinger? This is the first engine type that I've rebuilt that had anything like that, so I was wondering if anyone leaves the slinger off when running the modern seal (he pleads, hoping upon hope).

Thanks.
 
It is a pain in the rear job and you may need an oil pan gasket replacement, but you can pull the timing gear cover and drop the pan, remove the front pulley to access the front seal. At this stage, however, maybe you want to run it and see what happens. You never know, you might have to do all the same work to swap the oil pump if it doesn't work well. So, running it first, you can make that determination and kill two birds if necessary or none at all.

If the engine is still on the stand, I think I would go ahead and get the slinger installed now.
 
Firstly. I have no experience with this particular issue.
A slinger is just that, It slings the oil that is thrown against it, away from the area that it might otherwise leak from.
In the case of the front slinger, a lot of oil will be forced toward the slinger by the pump action of the crank and cam gear coming into mesh behind the slinger. In this case it happens near the top of the seal.
It is easier to back up now, than when you have the engine installed, and you will feel happier in yourself,after, if you put it right.

To breakdown Loctite, you apply heat (carefully)

In life we learn the fastest when we make mistakes. The lesson you might take from this, is to lay out the parts in the order of assembly before hand. Maybe even write a list so you can cross items off as you go. I bet you will never make this one again.
I have been a mechanic for 35 years, however I am yet to put my first flathead v8 together. They should be a simple engine, but the more I learn about them, the more traps there seems to be.
Good luck with what ever you decide.
 
If you warm the parts up to about 250 to 300 degrees, the Loctite will release and you can remove the sleeve with padded oven gloves.
Be sure to clean the old Loctite off before reassembling.
 
The slinger is a MUST, the front oil seal will piss oil like Niagara falls. How do I know this??
 
Don't know if will help but I made a puller to pull the sleeve. The back of it is a half circle that fits behind the crank timing gear. Used 2 3/8" all threads, one on each side of the half circle. Run them through a 3/8" plate across the front of the crank. Pulls those sleeves easily with no damage.
 
Ol' Ron is spot-on (as usual). Without the slinger to "protect" the inside of the oil seal, oil will bombard the seal & you'll be amazed at how much will come past the seal lip. As Ron said, "like Niagara Falls". One of those mistakes you'll never repeat, as you'll never forget the mess.
 
Isn't the way to loosen Loctite to use more Loctite? What others have said about the green stuff used on lifters is to put on another few drops to loosen if you need to adjust.
 
36tbird said:
Isn't the way to loosen Loctite to use more Loctite? What others have said about the green stuff used on lifters is to put on another few drops to loosen if you need to adjust.
Click to expand...

Not in this case. The bearing retainer stuff is way under the sleeve and the fit on the crank is close. I can't imagine enough would seep into that crack before hardening itself, making it worse.
I'm going to try the heat method today.

I don't have oven mitts in the shop, but I have welding gloves and slip-joint pliers!
I'm going to start with an industrial-strength electric heat gun first. Don't want to risk the acetylene flame tip making a grove in a nicely polished sleeve.
 
Cut and past from loctite web page.


Q: How can I remove a fastener that is "permanently" locked in?
A: The application of heat is needed to remove a fastener that can't be removed with a hand tool. Temperatures of 325F and above is needed to break down a standard anaerobic, 500F for high temperature Anaerobics. A heat gun or propane torch is commonly used to do this process, and careful dis assembly should occur while parts are still hot. Once apart, and cooled, use methylene chloride (Chisel #79040) to remove cured excess material. Always wipe down the fasteners with clean up solvent to remove the wax film that Chisel leaves on the surface.


R
 
OK. Sleeve is off!

Heat gun wouldn't do it. Had to resort to the torch. Reading the package for the bearing retainer afterwards it said, "Heat parts to 500*F, then use pullers or presses to remove the piece." This is some serious stuff!
When my sleeve reached critical temperature the thin screwdriver I'd placed behind it suddenly moved and the sleeve was free.

Now that I have the slinger in place, it's hard to believe it is so effective. It's completely shadowed by the crank gear, only about 3/16" away, and it travels with the crank and I doubt it is completely against the oil pan or timing cover since there is no wear showing on either. But I'm putting it back on your recommendation to prevent Niagara Falls! :)

use methylene chloride (Chisel #79040) to remove cured excess material

Sounds like Methyl Ethyl Badshit to me!! :D Wonder where you get that stuff, that doesn't require making a contribution to the EPA Super Fund?
 
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