greasing Skip's pumps

[fomocoloco]

Should Skip's pumps be greased at installatlon? Do they come pregreased?

 

[Old Henry]

Should Skip's pumps be greased at installatlon? Do they come pregreased?

I don't have his pumps but remember others saying that he sends them with fairly detailed instructions about installing them by putting grease on the gaskets, no where else. What were his instructions?

I know that the high volume pumps I got from another supplier are ball bearings and permanantly lubricated and do not use the oil circuit the stock pumps used and need no lubrication ever. That's all I know.

 

[JM 35 Sedan]

All of the pump sets that Skip has built for me have come back to me pre lubed.

Something to keep in mind when lubing the early '32-'36 type pumps...do not use a high pressure grease gun and overfill these pumps. It is very possible to crack the internal wall of the casting plus it will allow excessive amounts of grease into the coolant that can clog the radiator tubes.

 

[4dFord/SC]

I believe his instructions call for some water pump lube in the radiator and maybe a little grease on the gaskets.

 

[Bob G/Spanaway]

I just got a pair back from him.
They were oiled and had a piece of tape over the oil hole to keep it in during shipping.

 

[G.M.]

As Bob stated the 37 to 48 pumps are oiled by Skip and tapped to prevent leaking. These pumps are gravity feed by engine oil. The 32 to 36 head mounted pumps are lubricated by a grease fitting. You don't pump the grease in like king pins. They are greased by Skip before shipping and are good for at least a year under normal driving conditions. Only a few short cranks on the grease gun once a year is all they need. They need grease with a low drop or melt point. NOT USE HIGH TEMPERATURE GREASE. The grease melts in the sump and saturates the oil lite bushings as a heavy oil. The shaft runs on a thin film of oil between the shaft and bushings about a half of a thousanths thick. The shaft never comes in contact with the bushings, the oil film separates them. High temperature grease would never melt at engine temperatures so there would be no lubrication for the shaft. If high temperature grease is forced in through the seal it never melts in the coolant and clogs and coats internal parts. A large percentage of these pumps were force greased and the pressure cracks the front of the housing. The left picture shows the normal cracking.The one right one shows a full blowout, I don't know if the right one got water in and froze or was force greased. When cracked the 2 bushings put the shaft in a slight bind. When the bushings are reamed the reamer aligns the bushings but when removed the spring effect comes back. Skip welds the 25% that are cracked and after the bushings are reamed the bushing stay aligned. These pumps are simple but you have to understand how they work. G.M.

 

[Tom Walker]

Just been out for an evening spin, and I smelt burning rubber and she started to boil (on a very cool evening). I suspect I havnt oiled the pumps properly. One of the pump pulleys now has a bit of play if I pull on it against the belt. My only hope is that the belt is too loose, which is causing it to slip.

 

[G.M.]

The rubber smell was probly the belt either to loose or a pump is tight. Loosen the belt and make sure the pulley turns free. The pulley on old pumps 32 to 48 should pull out toward the radiator about 1/8" or maybe more and spring back toward the engine. This is the spring on the seal pushing against the seat. As the RPMs of the engine increase centrifical force moves the pulley out from the pump tightening the pressure of the seal against the seat. Dirt and rust can collect in the spring not allowing the spring to compress as it tries to move forward so now there not a good contact of the seal and seat and the pump leaks. It's good to move the pulleys forward and let them snap back in a few times a year to free the spring up so it can do it's job. Use a low melt point grease and only a few shots on the 32 to 36 pumps. G.M.

 

[Tom Walker]

Thanks, I will try some grease. What is the fitting? There is a very small screw-on cap, which you can barely turn with fingers, and then a nipple I dont recognise. Why does nt it have a standard grease fitting? Was that to stop the owner from over-greasing it every time he went round the chassis with his grease gun?

GM, if I have any sideways play in the pulley (and I dont mean the end float), is that time for a re-build? or can I live with some wear?

 

[G.M.]

There was nothing to prevent from over greasing and the results are a large percentage are cracked similar to the picture I posted. My pictured one may have been cracked by someone over tightening the tappered threaded grease fitting. The ones cracking from grease pressure are out on the corner. Sideways play is either the shaft or bushings worn or never reamed to the proper size. The bushings need to be reamed .001 to .0015 larger than the shaft. As stated the shaft never touches the bushings, it runs on that film of oil. If your cars belt was pulled up like a banjo string the oil was squeezed over towards the generator and the shaft ran against the bushing. The strange thing is when a pump is rebuilt with a kit and there is drag when turning the shaft indicating a tight shaft it don't wear the bushings and get clearance, the hard shaft wears and gauls. Actualy after reaming and you put a dry shaft in the bushings you can feel feel a slight side play like you have. Wipe some oil on the shaft and put it in a properly reamed set of bushings and it feels like a bearing and has no side play. Attached is a picture of a pump that had the belt to tight for years You can see the wear throgh the bushing and even wearing the casting. This pump didn't leak like most people would think but was changed because of the noise of the back of the pulley hitting the front of the pump houseing. The seal won't leak because the spring, seal and seat act like a "U" joint. I have been working on Geneology and this is break time, I need to get away from that sometimes. Couldn't find pump picture will edit and add later. G.M.

 

[Tom Walker]

Sorry GM, I didnt explain that the car has been in a museum for 50 years and I wonder if it wasnt lubricated. I forgot to do it before I ran the car. What is that small threaded grease fitting, and can I replace it with a zerk?

 

[G.M.]

The grease has to melt and turn to oil and saturate the bushings. These pumps aren't lubricated like king pins. What I would do in your case is put some 140 gear oil in and after it warms up good see if the sideward motion disapears or gets less. The grease fittings are small pipe threads I believe. You can replace it with a zerk. G.M.