Body Restoration Question

B

BashawT

Senior Member
Just wondering how everyone has restored his/her "A" Body

Media blast, Paint Strip, Sanding/Grinding? Outside and inside of body?

Also was this done before or after the patch panels were done ( Steel floor, Wheel wells, etc. )

Planning this for a winter project!

Thanks for all responses!
 
I like to media blast the complete car first, inside and out, plus an undercoat. Not too much pressure and using garnet abrasive. This way you see what you have, 'warts and all'. Then replace panels etc after that.
 
BashawT said:
Just wondering how everyone has restored his/her "A" Body

Media blast, Paint Strip, Sanding/Grinding? Outside and inside of body?

Also was this done before or after the patch panels were done ( Steel floor, Wheel wells, etc. )

Planning this for a winter project!

Thanks for all responses!
Click to expand...

What ever you do...DON'T DIP IT or you will be sorry!

Pluck
 
What you do is dependent on the body condition and the tools you can use.

You need to get all rusty areas blasted. Done properly with low pressure (40 psi or so) and not too much media in the airstream (adjust the media control till you start to see media in the stream). All pits you are not going to cut away must have the little dark spot in the middle removed. That little dark spot is a source of oxygen even after the paint goes on and NO none of the products that say they stop rust will stop this rust. They only hide the rust.

I would not grind the body. In the past I read that shops that need to make time have found using a Norton 80 grit hook and loop paper to sand paint off of good metal was the most effective way to strip over blasting and chemical removers. See http://www.autobodystore.com/

Electrolytic rust removal also removes paint and can be done for small and large parts. You could make a bottom of body sized 'pan' with plastic and some wood and fill it with solution and remove all the bottom rust in a day or two. Can be very effective and cheap.

Once it is bare metal you must immediately protect it. I have been using something called PickleX 20. It is not rinsed off and does a very good job of protecting metal for a long time. Otherwise you want to put epoxy primer down to protect and seal the metal. Epoxy must be sprayed and given some time (days) above 60 degrees or it will not cure properly.

You may hear some tell you that you have to put bondo direct to metal. That is not correct. You must read the technical sheets for all the products you lay down and be sure follow what they tell you to do. All the modern 2 part paints adhere to roughness on the paint surface.

This is just a few ideas you can try.
 
Depends how much room you have. Some people only have enough floor space for a car and a bench or patch of ground enough for one panel to strip the paint and weld on. One piece at a time and clean the frame and paint it while that one panel is off. Paint and rust can be stripped off with sanding disks on an angle grinder, for the most part but if there are little brown spots of rust left behind in the rust pitting, as someone else already mentioned they will start to rust under the paint eventually. The good news is that eventually could be 20+ years away if the paint is good and the car looked after well.
 
I also have had favorable results from the 'dipping' process, but have had no close facility to take advantage of the 'E-coating'.

Wood framed bodies can be dipped if you remove the wood first of course. The dipping company that I use puts the parts in an oven first to cook off the bondo and wood and other unwanted 'things'. The dipping has had no adverse affect on the panels shapes, and reduces the metal to entirely useable panels, ready for repairs.

I have found it to be superior to any of the blasting processes, as there is no possibility of warpage as there is no pressure applied. I ask to be on the premises when my items are taken from the tank, and I take my diluted Phosphoric acid 'spray' with me when I pick up the panels and spray them as soon as they have been removed and rinsed from the dipping solution.

None of the blasting proceedures that I have tried have been able to remove all the bondo and none of the chemical reactions that have occured BETWEEN the panels as a result of age. Blasting is only able to effect the areas in the 'line of sight/fire' of the airstream, and I have always discovers a 'surprise' when cutting into a blasted panel at or near a joint of any kind.

When I first utilized the dipping process, it became quite clear right away that I was not as good as I thought I was at acquiring 'good' sheet metal. It will tell you exactly where you stand when you start your repairs.

When I reviewed the results versus the price, I use the dipping process whenever possible, but the company that I use is about an hour and a half away from me.
 
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RockHillWill said:
I also have had favorable results from the 'dipping' process, but have had no close facility to take advantage of the 'E-coating'.

Wood framed bodies can be dipped if you remove the wood first of course. The dipping company that I use puts the parts in an oven first to cook off the bondo and wood and other unwanted 'things'. The dipping has had no adverse affect on the panels shapes, and reduces the metal to entirely useable panels, ready for repairs.

I have found it to be superior to any of the blasting processes, as there is no possibility of warpage as there is no pressure applied. I ask to be on the premises when my items are taken from the tank, and I take my diluted Phosphoric acid 'spray' with me when I pick up the panels and spray them as soon as they have been removed and rinsed from the dipping solution.

None of the blasting proceedures that I have tried have been able to remove all the bondo and none of the chemical reactions that have occured BETWEEN the panels as a result of age. Blasting is only able to effect the areas in the 'line of sight/fire' of the airstream, and I have always discovers a 'surprise' when cutting into a blasted panel at or near a joint of any kind.

When I first utilized the dipping process, it became quite clear right away that I was not as good as I thought I was at acquiring 'good' sheet metal. It will tell you exactly where you stand when you start your repairs.

When I reviewed the results versus the price, I use the dipping process whenever possible, but the company that I use is about an hour and a half away from me.
Click to expand...

Will, are you also using the company in Traveler's Rest? If so, they have an option of an Ospho Coat that is pretty nice. It is put on as a 5th stage (1:Heat, 2:Pressure Wash, 3:Phosphoric Dip, 4:Bake).
 
Yes, Brent

They have been very good for me to work with. The most recent use was for the Panel Delivery. I took them all the panels for it when I got them dissasembled, but it showed so much porosity that I ended up making some items from scratch.

I ended up having to hand build the lower side panels of the cargo area, the drop floor box and trunk door, the side panels for the drop floor and both of the rear doors, and the bottom half of the front doors. I took the new panels back and had them dip them as well because I was trying a 'different' type of paint work and wanted the base metal to have the same treatment as the older metal pieces.

As you know, I learned the 'phospho dip' proceedure from you, and I just wanted EVERYTHING to have the same base preparation, including the 'black' items like the frnders, running boards, etc. The thing that I like best about the phosphp treatment is that I can weld and metal work the sheetmetal and re-spray and it will continue to preserve the bare metal for an extended time. I am very proud of the fact that all the 'black' body items were painted with the use of NO BONDO, but it sure took me a long time to hand work out the items, and the phospho spray allowed me to intermittantly work on these items without rust buildup. Thanks for the tip.

This company also has a place in North Carolina. Would that be closer to you? I don't know exactly where it is located.
 
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RockHillWill said:
Yes, Brent

This company also has a place in North Carolina. Would that be closer to you? I don't know exactly where it is located.
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Actually, I have used both of their locations. Sadly I have a car in here from Texas that a few weeks ago I was wanting to take to them yet the T/R location said they were not accepting any new work at this time, --and the one in Winston Salem said 90-120 days before they could take it due to their current backlog. I have seriously thought about setting up a seperate business to dip just automotive sheetmetal as the transportation really drives the price up for me.
 
329s said:
What ever you do...DON'T DIP IT or you will be sorry!

Pluck
Click to expand...

I have a theory related to this: The method you use to remove the old paint should be no more aggressive than the method you will be using to apply the new paint.

For example: If you sand or wire-brush the old paint, you would be sufficient to apply new paint with a brush. If you sandblast the old paint, you need to spray the new paint. But if you use a dip to remove the old paint, you had better dip the car in new paint!

Doug
 
Logan said:
Why? We dipped my bosses A400. Brought it right to the shop and primed it inside and out before it had a chance to rust any.
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Why????????????????...Had a bad experience with 28-29 wheels once BUT that was with wheels with a curved outer and inner rim (with air space) which collected the acid and which was not all removed when the process was completed...didn't know this at the time and a few years later the acid that was still in the hollows of the rims finnally came out between my newly painted wheels and assembled tires.

HOWEVER...by reading Will's and Brent's posting about the process, just might have changed my mind but still leary of the process.

Pluck
 
I like the electrolysis method. I don't care for blasting on large sheet surfaces,
which is an abrator(SP) which work hardens the material. It also changes it's shape.
 
329s said:
Why????????????????...Had a bad experience with 28-29 wheels once

HOWEVER...by reading Will's and Brent's posting about the process, just might have changed my mind but still leary of the process.

Pluck
Click to expand...

It is easy to get a bad taste when you encounter a bad experience but I think the real issue was the craftsman doing the job, and not the process itself.
 
On my coupe, I stripped the body with paint remover, and then had it sandblasted to better clean the door jambs and other areas with too much detail to strip by hand
 
Many years ago, early 70's, a friend had a coupe sandblasted by a "professional" sandblaster that he knew from the local car shows. Long story, short, the body and fenders were nearly ruined with warped panels and holes burned into the metal. To make matters worse the sandblasting was done outside and it rained before the blasted body could be returned to the owner. The pro was more used to blasting steel bridge girders than automotive sheet metal. The blaster used way to much air pressure and coarse sand to speed up the process. Lesson learned. Know YOUR blaster and his background experience. Hopefully, any pro blaster doing auto sheet metal now a days would be more informed and responsible.

As a hobbiest, I have sandblasted several Model A's and other 30's-40's cars and tractors during ground up rebuilds and have never had a problem. I use only enough pressure to remove the paint and rust, fine grit sand, and keep the nozzel moving. Sure it takes longer to clean a part than the pros but you never get any work hardened metal or warpage.
 
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