Trouble removing distributor from an FE....

SoCalCoupe

SoCalCoupe

Well-known member
Dealing with a 1962 406 CID engine. How do I remove the distributor? I disconnected the wires, removed the cap and hold-down. I pull up and out several inches, the drive gear clears and several inches of the oil pump drive shaft clears but there's something on the bottom of the oil pump drive shaft I can't see that's hanging pulling the whole assembly out.

Looking at other sources, seems like the oil pump shaft shouldn't have come out because there should a collar at the top that holds it in the engine. Possibly the oil pump drive shaft was installed upside down with the collar at the bottom, not the top? Here's a link AI found for me that supports my up-side-down theory. Unfortunately, it doesn't describe a way out. I'll read it a few more times though.

When I try to reinstall the distributor and oil pump drive assembly, it won't fully seat. It sticks up about an inch. The drive gear seems to be engaging correctly but the probably the oil pump drive shaft isn't?

Don't know where to go from here. I'd totally like to avoid removing the oil pan.

Help.

Oh by the way, I'm all but certain the centrifugal advance is the issue with my idle. I can manually turn the rotor CW and CCW and there's no resistance or spring-back in either direction.
 
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I'm going to make a guess here. The oil pump shaft may be stuck in the the distributor and the collar has moved downward because the distributor has been pulled up dislodging it but still on the oil pump shaft. With the collar moved down, the distributor will not go down all the way as the collar is preventing it.


If you can turn the distributor shaft with it pulled up as far as it will go, just maybe this is the problem.


As I said ,this is a guess.


SoCalCoupe said:
Dealing with a 1962 406 CID engine. How do I remove the distributor? I disconnected the wires, removed the cap and hold-down. I pull up and out several inches, the drive gear clears and several inches of the oil pump drive shaft clears but there's something on the bottom of the oil pump drive shaft I can't see that's hanging pulling the whole assembly out.

Looking at other sources, seems like the oil pump shaft shouldn't have come out because there should a collar at the top that holds it in the engine. Possibly the oil pump drive shaft was installed upside down with the collar at the bottom, not the top?

When I try to reinstall the distributor and oil pump drive assembly, it won't fully seat. It sticks up about an inch. The drive gear seems to be engaging correctly but the probably the oil pump drive shaft isn't?

Don't know where to go from here. I'd totally like to avoid removing the oil pan.

Help.

Oh by the way, I'm all but certain the centrifugal advance is the issue with my idle. I can manually turn the rotor CW and CCW and there's no resistance or spring-back in either direction.
Click to expand...
 
paul2748 said:
I'm going to make a guess here. The oil pump shaft may be stuck in the the distributor and the collar has moved downward because the distributor has been pulled up dislodging it but still on the oil pump shaft. With the collar moved down, the distributor will not go down all the way as the collar is preventing it.


If you can turn the distributor shaft with it pulled up as far as it will go, just maybe this is the problem.


As I said ,this is a guess.
Click to expand...


Thanks for the reply. Yes, I'm certain that the oil pump shaft is stuck in the distributor. I don't think the collar has been moved downward because I felt no resistance as I was pulling the distributor out. As to why the distributor won't go down all the way, don't know.


Yes the distributor shaft can be turned with no resistance at all with the shaft pulled up as far as it will go.


Here's a link AI found for me that supports my up-side-down theory. Unfortunately, it doesn't describe a way out. I'll read it a few more times though.
 
When pulling the distributer up.. does the rubber O ring become visible?(O ring around the base of your distributer)
meaning... is the O ring snagging on the intake?
If that clears. yes the oil pump shaft is sticking.... has happened to me but my builds were fresh.... Not sure how long your 406 has been together.
On my 428.. same thing happened and I gently rocked it too and fro... Not a lot. but it became disengaged eventually...
I can only say be very gentle... you "Can" try to use a soft blow copper head hammer and "tap" the distributer slightly... not sure if you have tried that.
Yes. this is very frustrating.
 
The reason that the distributor is not going down all the way may be because the shaft is not lined up with the pump This usually happens when the shaft is still in the pump but it is a problem lining up the distributor to the shaft. I (most) always have this problem when replacing the distributor in my Y Blocks.
 
paul2748 said:
The reason that the distributor is not going down all the way may be because the shaft is not lined up with the pump This usually happens when the shaft is still in the pump but it is a problem lining up the distributor to the shaft. I (most) always have this problem when replacing the distributor in my Y Blocks.
Click to expand...


I think you're exactly right. I got the distributor, with the pump shaft attached, to go all the way in today in the original position it came out. No force, no pressure, just a little wiggling things around. i'm very confident that the shaft is in the oil pump now and that the collar didn't fall off but I'll have an eagle eye on the oil pressure next time I crank the engine.


Meanwhile, the reason for doing this was to check the advance weights and springs. Found that the primary spring was on the secondary weight and vice versa. Also found that the primary spring wasn't actually a primary spring at all but was light-weight secondary spring that was too long to be a primary. Bottom line is that one advance weight was flopping around with no spring tension; not good for timing stability or the advance curve. Hard to find distributor springs for a 1962 Ford dual-point, centrifugal-advance-only distributor. After hours of searching, finally bought a set on evilBay for $38.
 
Brad, you sure are having a time with this one!! And....getting quite an education not possible with your flathead!!!:)
 
Sometimes the O ring on the dissy body will stick in the block, offering some resistance to extraction. I experienced this recently when I pulled mine and I prayed the oil shaft was not the cause!
 
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I get a charge on some of the names for ebay. evil bay is a good one (which I've heard more than once), but it had the hard to find item that you were looking for. I know it's kind of joke, but you can't say it didn't help you.. I don't know if the cost is high for those springs, but it saved the day.
 
paul2748 said:
I get a charge on some of the names for ebay. evil bay is a good one (which I've heard more than once), but it had the hard to find item that you were looking for. I know it's kind of joke, but you can't say it didn't help you.. I don't know if the cost is high for those springs, but it saved the day.
Click to expand...


You're certainly right. Of course I did not invent "evil Bay," I proudly appropriated it.


It did help. When I think about it, why couldn't I find a set of distributor weight springs for a 1962 Ford in stock locally or a catalog? It's a VERY TINY universe. I look at those little things and the materials and manufacturing costs are pennies. Of course the scarcity and intellectual property make up the difference.


I saw a joke recently. A particular airplane model had been involved in multiple accidents. An engineer was hired to solve the problem. He recommended one rivet to fix it. The bill was $1,000,000. The aircraft manufacturer was bent out of shape and asked for an itemized bill. They received it and it said, "Rivet, $1, knowing where to put the rivet, $999,999."


Hope those expensive distributor springs work, but if they don't they're about 5 orders of magnitude less expensive than that aircraft rivet. I can afford it.
 
The springs are not generally reproduced for many types of distributors, so finding the (correct) spring for your application can be a difficult and expensive task. I once checked out having the spring made for the 49-53 Ford flathead distributors. I found a spring manufacturer who could do it. I still had some NOS samples to send them. I didn’t have the engineering print on the spring so I was hesitant to gamble. They did shoot me a price and I made the determination that the quantity required and the unit cost was prohibitive for the volume of the springs I might hope to sell over the many years it would take to recoup my investment.
 
The 406 was made to fit NASCAR limitations in 63. Distributors were for a performance application and may be similar to Mercury 410 and the 1964 427 which came after cid limitations were extended.
Ford distributors have been noted to corrode in place if storage is too long and higher humidity is present. I've had a few that had me pulling hair out. It's a lot of work to save parts like that.
 
Got the eBay springs installed, gapped the points, started the engine, full oil pressure, set the timing at about 11 deg before TDC. Runs MUCH better. Much smoother idle, took a lot of turns out of idle mixture and idle speed screws to raise vacuum (about 8 in Hg at best.) Test drive was 80% better. No racing at idle or coming off cruise. Still a slight but not as bad tendency to stall at idle. The distributor curve with the screwed up springs was definitely c4@9. May have been covering up something else I still have to discover but the car is much better.
 
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