Which motor is it?

Ken T

Ken T

Member
I'm new to flatheads and I've been reading and learning what I've got. The fire engine is a '41 and weighs 10k lbs. I'm assuming that the motor a 59AB because of the following. The carb has MODEL 59 stamped on it. It has a crab style distributor. The head on the driver side has 59 A-B and on the passenger A. The coolant outlet is centered on the head.

I've read that the 59 A-B was built in '46 to '48. This would mean that it's not original to the vehicle. Here, I learned that it has been rebuilt. I read on Vanpelt that the crab style distributor was on '42 to '45 motors. It doesn't have an oil filter.

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Ken T said:
I'm new to flatheads and I've been reading and learning what I've got. The fire engine is a '41 and weighs 10k lbs. I'm assuming that the motor a 59AB because of the following. The carb has MODEL 59 stamped on it. It has a crab style distributor. The head on the driver side has 59 A-B and on the passenger A. The coolant outlet is centered on the head.

I've read that the 59 A-B was built in '46 to '48. This would mean that it's not original to the vehicle. Here, I learned that it has been rebuilt. I read on Vanpelt that the crab style distributor was on '42 to '45 motors. It doesn't have an oil filter.

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You won't know until you either pull a head or look at the back of the block (top of the bell-housing). My guess is that it is an early engine - probably 221 cubic inches. This is a wild-*** guess, just from pondering the front of the block.
 
You probably already know that the heads are mismatched. The "A" heads came on pre-war 221 ci engines, while the 59A-B heads were used on post-war 239 ci engines. This indicates an engine that has been messed with, and most likely not in a good way,
 
My '40 fire engine chassis has a 95 hp Merc in it from the factory, even a 95 emblem on the hood. Newc
 
tubman said:
You probably already know that the heads are mismatched. The "A" heads came on pre-war 221 ci engines, while the 59A-B heads were used on post-war 239 ci engines. This indicates an engine that has been messed with, and most likely not in a good way,
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No I didn't know this. This is my first time undertaking on a project like this. Other than seeing them at car shows, Flatheads are new to me. I've just started trying to educate myself.
 
The only indication that I can see that it is possibly a ‘39-‘40 engine is the spacing between front timing cover and the block. It looks like the block may pass the “pencil” test. This means you could lay a pencil on it and it won’t roll off. If it’s a ‘41 engine, you could look for a “raised deck” on the intake surface…beneath the gasket. Unless the valve pockets were modified on the “A” head, it shouldn’t work on a 59A engine since I believe Ford changed the valve angle slightly, meaning the valves would hit the head. Unfortunately, the pictures and camera angles don’t give us enough to help you positively identify what you have. As someone previously mentioned, look at the top of the bell housing for a “59” if it’s a 59A engine.
 
You found the right place for your questions. Pop the heads off and see what you got . The more photos, the better
Welcome to the Fordbarn
 
None of the items you described can help to identify the year of the engine block. If you can see the top of the bell housing are any letters or numbers there? There was a slight change to the angle of the valves post war and the A head should not be used on the 59A unless it is modified. The 59A head can be used on the 41 engine. Look for a raised area to the engine block under the intake manifold pre 41 engines do not have the raised area. The arrangement of the coolant passages, on the deck of the engine block under the heads can help to identify.
 
Terry said:
None of the items you described can help to identify the year of the engine block. If you can see the top of the bell housing are any letters or numbers there? There was a slight change to the angle of the valves post war and the A head should not be used on the 59A unless it is modified. The 59A head can be used on the 41 engine. Look for a raised area to the engine block under the intake manifold pre 41 engines do not have the raised area. The arrangement of the coolant passages, on the deck of the engine block under the heads can help to identify.
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When I head back out to the desert, I'll look at the bell housing. It's funny, because I was told that it was mostly original. Not being familiar with these motors, I felt I shouldn't change anything unless I had to. Now that I know it's a frankenmotor, I'm feeling more apt to. First I have to get the rust out of the block.
 
Ken T said:
When I head back out to the desert, I'll look at the bell housing. It's funny, because I was told that it was mostly original. Not being familiar with these motors, I felt I shouldn't change anything unless I had to. Now that I know it's a frankenmotor, I'm feeling more apt to. First I have to get the rust out of the block.
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It is possible that the engine could be any of the ‘40 or ‘41 variations because fire engines were special built vehicles. Back in the day they used what they had on hand. It still could be original to the vehicle.
 
Tim Ayers said:
I'm thinking it's a governor. Probably to bring the idle up while the pumps are engaged.
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Are you guys referencing this? I was wondering the same. To rev the engine to work the pumps is a manual lever on the outside of the driver side. It attaches to linkage connected to the steering column that moves the gas pedal.

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I believe it is a governor as well, but I don't know if it has anything to do with the pump. I have had 3 "big truck" engines, a '56 331 hemi out of a dump truck, and two Seagraves (1948 and 1974). They all had governors located near the carb. The only one I got into deep enough to know was the '48 Seagrave and the governor on it had nothing to do with the pump. I think they were put on just about all big trucks to prevent over-speeding the engine when in "granny" low.
 
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