A coachbuild French Ford Delivery.

[HHR&R]

I've been lurking this forum for years, been active on the HAMB for a very long time.
First time I have something worthy of this forum.
That's my second model A, the first one is an early '28 hot rod RPU that I started building a year ago, then earlier this year I came accross this Ford model AF delivery and I just couldn't pass, it was cheap, unmolested, 99.9% complete and very special. It's a 2.2L car.

The badge says in French : Ford imported from the United States of America.

It's missing it's headlight, spare wheel, head and water pump.
It has a build date of 8/3/29 stamped on the gas tank.

It has a clam shell tail gate, I'm not sure if the steel wheels are original or not, I think it's a swap that happened when the tire size became hard to come by probably during the war.
It also sports 1952 and up Citroën Traction Avant tail lights on some I'm guessing non original fabricated rear fenders.

Same goes with those fancy rear bumpers, but since it's a coachbuild car, I can't be 100% sure.


Here's the kicker : it's a 3 door. It does have 2 doors on the passenger side

Full leather interior, marquetry garnish moldings and dash rail, a flower vase holder missing it's vase. It's a pretty luxurious delivery vehicle.

A folding rear bench seat

Yes the tail gate is upholstered in leather too.
The headliner is a cloth material with some fancy design on it.


There's this neat Michelin hubcap for the missing spare wheel

The body is wood with the sheet metal nailed on it
Even the A pilars are wood

With a nice aluminum molding going around the cowl

And finally the 2.2L engine

I bought this car without seeing it, I had only 2 pictures, which is something I never did prior, it was a gamble and I believe I made good on it, it's rust free.


The story goes : the 80 Y.O. man I got it from bought it in the early 70's to restore it and was dried stored ever since, he obviously didn't restore it, he got the headlights and head stolen in the late 70's. The car has a 1954 license plate on it.


From what I gathered from an other source, it was a coachbuilder from the Orléans region who build between 50 and 80 of those, I have seen only one picture of another one but it had a single swinging door in the back and was sporting the same colors : black fenders, running boards and grille, tan paint on the bottom half and brown on the upper part of the body.


What am going to do with it : I'm not sure. I do have a 3.3L laying around though and a set of good sedan rear fenders. But to put the 3.3 in I'm not sure the transmission is the same and the rear gear and pinion are deffinitively different, plus I'd like more gears and juice brakes, so we'll see.
It's not like my hands aren't already full either with everyting I'm doing, maybe I just hold on to it for decades like the previous owner



Cheers!

 

[johnbuckley]

We are aware of a similar one that surfaced in the UK see this thread ...https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=290047

 

[HHR&R]

Thanks for the link, but mine is much more different, those from the brochures are either 2 or 4 doors, mine is 3. I recon that the one from Paris-Tracteur is very very similar : lengthened body, the flat integrated sun visor and bodyline match 100%, so maybe it's a 3 door version that's not advertised on their brochure. Maybe special order?
I'll have to look for a plaque somewhere, for now I didn't see any.

 

[Model "A" Fords]

Thanks for the link, but mine is much more different, those from the brochures are either 2 or 4 doors, mine is 3. I recon that the one from Paris-Tracteur is very very similar : lengthened body, the flat integrated sun visor and bodyline match 100%, so maybe it's a 3 door version that's not advertised on their brochure. Maybe special order?
I'll have to look for a plaque somewhere, for now I didn't see any.

Special order or not, this car is very unique and has a great look to it!

 

[Brad in Germany]

Quelle belle trouvaille! Yes, after a very quick look it does seem like it might be made by Paris-Tracteur. I guess you saw my early posting on a similar one with the horizontal split rear door.

Interesting.... several months ago a very similar (but not exactly the same) one of those surfaced in France, but with much more patina than yours. Here are a couple of photos of it:

Unfortunately the new owner of that one does not care what he has and decided to cut up the body and stripped it off the chassis and plans on making a Speedster out of just the chassis and he too will swap out the original AF engine for a more powerful A engine. Basically he just wanted the chassis.

There are quite a few manufacturers of similar bodies in France with the split rear opening door. The three doors is also interesting, but since most were one off orders, they could be customized to the customer's specifications. I'll need to study the rear door mechanism and the area around the windshield to better figure out who made it.....

Your wheels look to be standard Michelin disk wheels. Under the rust and paint, you should be able to find a little Michelin man stamped on the solid center part of the wheel on the outside, typically near the valve hole. The original Michelin hubcaps (the spare tire one is unique for the spare tire) are impossible to find so guard those carefully! Here's an advertisement (from Denmark) for your Michelin disk wheels:

As for your AF engine, the main unique AF parts besides the smaller pistons, head and head gasket are smaller jets in the carburetor, smaller throat size in the upper part of the carburetor, the carburetor filter should be stamped AF on the head of the bolt, the intake manifold is smaller diameter (usually with the RHD linkage nub) the ring and pinion gears in the rear-end, and the speedometer drive gear (on the transmission end of the torque tube). I have British and French Model A's both with AF engines in them.

Brad in Maryland

 

[john charlton]

The AF block was cast at Fords Cork Ireland plant they had a foundry as they built the Fordson tractor . The blocks were finished machined in Trafford Park Manchester there is archive footage of this you can see the small bore blocks on the rotating facing machine . These AF deliveries were built on the 114" WB an option in England and France /Germany . Hire car/taxis / laundelets were also built on this WB . If you put the 24 HP engine in you will have to change the rear axle ratio from 4.55 to 3.78 . There is a short jack shaft behind the gearbox .The AF head was stolen as back in the day as it bolts on the A block to give higher go faster compression .

John in Suffolk County England .

 

[HHR&R]

Thanks for the infos, I love deliveries, pickups and station wagons, sad to see a rare one go.

John, I know about the ring and pinion, fun story maybe 2 weeks before I found this car I sold my pickup rear end that was in very good shape. Had I known, I would have hold on to it. Then again I never thought I would buy another car. Thanks for the info, because not everybody knows this.

Speaking of rear ends on French Ford my AR pickup is a 16HP, those had the 3.3L engine but I believe they had a funky axle ratio to get to this HP rating, I couldn't see any marking on the rear end but when I counted the number of turns it came to somewhere a little over 3:70. I never seen any documentation on such a ratio.
From my research I found that the 16HP rating was only on commercial vehicles and not very common, I'm guessing to pay less taxes than the 19HP but with more power than the 12HP. My guess is it would be with the rear end ratio they would get that HP rating.



Brad, good info on the wheels, I was thinking Metric Michelin wheels from something else since they were a major supplier of wheels back then, but the 5 lugs was the thing I couldn't figure out what it could have came off of.

As soon as I can I'll post more detailed photos, right now it's stored at a friend's place and not easily accessible.

 

[Dave Mellor NJ]

I had a friend years ago who was always searching for a 3 door car. I'd never heard of it.

 

[German guy]

Really neat. Mine is a 1930 Tudor with three factory special order from the Berlin factory. Original owner was a baker who used the back door to install racks to deliver bread during the week and put the easily removable seats in for weekend jaunts. It sat in a barn for 47 years after the war before the son of the baker sold it off. Love the history!

 

[David in San Antonio]

The 3-door Model A body is new to me. Remarkable!

 

[mcgarrett]

I had a friend years ago who was always searching for a 3 door car. I'd never heard of it.

Hupmobile sold a 3 door sedan. I drove a 1925 Hupmobile 3 dr. Sedan on the set of the movie "Killers of the Flower Moon" when we were filming in 2021. It was was smooth, quiet, easy starting, and shifted effortlessly. I never found out who the owner was, be he had a very nice car. It had the normal 2 doors on the passenger side and a single door for the driver. Safety could possibly be the reason.

https://rmsothebys.com/auctions/mt20/lots/r0005-1925-hupmobile-model-r-1415-club-sedan/photos

 

[HHR&R]

Unfortunately the new owner of that one does not care what he has and decided to cut up the body and stripped it off the chassis and plans on making a Speedster out of just the chassis and he too will swap out the original AF engine for a more powerful A engine. Basically he just wanted the chassis.
Brad in Maryland

My pickup came with a Tudor body, I'm putting back a pickup body on it, I've been critisized for it, some people told me that pickups are not worth it and that tudor are better looking. In France without a title it's extremely difficult and very often impossible to register a car. Ford are not common and over here they are just another old car brand, there's not that huge fan base as in the US, so they're usualy cheaper than in the US.

The 3-door Model A body is new to me. Remarkable!

To me too, when I bought the car I had only 2 pictures from the left side, I was expecting to receive a delivery, not half a fordor. I didn't even know those existed. I'm happy about it.

 

[johnbuckley]

Really neat. Mine is a 1930 Tudor with three factory special order from the Berlin factory. Original owner was a baker who used the back door to install racks to deliver bread during the week and put the easily removable seats in for weekend jaunts. It sat in a barn for 47 years after the war before the son of the baker sold it off. Love the history!

Interesting. Could you post a picture of it please!

 

[Brad in Germany]

Interesting. Could you post a picture of it please!

Is it this one maybe? (Though this one is a 1928-1929.)

Brad in Maryland (USA)

 

[HHR&R]

Some detailed pictures:
The turn signals switch with the repeater light that was added most likely in the 50's at the same time they added those Citroën tail lights.
I have no clue what that other switch is for, it's connected to the turn signal switch.

I still have no clue what that hole is for but to me it seems factory made because the hole in the dash rail is slightly smaller than the shape in the aluminum molding. I thought about a spot light but there's no mounting hole for any screws but the wood was countersunked maybe for a nut?

The wiper motor

The chromed curved rear view mirror and behind a plaque with the name and address of the original owner that allowed me to track his family down. Maybe I'll get some infos from them.

The fancy interior light

The crank handles are Peugeot 201/301/401, the door handles Citroën B14, no clue about the pull handles.

I don't know the origin of the door latches, but I'm pretty sure I've seen them somewhere.

The outer door handles look like Ford roadster

But the driver side locks.

 

[Chuck Dempsey]

What a find! Please remind us where you are. France? Thanks for posting.

 

[Brad in Germany]

I still have no clue what that hole is for but to me it seems factory made because the hole in the dash rail is slightly smaller than the shape in the aluminum molding. I thought about a spot light but there's no mounting hole for any screws but the wood was counter sunk maybe for a nut?

The hole through your dash rail and lower windshield frame was most likely for a bulb horn. Such bulb horns were required, at the time, on commercial vehicles in France that were driven inside the city limits, as was required by the "Code de la Route".

Here you can see one mounted on this French Model AA truck (see the blue arrow):

The counter sinking of the hole through your dash rail aligns with the adjusting bolt on the upper throat of the horn that was used to secure the horn to the windshield frame.

Here is a photo of such a commercial vehicle bulb horn from France where you can see those mounting bolts (and washer) just in front of the bulb:

....and the holes in your dash area:

The left hand toggle switch on your dash rail is most likely used to turn on either the right or left "Jockey" turn signal light located on either side of your vehicle, on the upper part of the post between the side doors.

Those turn signals were added most likely in the late 1940's. Here is an era advertisement for those Jockey turn signal lights:

You say "It has a build date of 8/3/29 stamped on the gas tank." Note that all Ford Model A gas tanks were built in the USA and thus the date stamped on the firewall side of your gas tank follows the US date format of month/day/year.....so your gas tank is dated August 3, 1929. That however is not the assembly date of your vehicle, but rather just the date that your gas tank passed the factory air-pressure leak test. If you estimate the time needed to package and ship (via cargo ship) the tank to France, transport the shipment to Asnière and then assemble it into a chassis at Ford SAF and then send the chassis to the body manufacturer, put the body on the chassis, etc, etc....I would estimate that your vehicle was built at least two to three months after the date stamped on your gas tank.

Brad in Maryland




.

 

[castlenut]

What a beautiful, unusual car I'm glad it found the perfect owner!
Love this forum, so many knowledgeable people who contributed their experience. I've owned my 1929 roadster pickup since 1966 and found out
so many things that were unknown to me. Thanks

 

[HHR&R]

Thank you Brad, I didn't think at all about bulb horn since it's supposed to have the electric one, I didn't know about this part of the French law. To me bulb horns were on brass cars.


I moved that panel to see what's going on behind and wonder if it's only a power wire that goes from the first switch to the second and that that one feeds the wiper motor. Because it seems the wire goes to the ceramic junction block next to the wiper motor to which it is connected to.

Not that it matters for now since the whole wiring will need to go and there's more pressing matters on this car.



I knew about the tank date, on the subject of dates, during my research I have listed over 260 French model A and around 200 AA, between the engine build date and the first registration it could be as low as one month and as high as 1 year.

 

[HHR&R]

Since I have parts from my RPU that I won't be using and those are missing or need replacing on the delivery, I mounted them on it.

The rear fenders are hand made and not esthetically pleasing : there's no wire, no body line, no reinforcements or bracket, they are also more squarish and the bottom rear is very rounded, even though they are original to the car I replace them with good original Ford sedan ones. They requier just a little bit of modification to fit. This will be the only body modification I will do.

I'm also installing 2 Ford taillights without license plate light for better visibility because the original single taillight was below the car next to the plastic back lit license plate, I placed a flashlight behind the license plate to give you an idea of what it looks like. The taillights have now a 2 filament bulb at the bottom so I can have turn signals and they are separate from the brake lights.